Jennifer Lien in trouble again?

[BeatleJWOL]

Weak and irrational.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

I remember reading somewhere that Lien decided to leave acting due to anxiety and other mental health issues. I imagine that would have prevented her from working the convention circuit as well.

It's so sad that Lien didn't make something of voice acting. I loved her work on MIB: The Series.

 

[Delta1]

For those who wish to follow the case, go to https://roane.tncrtinfo.com/crCaseList.aspx and enter the party's name. Assuming this is the same Jennifer Lien:

Lien was arrested December 11 and released December 18 on a $2000 bond. Her next hearing is February 13. She has the same public defender and judge as before.

Assault may be a class A or class B misdemeanor. Class A carries a jail term of up to 11 months 29 days, a fine of $2500, or both. Class B carries a jail term of 6 months, a fine of $500, or both. If the victim was a law enforcement officer carrying out their duties, the fine may be $5000.

Penalties for DUI 1st are even more complex. Depending on her BAC, minimum jail time is 48 consecutive hours or 7 days. Maximum is 11 months 29 days. It looks like she has already served 7 days, so she might not get any additional time. But the minimum goes up to 30 days if there were kids in the car. Substance abuse treatment can be credited toward jail time.

I am not a lawyer, do not rely on me for legal advice, everyone is presumed innocent until proven guilty, etc.

 

[Triskelion]

Compassionate. Empathetic. Humane. Kind. Merciful. Reasonable. Wise.

Yes, all noble traits some have a monopoly on here, I'm sure. If some would only take the trouble to read all the past threads on the subject, which many of us have done - and contributed vastly to - they might learn that the forum is by and large very supportive of Lien and open-minded about her case - and that accusations of Schadenfreude are here not only undeserved and misplaced on this forum, they might even seem selfish and petty - for politicizing someone's personal tragedy in order to get on some kind of social-guilt soapbox, and blame the forum for discussing this news. Like anyone here should feel guilty for what she has allegedly done to herself and her community.

And I do note how ready some here are to sympathize with criminal behavior, and I applaud them in that. In that sympathy why not take a second or two to consider those who she put at risk, those human beings who also have a right to live free of drunk drivers (and other assorted meth-heads) on their tax-built roads. Or should we only sympathize with people who break the law, and not the others who do the hard work of living within the bounds of the social structure? Let me guess - nobody on this forum has family that was literally put in danger by Lien's alleged drunk driving (or others' meth-headed funding of organized crime).

I will add that up until this I was more than willing to give Lien the benefit of the doubt. But the moment she raised the glass to her own lips, got in that car drunk of her own accord, and turned the ignition with her own hand - a puppet of no one else at that moment - she rejected that dignity and became and alleged danger to the public safety. Again. Sigh. Jennifer, Jennifer.

Pending the results of the trial, - a right even she is due and will be given, especially by those of us here who count ourselves among her loyal fanbase - there may be more than one fan who is ready, willing and able to change his or her opinion of Lien's prospects. She had a second chance - and a third. Let her threaten her own life, but she has no right to take anyone else to the morgue with her. Everyone deserves a second chance. Well she got one and allegedly, may have spit in its eye. Of course, we'll wait until (her third?) trial to form an opinion. Just don't expect some of us not to use our eyes in noticing her story unfold in photographs.

Oh and $2000 bail - will her family let this one float as they did the last one? Now why might that be? Is that really such a lot of money? You might even remember some fans here, on this very forum, were willing to entertain the idea of going Lien's bail themselves. I can't speak for others but for some of us, in our decisions NOT to at least offer - it was to let the State have a good long look at her - for her own benefit. But what do we know about sympathy here, compared with others here to enlighten us.

Do your damned homework.

