The aircraft Capt. Trevor boards in Wonder Woman is, I belive, just a normal WW1 bomber plane, and nothing special or out-of-the-ordinary.
Spoilers Wonder Woman - Grading & Discussion
- Thread starter Commander Richard
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I've had some time to reflect on the movie.
One thing I saw that I hope is a way forward in stories like this is the idea that it is possible to tell a story about someone like Diana without putting men down. The men were a bit blown away by Diana at first but then almost immediately fell in line. They men weren't cliches cave men who couldn't accept a capable woman. They just moved ahead and got the job down, working together as a team. Refreshing. I get tired of the angst and arguments. It's time to move on from that. An example of this on TV is Madame Secretary. There is no 'why is a woman doing this job'. None. Her husband is not threatened by her job, is happy to be known as the husband of the secretary of state (although he has his own thing going on and his own storylines).Her having the more powerful job is not treated as anything special, no more than if he had the more powerful job. That's what we need to see more of.
It also seems to me that Gal's pretty smile and overall presence was 'male gaze' enough without having to resort to camera tricks lingering over certain parts of her anatomy. I have mixed feelings about the 'above average' Steve Trevor scene. It was played for laughs...but at the same time wasn't needed but couldn't help wonder if there was a little bit of 'take that and see how you like it' from the director (who happened to be female) but I immediately mentally slap myself so I can remember that she is a professional but whatever...in the end it worked.
Wonder Woman has always been a woman, not a pseudo-man. Her compassion and empathy (and of course men can show compassion and empathy!) are shown to be strengths just like her ability to pick up a building. Her awwing over a baby...is an example of that. She's a woman and some women like to aww over babies. (and no, not all women aww over babies and sometimes men aww over babies) but I hope you can understand what I'm getting at. She doesn't have to pretend to be a man to be strong and capable.
One thing I saw that I hope is a way forward in stories like this is the idea that it is possible to tell a story about someone like Diana without putting men down. The men were a bit blown away by Diana at first but then almost immediately fell in line. They men weren't cliches cave men who couldn't accept a capable woman. They just moved ahead and got the job down, working together as a team. Refreshing. I get tired of the angst and arguments. It's time to move on from that. An example of this on TV is Madame Secretary. There is no 'why is a woman doing this job'. None. Her husband is not threatened by her job, is happy to be known as the husband of the secretary of state (although he has his own thing going on and his own storylines).Her having the more powerful job is not treated as anything special, no more than if he had the more powerful job. That's what we need to see more of.
It also seems to me that Gal's pretty smile and overall presence was 'male gaze' enough without having to resort to camera tricks lingering over certain parts of her anatomy. I have mixed feelings about the 'above average' Steve Trevor scene. It was played for laughs...but at the same time wasn't needed but couldn't help wonder if there was a little bit of 'take that and see how you like it' from the director (who happened to be female) but I immediately mentally slap myself so I can remember that she is a professional but whatever...in the end it worked.
Wonder Woman has always been a woman, not a pseudo-man. Her compassion and empathy (and of course men can show compassion and empathy!) are shown to be strengths just like her ability to pick up a building. Her awwing over a baby...is an example of that. She's a woman and some women like to aww over babies. (and no, not all women aww over babies and sometimes men aww over babies) but I hope you can understand what I'm getting at. She doesn't have to pretend to be a man to be strong and capable.
I am far from on expert on the history of aircraft but I am fairly certain no planes like that existed during the real WWI. Nothing that big or had that many engines would be used until the Second World War. Aircraft was still in its early development and limited to small one man fighters. What we saw in the film was a retro futuristic design. A more advanced craft using materials and designs of its time.
Agreed, Dick Whitman. I'm a bit familiar with WW1 aircraft, and the Wonder Woman plane looks more advanced than say, the Rumpler 6B, or Zeppelin Staaken-R series used in the war. Its not uncommon for fantasy films set in the early 20th century to (as you pointed out) create retro-futuristic designs of vehicles, structures or devices, as seen in The Rocketeer, Captain America: The First Avenger, and now Wonder Woman.
We are dealing with magic here, especially if they bring in the witch Circe, who is one of Diana's biggest enemies in the comics, so a resurrection wouldn't be that hard. In these kinds of stories all they would need is a tiny bit of him like a hair or something, or possibly even something that belonged to him, like the watch. There would also be plenty of interesting conflict for Diana if the resurrected Steve was used against her.
