The Savage Curtain - Like it, love it or hate it?

[johnnybear]

I watch Savage Curtain just to see more of my Trek babe, Zora.

Maybe she had so much hair to cover her mushroom ears? I mean if she's from Tiburon then Dr.Sevrin was a male of the same species, right?
JB

 

[Phaser Two]

Of interest to virtually no one I'm sure, I never found Zora attractive and I'm not sure we were supposed to.

 

[Poltargyst]

Of interest to virtually no one I'm sure, I never found Zora attractive and I'm not sure we were supposed to.

Me neither, and I don't think we were supposed to, but hey, I'm not one to judge...

 

[Albertese]

I do like this episode. In fact, I just watched it last Sunday with my eight-year-old boy. Indeed, it's one of the handful of episodes I clearly remember watching as a six or seven year old myself.

--Alex

 

[MAGolding]

Maybe she had so much hair to cover her mushroom ears? I mean if she's from Tiburon then Dr.Sevrin was a male of the same species, right?
JB

Your are assuming that everyone on a planet must belong to a single species.

It is possible for a planet to have more than one species of intelligent beings at a single time. In fact, there is some degree of suspicion that many higher mammals on Earth have intelligence ranges that overlap with those of humans.

In an era of common interstellar flight, there is no reason to believe that everyone on a planet was born there or is a member of a native species.

And most of all, according to "The Way to Eden":

SPOCK: Many myths are based on truth, Captain, and they are not unintelligent. Their leader, Doctor Sevrin, is a man
KIRK: Doctor Sevrin is their leader?
SPOCK: Yes. A brilliant research engineer in the fields of acoustics, communications and electronics on Tiburon. He was dismissed from his post when he started this movement. Tong Rad inherits his father's extraordinary abilities in the field of space studies.

Doctor Sevrin is probably a native of Tiburon, but is merely said to have worked there.

in "The Savage Curtain":

ROCK: Captain, Mister Spock, some of these you may know through history. Genghis Khan, for one. And Colonel Green, who led a genocidal war early in the 21st century on Earth. Zora, who experimented with the body chemistry of subject tribes on Tiburon. Kahless the Unforgettable, the Klingon who set the pattern for his planet's tyrannies. We welcome the vessel Enterprise

The Rock describes the experimented on tribes as being on Tiburon. Maybe they were natives of Tiburn. Maybe they were brought to Tiburon to be experimented on. There is no statement of who Zora was and where she came from.

So it is possible that Dr. Sevrin and Zora were both members of one or two native intelligent species of Tiburon.

It is possible that Dr. Sevrin's species was native to Tiburon and Zora's was not.

It is possible that Zora's species was native to Tiburon and Dr. Sevrin's was not.

It is possible that Zora and Dr. Sevrin were both members of intelligent species not native to Tiburon.

Therefore there is no reason to assume that Zora and R. Sevrin belong to the same, highly sexually dimorphic, species.

 

[johnnybear]

Well I can appreciate your theory but I prefer the idea that she, Zora, is of the same species as Dr.Sevrin! It's not unheard of in science fiction stories that the women are particularly hairy in an alien race while the men are bald! The Silver Surfer for instance was bald even before Galactus came to his planet like all the males on his world but his girl friend, Shala Bal, had long black hair! Although Zora may have come from a much earlier time when the race had hair and no mushroom ears!
JB

 

[Steven P Bastien]

I like that episode. It would make my top 40 list of TOS. I think the evil characters were unconvincing, but that was the 1960s which tended not to air true barbarism.

 

[Phaser Two]

I like that episode. It would make my top 40 list of TOS. I think the evil characters were unconvincing, but that was the 1960s which tended not to air true barbarism.

Oh, I found Colonel Green quite convincingly evil. And Kahless, with those dead-on impressions, was a real hit at parties.