 

[Amaris]

Yes, all noble traits some have a monopoly on here, I'm sure. If some would only take the trouble to read all the past threads on the subject, which many of us have done - and contributed vastly to - they might learn that the forum is by and large very supportive of Lien and open-minded about her case - and that accusations of Schadenfreudeare here not only undeserved and misplaced on this forum, they might even seem selfish and petty - for politicizing someone's personal tragedy in order to get on some kind of social-guilt soapbox, and blame the forum for discussing this news. Like anyone here should feel guilty for what she has allegedly done to herself and her community.

And I do note how ready some here are to sympathize with criminal behavior, and I applaud them in that. In that sympathy why not take a second or two to consider those who she put at risk, those human beings who also have a right to live free of drunk drivers (and other assorted meth-heads) on their tax-built roads. Or should we only sympathize with people who break the law, and not the others who do the hard work of living within the bounds of the social structure? Let me guess - nobody on this forum has family that was literally put in danger by Lien's alleged drunk driving (or others' meth-headed funding of organized crime).

I will add that up until this I was more than willing to give Lien the benefit of the doubt. But the moment she raised the glass to her own lips, got in that car drunk of her own accord, and turned the ignition with her own hand - a puppet of no one else at that moment - she rejected that dignity and became and alleged danger to the public safety. Again. Sigh. Jennifer, Jennifer.

Pending the results of the trial, - a right even she is due and will be given, especially by those of us here who count ourselves among her loyal fanbase - there may be more than one fan who is ready, willing and able to change his or her opinion of Lien's prospects. She had a second chance - and a third. Let her threaten her own life, but she has no right to take anyone else to the morgue with her. Everyone deserves a second chance. Well she got one and allegedly, may have spit in its eye. Of course, we'll wait until (her third?) trial to form an opinion. Just don't expect some of us not to use our eyes in noticing her story unfold in photographs.

Oh and $2000 bail - will her family let this one float as they did the last one? Now why might that be? Is that really such a lot of money? You might even remember some fans here, on this very forum, were willing to entertain the idea of going Lien's bail themselves. I can't speak for others but for some of us, in our decisions NOT to at least offer - it was to let the State have a good long look at her - for her own benefit. But what do we know about sympathy here, compared with others here to enlighten us.

Do your damned homework.

Someday you may understand. Until then, should you find yourself in a place where you cannot see the way out, know that you are loved, and that there are people who would not wish you to suffer.

 

[Triskelion]

Well I read somewhere once not to cast my pearls before the swine only to be trampled to death for my trouble. I bet whoever said that had a thing or two to learn about magnanimity from a Star Trek bbs, eh?

 

[mos6507]

Well, I disagree. I think the whole idea of making someone's misdemeanors public record for everyone to see and point the finger is pretty fucked up.

Then how do you feel about #MeToo?

 

[Amaris]

Well I read somewhere once not to cast my pearls before the swine only to be trampled to death for my trouble. I bet whoever said that had a thing or two to learn about magnanimity from a Star Trek bbs, eh?

It depends upon whom you consider swine, I'd imagine. That said, the U.S. justice system is barbaric, and needs a serious overhaul.

 

[Lynx]

As a longtime fan of Kes and Lien I really feel sorry for Jennifer Lien and I'm sad and upset over what has happened to her. I pray and hope that she can get her life back in order again.

But I have to come up with a statement here:

I will never, ever under any circumstances accept drunk driving or any other driving under the influence!

Never!

That's a principle I won't back down from, no matter who is committing the crime. If I did so, I wouldn't be able to look myself in the mirror with any pride again.

People who are driving under the influence should not have a driving license. If they drive without a driving licence, then they should be detained somewhere where they have no chance to steal or borrow a car.

I've seen enough of accidents with people being killed, disabled or had family members, relatives and friends being killed or disabled because some moron can't stay away from a car when drunk or stoned.

Now I stated that!

Amaris wrote:

It depends upon whom you consider swine, I'd imagine. That said, the U.S. justice system is barbaric, and needs a serious overhaul.

Perhaps.