And when we already have things like aliens, gods, cyborgs, and men who breath underwater, I don't think a resurrection is going to do that much damage to the universe's plausibility.
A
This is probably the overall most entertaining DCEU film to date. They didn't just make a good Superhero movie; they made a good and entertaining movie in general. Both the Diana Prince/Wonder Woman and Steve Trevor characters were well done, and the film was just plain entertaining with a good mix of character moments, humor, drama and action.
WAY better then the garbage script (that made little sense) that was Suicide Squad; or the overly melodramatic Dawn of Justice (Batman V. Superman). Finally a DCEU film I really enjoyed.
This is probably the overall most entertaining DCEU film to date. They didn't just make a good Superhero movie; they made a good and entertaining movie in general. Both the Diana Prince/Wonder Woman and Steve Trevor characters were well done, and the film was just plain entertaining with a good mix of character moments, humor, drama and action.
WAY better then the garbage script (that made little sense) that was Suicide Squad; or the overly melodramatic Dawn of Justice (Batman V. Superman). Finally a DCEU film I really enjoyed.
I didn't say anything about Steve being resurrected damaging the plausibility of the universe; what I was talking about is the idea that resurrecting him would completely undermine and damage Diana's character journey and individual narrative arc, and the fact that there is nothing from which he could be revived in terms of DNA due to the fact that his body was totally incinerated and that any DNA that existed on the watch he gave Diana would long since have been rendered either nonexistent through Diana herself using said watch or non-usable due to the passage of time.
It is interesting we never really did gratuitous cheesecake shots of Gadot. Just "cinematic" ones of her body, notably when coming out of the trench. As for the "above average" scene, it was funny. Keep in mind it's the first "one" she's ever seen.
I would have liked more time on PI too, and if I understand some BTS info correctly thousands of years pass between Diana's "birth" and the events of the story once Steve arrives.
I would have liked more time on PI too, and if I understand some BTS info correctly thousands of years pass between Diana's "birth" and the events of the story once Steve arrives.
BvS was shot in 2014, and WW in late2015/early2016.
She did shoot WW and JL back to back.
DNA doesn't matter when it comes to magic. Sometimes all you need is something connected that person, and if we do have an Underworld then that makes it even easier since all you need to do is find their soul back. As for his body, if there was even a tiny bit of him left that could be enough, and really since we're dealing with magic and not science, or even "science", you might be able to get away with just having a visual reference like the picture.
As for it damaging Diana's character, I disagree since she would still go through the loss, and all of the development. Bringing him back could still be interesting since we'd see her having to deal with him being back after over a century, and he'd have to deal with how she's changed. Bringing him back as a tool of her enemy would then bring in the conflict of him being alive, but now he's her enemy. My only hesitation with bring him back as her enemy is that would be to similar to Captain America and Bucky in the MCU.
I think there's plenty of ways you could bring Steve back without totally undermining the end of this movie.
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Thoroughly enjoyed it. Both Gadot and Pine added emotional vulnerability to what could otherwise have been very cardboard characters. I confess I did squeee when Etta popped up and the amazons were awesome.
I preferred ww early on in the movie when she is still learning her abilities. I always find mid- to low- powered heroes to be more fun. It's why I struggle to see the point of Superman or the Flash. Epic CGI battles are not as fun as a good old fist fight to me.
I preferred ww early on in the movie when she is still learning her abilities. I always find mid- to low- powered heroes to be more fun. It's why I struggle to see the point of Superman or the Flash. Epic CGI battles are not as fun as a good old fist fight to me.
Exactly so.
Saying "oh they can do it like this..." completely misses the point.
Yep. Leave Trevor dead.
Seeing Wonder Woman made me want to re-watch BvS again. Much better the second time around without all the hype and expectations. The special effects at the end with the battle vs Doomsday are great. I think what diminished BvS was the Lex Luthor portrayal being too weak.
I just got back from seeing WW, and it was great. A really good story, good action, very good humor (it hit the right balance of how much there was and when it was, and the crowd in the theater genuinely laughed at basically every joke), and a very good cast. I was critical of Gadot's casting way back when she was cast for BvS, but I was so wrong. She was amazing in this movie, and Chris Pine was great. Wonder Woman and Steve Trevor as characters were also great. its nice to see a hopeful hero, she's such a good contrast to what we've seen from the DCEU before and was written so well. Trevor worked very well in his roll in the story, and I like how their romance was handled.
