Canon may not be violated if the simulation is only optical and not physical. It could just be holographic. We did not see any physical contact with the Klingons, just phaser blasting. Nor did we see collisions with walls, etc. But of course we didn't see holographic simulations in TOS either, and Discovery is supposed to be ten years before TOS. But if STD only had TOS tech, we'd all be bored. I'd rather have things like holographic displays, than primitive TOS displays, and "bend" canon a bit, or just attribute it to some kind of parallel universe reboot. Also, the USS Discovery is an experimental ship, so we could say that NCC 1701 might not incorporate all of the tech of the USS Discovery. Canon is a mater of linear timeline events. With Star Trek constantly featuring time travel and alternative universes, maybe we should afford some time-bending flexibility to the sacred canon concept?
Spoilers Tech issue with 1x06
- Thread starter RobertCardassian
- Start date
But still, if CBS had a major problem with this they'd already have someone fix it. Anyway, we've gone quite off topic from the original point of the thread.
And when the Klingons were hit, they blinked out of existence like an image from a video game.
From what Ted Sullivan said on Twitter, he was saying that it was a holographic generator, not a full holodeck. He also acknowledged the technology not being there yet for a full holodeck.
Not sure how to parse that out...
Not sure how to parse that out...
Discovery's battle simulator projects holograms you can shoot. 24th century holodecks project holograms you can f***. I think that's the key difference.
Hmmm...now I get it!
That's a fair point. As you previously pointed out the startrek.com site is a mess. But really, the TAS discussion isn't relevant for arguing that Discovery's sim room isn't contradicting established canon.Actually they spelled "official" wrong too, think about that one
Following up on this seemingly-more positive line of communication, just think of DSC's simulator as the fancy cutting-edge experimental military version of this simple arcade game from STIII...That's more the spirit!
If it makes you feel any better, the same Harry Kim who made the statement about no holodecks or replicators in the 2290s based on what he learned in his Starfleet History class at the Academy (this discussion makes me imagine an instructor's patience being tried in meticulously and repeatedly attempting to explain to Cadet Kim exactly why protein resequencers are not true replicators and holographic combat simulators are not true holodecks, ultimately needing to refer him to the Engineering department for further details) also enjoyed "holostories" as a child per "Once Upon A Time" (VGR). That wouldn't have been the 23rd century, of course, but more than a decade before TNG. Holotech seems to have been in common use in children's toys and games by then. Why not adult toys and games, even before that?
...in an era a hundred years after the cutting-edge military version already looked like this:
Let me throw you a bone and pretend TAS isn't canon. In fact let's go ahead and pretend it never happened either. It changes nothing. What matters is the proto-holodeck of DSC and TAS could have happened, so there is nothing wrong with being told that it did.
But as always, the only authority you listen to is yourself, not the shows or producers themselves, for some reason. I still don't know what criteria is needed to satisfy your judgement of canon; it seems totally arbitrary.
We can speculate about what makes the holodeck inferior to the ones in the future in order to establish continuity, while we've only been shown 6 episodes. But don't you think discovery will contradict those excuses in due time?
Let me throw you a bone and pretend TAS isn't canon. In fact let's go ahead and pretend it never happened either. It changes nothing. What matters is the proto-holodeck of DSC and TAS could have happened, so there is nothing wrong with being told that it did.
But as always, the only authority you listen to is yourself, not the shows or producers themselves, for some reason. I still don't know what criteria is needed to satisfy your judgement of canon; it seems totally arbitrary.
Maybe all of Star Trek is fictional and part of Benny Russell's story. Contradictions are permitted because it's established in canon that it's all made up.
No I don't. The Discovery creators have said (at one point) that the seeming canon violations will be cleared up eventually (or s omething along the lines) so no, I don't think those "excuses" will be contradicted. And even if so, we can always rationalize them until it does fit. We are Star Trek fans. That's what we do. (Unless we don't like the property, then we decry it as non-canon.)
Thanks for proving my previous point
I like the inclusion of the sim room in DSC. The fact that this (and the holo-com technology) have been around for longer than we thought but in an inferior state really adds to the Trek universe IMO. The video Philip Guyott linked to illustrates that quite nicely.
Which brings up another point... just because more "advanced" versions of a thing exist, doesn't mean it has to be used for everything. Two hundred years after that shooting range is developed in ENT, they're still using it on the Enterprise, even though we all knew they had the fully fledged holodeck at that point.Following up on this seemingly-more positive line of communication, just think of DSC's simulator as the fancy cutting-edge experimental military version of this simple arcade game from STIII...
...in an era a hundred years after the cutting-edge military version already looked like this:
Sometimes, simple does the job. Different people have different preferences. Picard likes the classic target range, Lorca likes to play with a Klingon scene. Kirk likes solid displays, Georgiou likes flickery telepresence. Picard played with holo-displays in his conference room and got sick of that too, apparently. Heck, I have a VR headset on my desk, and I've barely picked it up since the week I got it.
Given the fact that a writer / co-executive has made exactly the same points:
"Shooting @shazad @jasonsfolly shooting Klingons. Holographic ones (NOT holodeck ones! Tech develops over time in stages) #StarTrekDiscovery"
https://twitter.com/karterhol/status/922616677161771008
...and the fact that DSC so far has been meticulously planned out to a degree that is unprecedented for a Star Trek show, no, I don't expect it will.
But I do predict that you will continue complaining regardless.
I'm not actually sure either of these claims are really true?
No doubt, Starfleet holographic technology was improved in the years following TOS by reverse-engineering whatever could be salvaged from the ghost planet in That Which Survives.
Is not the internet of today the direct descendant of the ARPANET developed by the Department of Defense?
Kor
Is not the internet of today the direct descendant of the ARPANET developed by the Department of Defense?
Kor
According to wikipedia the cell phones as communication on German military trains goes back to 1918 and is among the earliest usages of mobile phones (but they were shortly after also used on civilian trains). Not sure about the internet.
you should have googled ithttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_phone#History
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Internet
Similar threads