But where I live it's the opposite. Here those in charge have been cuddling all sorts of criminals for years and it had led to a constant increase of crime, drug abuse and crazy behavior and no respect at all for other people and law itself because many of those who commit those crimes know that they will get away with it without serious punishment or any punishment at all.

 

[Amaris]

As a longtime fan of Kes and Lien I really feel sorry for Jennifer Lien and I'm sad and upset over what has happened to her. I pray and hope that she can get her life back in order again.

But I have to come up with a statement here:

I will never, ever under any circumstances accept drunk driving or any other driving under the influence!

Never!

That's a principle I won't back down from, no matter who is committing the crime. If I did so, I wouldn't be able to look myself in the mirror with any pride again.

People who are driving under the influence should not have a driving license. If they drive without a driving licence, then they should be detained somewhere where they have no chance to steal or borrow a car.

I've seen enough of accidents with people being killed, disabled or had family members, relatives and friends being killed or disabled because some moron can't stay away from a car when drunk or stoned.

Now I stated that!

Amaris wrote:


Perhaps.

But where I live it's the opposite. Here those in charge have been cuddling all sorts of criminals for years and it had led to a constant increase of crime, drug abuse and crazy behavior and no respect at all for other people and law itself because many of those who commit those crimes know that they will get away with it without serious punishment or any punishment at all.

That doesn't change that the United States almost revels in its system, and there's no maybe to it. We advocate for-profit prisons, zero tolerance policies, a prosecution system that aims for 100% conviction rates (that's regardless of innocence or guilt), and a media that capitalizes off of the mob mentality, which leads to the issue of art imitating life imitating art by what those people see on television: the same people who may one day be on a jury holding another person's life in their hands. There's a point of pride in being "tough on crime" until the point is reached that any compassion is seen as "soft," and is derided as immoral and wrong. Legality does not equate to morality.

In a case like Jennifer's, she needs professional help, not imprisonment. She needs guidance, not to be locked away in a cell, and punished over and over again. The U.S. system is not based on justice, but on a desire for revenge, one sanctioned by the State. The United States has an abhorrent record on how it treats those with mental illness, and stigmatizes those who suffer from it. Oh, the pharmaceutical industry will sell you a pill, but the justice system will just issue you a cell and let you rot.

When you are in your darkest moments, you need compassion, empathy, someone willing to reach down and help you stand up again, not people spitting in your face. That solves nothing. In short, I'd rather a guilty person go free, than an innocent one lose their freedom.

 

[Lynx]

That doesn't change that the United States almost revels in its system, and there's no maybe to it. We advocate for-profit prisons, zero tolerance policies, a prosecution system that aims for 100% conviction rates (that's regardless of innocence or guilt), and a media that capitalizes off of the mob mentality, which leads to the issue of art imitating life imitating art by what those people see on television: the same people who may one day be on a jury holding another person's life in their hands. There's a point of pride in being "tough on crime" until the point is reached that any compassion is seen as "soft," and is derided as immoral and wrong. Legality does not equate to morality.

In a case like Jennifer's, she needs professional help, not imprisonment. She needs guidance, not to be locked away in a cell, and punished over and over again. The U.S. system is not based on justice, but on a desire for revenge, one sanctioned by the State. The United States has an abhorrent record on how it treats those with mental illness, and stigmatizes those who suffer from it. Oh, the pharmaceutical industry will sell you a pill, but the justice system will just issue you a cell and let you rot.

When you are in your darkest moments, you need compassion, empathy, someone willing to reach down and help you stand up again, not people spitting in your face. That solves nothing. In short, I'd rather a guilty person go free, than an innocent one lose their freedom.

I totally agree about professional help and I really hope that she'll gets it before it's too late.

But DIU can never be accepted or allowed.

 

[Amaris]

I totally agree about professional help and I really hope that she'll gets it before it's too late.

But DIU can never be accepted or allowed.