I rated the movie an A
Its held back a little bit by the weak villains and a few too many scenes in the dark, but besides that I don't really have anything to complain about. I ended up paying for myself, my dad and my brother to go because neither of them were that interested (they both disliked Man of Steel, the last DC movie they watched, a lot and my Dad is only a very casual fan of this type of movie) but my brother liked it and my Dad really liked it, saying its the best movie we'd seen since TFA.
One thing I'm a bit worried about for a sequel is if people who are won over by WW but are more casual fans of this stuff (like my Dad) go to Justice League because she's in it, but get turned off by it being another Snyder movie and that makes some people completely skip WW 2. It really sucks that we're getting another Snyder movie right after this. But, hopefully people who consider WW the first good DCEU movie will still see WW 2 regardless of how JL turns out.
This movie deserves to make a lot of money. I hope it kicks ass at the box office, and this leads to WB turning the DCEU around. Not by making it the MCU, but by taking Snyder out of the franchise's driver seat (which seems to be happening). I'm definitely a lot more hopeful that stuff like Flash, Cyborg, etc could be great movies because now I've seen that WB will let the directors/writers/etc do stuff besides just copy Snyder's style.
I rated the movie an A
Its held back a little bit by the weak villains and a few too many scenes in the dark, but besides that I don't really have anything to complain about. I ended up paying for myself, my dad and my brother to go because neither of them were that interested (they both disliked Man of Steel, the last DC movie they watched, a lot and my Dad is only a very casual fan of this type of movie) but my brother liked it and my Dad really liked it, saying its the best movie we'd seen since TFA.
One thing I'm a bit worried about for a sequel is if people who are won over by WW but are more casual fans of this stuff (like my Dad) go to Justice League because she's in it, but get turned off by it being another Snyder movie and that makes some people completely skip WW 2. It really sucks that we're getting another Snyder movie right after this. But, hopefully people who consider WW the first good DCEU movie will still see WW 2 regardless of how JL turns out.
This movie deserves to make a lot of money. I hope it kicks ass at the box office, and this leads to WB turning the DCEU around. Not by making it the MCU, but by taking Snyder out of the franchise's driver seat (which seems to be happening). I'm definitely a lot more hopeful that stuff like Flash, Cyborg, etc could be great movies because now I've seen that WB will let the directors/writers/etc do stuff besides just copy Snyder's style.
Gave it an A+, I thought it was great. It had so much of what the DCEU movies have lacked, HEART, a actual heroic hero who lacked pretentiousness, stirring scenes that, again, lacked pretentiousness.
Gal Godot was marvelous. She handled WW's inexperience, worldliness, and super hero physicality with aplomb. I almost applauded when she accused the allied officials of cowardice. The shot of her leaning into machine gun fire behind her shield as she led the troops at the front,was positively iconic. I don't think I've ever seen a battle like the one at the beginning involving an all female army that was this graphic.
The movie actually allowed this hero to look like a super powered person fighting mere mortals. Best DCEU movie to date and that includes all of Chris Nolan's Batman movies. I really hope this movie lets Warner Bros know that you can make extremely profitable super hero films without relying solely upon the Nolan/Snyder model.
Cannot wait to see it again.
Gal Godot was marvelous. She handled WW's inexperience, worldliness, and super hero physicality with aplomb. I almost applauded when she accused the allied officials of cowardice. The shot of her leaning into machine gun fire behind her shield as she led the troops at the front,was positively iconic. I don't think I've ever seen a battle like the one at the beginning involving an all female army that was this graphic.
The movie actually allowed this hero to look like a super powered person fighting mere mortals. Best DCEU movie to date and that includes all of Chris Nolan's Batman movies. I really hope this movie lets Warner Bros know that you can make extremely profitable super hero films without relying solely upon the Nolan/Snyder model.
Cannot wait to see it again.
Saw it this afternoon and loved everything except the overnight sailboat ride from Theymiscira to London. Didn't Steve say something about taking off from a Nazi base in/near Turkey before crashing in the waters off the Amazonian island? I don't think they could cover that distance even with a tug boat pulling them all the way.
Loved the scene when Steve yelled, "Diana, SHIELD!"
Loved the scene when Steve yelled, "Diana, SHIELD!"
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