Will The Borg be back?

[Kaelef]

This whole "intelligent sci-fi" criticism about Trek movies doesn't make sense to me. Because how well-received or financially successful a Trek movie is has nothing to do with how the film's IQ is perceived. And that's important -- it's all about perception. TMP is considered a "cerebral" movie (and I do think it has interesting ideas) and it was a bomb. First Contact, on the other hand, is beloved by most fans and was very financially successful but it has as much action as Die Hard and not a brain cell in its head. It's a dumb but thoroughly entertaining action movie. So this whole "Kelvin movies aren't thinky enough" criticism just doesn't hold water for me.

Agreed that success is not tied to the intelligence of the film. That doesn't mean there aren't a lot of us that would love to see more of a lean towards intelligence in the scripts. But there's no reason a film can't be both intelligent and successful... it just takes more effort to pull off.

And TMP was not a bomb at all - I'm surprised this idea persists even here. It was the 5th-highest grossing film of 1979. It was nominated for three Academy Awards. Adjusted for inflation, it is the second-most successful film in the franchise (see http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=startrek.htm), second only to the 2009 reboot. First Contact is down at number 7.

It just didn't do as well as post-Star Wars Paramount had hoped/expected.

If we were to simply correlate perceived intelligence of a film with its financial success (which would be foolish), then TMP's success suggests that a return to "harder" sci-fi would be the way forward.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

Agreed that success is not tied to the intelligence of the film. That doesn't mean there aren't a lot of us that would love to see more of a lean towards intelligence in the scripts. But there's no reason a film can't be both intelligent and successful... it just takes more effort to pull off.

And TMP was not a bomb at all - I'm surprised this idea persists even here. It was the 5th-highest grossing film of 1979. It was nominated for three Academy Awards. Adjusted for inflation, it is the second-most successful film in the franchise (see http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=startrek.htm), second only to the 2009 reboot. First Contact is down at number 7.

It just didn't do as well as post-Star Wars Paramount had hoped/expected.

If we were to simply correlate perceived intelligence of a film with its financial success (which would be foolish), then TMP's success suggests that a return to "harder" sci-fi would be the way forward.

Fair point, fair point.

I do prefer when my Trek movies have something to say. Which is why I really like STID. *ducks*

 

[Balok's Decoy]

It just didn't do as well as post-Star Wars Paramount had hoped/expected.

*cough* Star Trek Beyond *cough*

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

But for once, let the antagonistic element not be a person villain - some device, ideology, event, or creature instead. And maybe let the person who differs in opinion with the heroes be capable of changing.

 

[Kaelef]

*cough* Star Trek Beyond *cough*

THIS HAS ALL HAPPENED BEFORE AND IT WILL HAPPEN AGAIN

 

[fireproof78]

Fair point, fair point.

I do prefer when my Trek movies have something to say. Which is why I really like STID. *ducks*

Go, I'll cover you.

Also, to your point, TMP went over budget, which contributed to the myth of it "bombing." It didn't, but money definitely was an issue, hence TWOK's slashed budget, and GR's reduced role.

 

[Kaelef]

Go, I'll cover you.

Also, to your point, TMP went over budget, which contributed to the myth of it "bombing." It didn't, but money definitely was an issue, hence TWOK's slashed budget, and GR's reduced role.

Plus, so much of the investment that went into the creation of TMP - everything from research and design to actual models, costumes, and visual effects - were used over and over again in the subsequent films and TV series. Taking that into account, TMP has got to be one of the soundest financial investments Paramount ever made.

 

[fireproof78]

Plus, so much of the investment that went into the creation of TMP - everything from research and design to actual models, costumes, and visual effects - were used over and over again in the subsequent films and TV series. Taking that into account, TMP has got to be one of the soundest financial investments Paramount ever made.

Certainly, and they can see that now. They certainly couldn't see that then. It was just a project that went overbudget.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

Fair point, fair point.

I do prefer when my Trek movies have something to say. Which is why I really like STID. *ducks*

I've got your six, buddy, no need to worry.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

ONE way to bring the Borg to this continuity is to adapt the IDW comic book that featured the Borg: Star Trek: Boldly Go #3

 

[Amaris]

I would be happy never to see the Borg ever again.

 

[φ of π]

If the Borg were ever portrayed sensibly, the movie would be about 10 minutes long and be the last Star Trek movie ever.

 

[Kaelef]

The problem with the Borg is that they simply pose as good technical adversaries for the Federation and provide for action/fighting/shooting type stories. These are fun, of course, but the Borg don't lend themselves to the more thought-provoking side of Star Trek.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

I would be happy never to see the Borg ever again.

But you may have to get them in order for the next movie to be a success. because try as you and others might to say that Star Trek is like hard science sci-fi, its isn't; it's space opera, and its stories when told on the big screen have to move at the speed of a movie and not a TV show.

Plus, the story I posted a link to and a picture of is very good and brings the Borg to this continuity in a way that's fresh and that works for this continuity.

 

[Amaris]

But you may have to get them in order for the next movie to be a success. because try as you and others might to say that Star Trek is like hard science sci-fi, its isn't; it's space opera, and its stories when told on the big screen have to move at the speed of a movie and not a TV show.

Plus, the story I posted a link to and a picture of is very good and brings the Borg to this continuity in a way that's fresh and that works for this continuity.

For me, there is no fresh Borg story. I am Borged out. I used to like the Borg concept, back during TNG, but now? If I never see another one again, it will be too soon.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

^If you're 'Borged out', as you put it, then you don't need to see the next movie if the Borg are going to be in it, then, or see Star Trek at all.

 

[Amaris]

^If you're 'Borged out', as you put it, then you don't need to see the next movie if the Borg are going to be in it, then, or see Star Trek at all.

Or, I can see whatever the fuck I want, and you don't have to like it.

 

[F. King Daniel]

If the Borg were ever portrayed sensibly, the movie would be about 10 minutes long and be the last Star Trek movie ever.

Well that would certainly help them to save money

 

[Visitor1982]

Borg could be fun... Borg, whales and Dr. Pulaski.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I would imagine a standard Borg Cube would be the size of a planet then