Accepted or allowed in what instance, though? Take someone's license? Certainly, that is a reasonable response to someone driving under the influence. I believe from that point they should receive help, because if one is committing multiple DUIs, then there is a significant underlying problem. Once they've shown they're no longer susceptible to committing DUIs, reissue their license. A justice system should be rehabilitative.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

If people continue to drink drive it becomes necessary to physically keep them off the road. I knew someone who lost their license for a year, did not stop driving even one day of it. At what point, how many DUI's, what level BAC, was there an accident already, all that can be debated as to when a person is physically prevented via incarceration from driving.

We have a oddly sympathetic view towards DUI's as being something easy to get, as long as you weren't totally shit faced well.. do your no-drive time blah blah.. this is unrealistic. Your car is potentially a WEAPON of your moods, drive off angry and drunk and you're lashing out with your car. One third of traffic related deaths in the US are caused by drink driving, and that's deaths. Not the endless maiming and life changing and destroying disabilities.

I would like people to recoil with the horror and repugnance we do at a pregnant woman drinking when we hear of people driving under the influence. That's not where we're at unfortunately as a society. It is not the level of taboo it should be and so we worry about people losing their license because there's no public transport, we tell friends the booze bus is out tonight so they should maybe not get in the car because of how losing their license will impact them. Society has chosen to have a completely unrealistic relationship between recreational substances and driving cars.

 

[Triskelion]

Fool me once....


LOL now it's the system on trial.

 

[Amaris]

Fool me once....


LOL now it's the system on trial.

The system is deeply flawed, petty, unbalanced, unjust, and oppressive. It would be best to eliminate it entirely as it is.

 

[Triskelion]

Well here is some insight you may freely ignore:

Break the law, go to jail. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Or, You know, leave the country. It ain't North Korea.

Too late to help Lien with this advice, I'm afraid.

 

[Amaris]

Well here is some insight you may freely ignore:

Break the law, go to jail. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Or, You know, leave the country. It ain't North Korea.

Too late to help Lien with this advice, I'm afraid.

I'd rather change the law, which is well within my power as a United States citizen. See, I understand basic Civics, too.
All of that said, I'd rather Jennifer get the help she need, rather than a jail sentence.

 

[Triskelion]

I'm sure everyone is better informed from that civics lesson. Maybe your energy would be better spent enlightening lawmakers then. Because I hate to tell you this, but Lien knew all about jail and DUI's - and put her own butt away again anyway. (Sorry to keep bringing the thread spotlight back to Lien).

Also, kudos on that forum thread restraint. I learned a lot.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

The biggest shame about this is, she was very talented. I'll imagine she still is, I am not an actor but it doesn't seem like something you stop being good at.

But, anxiety and things like that can keep people from doing a wide array of things. I do wish she coulda kept at it but she has to do what's best for her.

Yeah she was arrested but, I dunno doesn't really seem like that big a deal. It's hard for our cast to get Trek actors to talk about Trek, we've had an easier time getting them on talking about other projects, but the one actress I've wanted to talk to about Voyager has been her. She IMO was the best actress on that show, there was something very seamless and natural about her performance that I've always wanted to ask her about.

And, considering how that went down, she is the exact person that if I met, I would just avoid talking about it at all. Just seems like a rough thing to bring up for no reason.

 

[Amaris]

I'm sure everyone is better informed from that civics lesson. Maybe your energy would be better spent enlightening lawmakers then. Because I hate to tell you this, but Lien knew all about jail and DUI's - and put her own butt away again anyway. (Sorry to keep bringing the thread spotlight back to Lien).

And I find that kind of careless, callous dismissal of someone's mental health state to be part of the problem with our legal system. Instead of dealing with the habitual offense by getting to the root of the issue, "toss her in a cell" seems to be the best they can come up with, or care to, anyway.

Also, kudos on that forum thread restraint. I learned a lot.

You can cut the sarcasm.