 

[johnnybear]

Kahless was not supposed to be evil, just a Klingon who united a divided people! But then Kirk wouldn't have known that!
JB

 

[FormerLurker]

Although Zora may have come from a much earlier time when the race had hair and no mushroom ears!

Zora' experiments may in fact be responsible for the baldness and the strange looking ears. She may have even intended for that to happen. Alas, we'll never know for sure.

 

[plynch]

Maybe Discovery will cover that.

 

[MAGolding]

It seems that Dr. Sevrin was a Tiburonian after all, since in DS9 "The Ship" a crewman named T'Lor who had the same type of ears was a Tiburonian.

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Tiburon

Johnnybear said:

Kahless was not supposed to be evil, just a Klingon who united a divided people! But then Kirk wouldn't have known that!

Kahless united a divided people so they could attack other people.

How did the rock being describe him?:

ROCK: Captain, Mister Spock, some of these you may know through history. Genghis Khan, for one. And Colonel Green, who led a genocidal war early in the 21st century on Earth. Zora, who experimented with the body chemistry of subject tribes on Tiburon. Kahless the Unforgettable, the Klingon who set the pattern for his planet's tyrannies. We welcome the vessel Enterprise

So it's "Kahless the Unforgettable, the Klingon who set the pattern for his planet's tyrannies." What do we know about Klingon tyrannies?

According to James T. Kirk, who is probably a bit biased but also apparently an eyewitness.

KIRK: Gentlemen, I have seen what the Klingons do to planets like yours. They are organised into vast slave labour camps. No freedoms whatsoever. Your goods will be confiscated. Hostages taken and killed, your leaders confined. You'd be far better off on a penal planet. Infinitely better off.

And what did Kor say:

KOR: Good honest hatred. Very refreshing. However, it makes no difference whether you welcome me or not. I am here and will stay. You are now subjects of the Klingon Empire. You'll find there are many rules and regulations. They will be posted. Violation of the smallest of them will be punished by death.

KOR: Have I asked whether or not you want it? We Klingons have a reputation for ruthlessness. You will find that it is deserved. Should one Klingon soldier be killed, a thousand Organians will die. I will have order. Is that clear?

KOR: From this day on, no public assemblages of more than three people. All publications to be cleared through this office. Neighbourhood controls will be established, hostages selected. A somewhat lengthy list of crimes against the state.

So Kahless the Unforgivable united the Klingons like Genghis Khan united the Mongols to massacre millions of people.

 

[Phaser Two]

Maybe Discovery will cover that.

Zora will mostly appear as a hologram, however, and will not be clearly evil at first glance, having designed the ever-so-cool invisible rank pips on the badges in her side gig as a costume designer. Later it's revealed that she's from a universe that is parallel to those parallel to ours, which can only be reached if everyone on the bridge ingests wheat grass. Oh, and she's Sarek's big sis.

 

[plynch]

He never mentioned he had one. Therefore he must have one.

Then when the writers get bored she'll fall in love with Odo.

 

[johnnybear]

Maybe Discovery will cover that.

But Discovery is another universe and timeline so what you see there is not necessarily what happened in TOS!
JB

 

[johnnybear]

Kahless probably united his people after his battles with Molar, who was described as a tyrant and gave them the idea that they must never be slaves or the weak again! A thinking that is not unheard of here on earth perhaps!
Plus Tiburon history we know very little of and maybe Zora caused the bald headed mushroom eared populations on her planet or they might be like that naturally anyway!
JB

 

[Phaser Two]

He never mentioned he had one. Therefore he must have one.

Then when the writers get bored she'll fall in love with Odo.

Black alert!

 

[Discofan]

Black alert!

What's that?

 

[Phaser Two]

What's that?

You may find that knowing is not so pleasing a thing as not knowing. It is not logical, but it is often true. And it sure as heck is in this case.

 

[Discofan]

You may find that knowing is not so pleasing a thing as not knowing. It is not logical, but it is often true. And it sure as heck is in this case.

Equivocation running amok...