Voyager fans.. are you disappointed about Discovery?

[Refuge]

Truth is I fit into the category of resisting prequels anyway. Took me years to watch the Star Wars ones and the roadblock of my resistance was because I didn't want to sully the Original. Holding up Star Wars (as it was when it was the only one) means.. for me.. not undermining it. I didn't want a prequel that would cast any bad light on Luke, for example. Imagine the horror of watching Star Trek reboots and the difficulty of seeing nuKirk. If I wasn't comparing him with Shatner Kirk that would've been fine. I kept thinking smile more, smirk please. Obviously Discovery is not going to be a reboot of TOS but I hope they don't stuff around trying to ruin the playground. Make everything too dark and dramatic. If using the Originals era is supposed to play on its wonder, evoke a loyalty, then I hope it doesn't forget that. Oh look we'll do pre-TOS era but we're going to make it a complex drama instead with some heavy plodding issues.

I'm getting a sense (yep it's sinking in) that some viewers think episodes are a bad thing. That watching one in isolation, albeit with a season holding a continuity is not 'arc y' enough. That aliens of the week are a bad thing. That trekking around planets is a bad thing. Isn't that what TOS did? What Discovery is using to draw the crowds?

Just so difficult to get over the era of it all and now to second guess the story telling. Mind you I personally am going to be slow out of the gate to watch it anyway.. by then it will be a known quantity that might please.

 

[BillJ]

Truth is I fit into the category of resisting prequels anyway. Took me years to watch the Star Wars ones and the roadblock of my resistance was because I didn't want to sully the Original.

This never made any sense to me, honestly. There's nothing that's been produced in Trek that has changed my affection for the original.

 

[Refuge]

Yet..

 

[Tracy Trek]

I didn't want a prequel that would cast any bad light on Luke, for example.

So I guess it's a good thing that Luke is not really in them except as a baby at the end of episode 3?

This never made any sense to me, honestly. There's nothing that's been produced in Trek that has changed my affection for the original.

Nothing has changed my affection for the original either. But does anyone feel like the way Enterprise changed things about the Vulcans makes the canon for the original not exactly canon anymore? Or do you view Enterprise and the reboot movies as alternate realities?

 

[Refuge]

Frankly I didn't watch to find out who was in them, lol. Not until a couple of years ago.

That's just it. Going back can change or attempt to change the roots of a good thing. I mean check out the leaked photo of Discovery's Klingons..

 

[fireproof78]

This never made any sense to me, honestly. There's nothing that's been produced in Trek that has changed my affection for the original.

Precisely so. TOS will always be Star Trek to me. Even the TOS films change nothing as far as my affection towards them.

So I guess it's a good thing that Luke is not really in them except as a baby at the end of episode 3?

Nothing has changed my affection for the original either. But does anyone feel like the way Enterprise changed things about the Vulcans makes the canon for the original not exactly canon anymore? Or do you view Enterprise and the reboot movies as alternate realities?

I don't worry about canon and often, when I am watching a film or episode, the larger "Trek Verse" isn't in mind. The larger story that is being told about the characters is, but not "how does this fit within the whole" if that makes sense.

I don't care for the Star Wars PT, mostly, but they do nothing to undermine my enjoyment of the OT. I can sit down and watch the OT, unencumbered by any thing else.

 

[Tracy Trek]

Precisely so. TOS will always be Star Trek to me. Even the TOS films change nothing as far as my affection towards them.

It was actually the original series movies that got me into Trek in the first place. Then I went back and watched the series.

 

[Refuge]

My affection for TOS has diminished. It still has a sense of adventure but it's terribly corny and campy. Don't know when the use-by date of it hit me but it did.

 

[Refuge]

It was actually the original series movies that got me into Trek in the first place. Then I went back and watched the series.

That's interesting, that you watched that way around. I can't watch the first one now without thinking of Galaxy Quest, lol. I like Khan in the Wrath of and I did rather like the Two Captains one.

 

[fireproof78]

It was actually the original series movies that got me into Trek in the first place. Then I went back and watched the series.

I had episodes on VHS that I would rewatch until the films came out. Then I would watch those over and over.

For me, now that I'm getting older, I am more selective about how other series or films impact my enjoyment. As I said, TOS is my first Trek, pretty much the only one that I regard as "important." The rest are fun adventures, but not "necessary" to the continuation of the story or series. If all I ever got was TOS season 1, or Star Wars A New Hope, and the like, I would be happy and content.

 

[Nightdiamond]

There is disagreement on that

VOY and DS9 lost viewers at a similar rate, and there is concern that VOY's more formulaic approach was too safe that it would not draw in outside viewers. Attempts to do so were meager, at best.

That's not to say that VOY itself was a failure, but that "guilt by association" would lead to more hesitance, especially with the box office success of ST 09.

The franchise is kind of in a weird state now. The last show to get canceled was a pre TOS show, and the last two post TNG movies were failures. The current movie set in a different time line was a box office disappointment. It's sort of No man's land for this franchise right now.

That's just it. Going back can change or attempt to change the roots of a good thing. I mean check out the leaked photo of Discovery's Klingons..

You may have a point ---Some fans were pretty put off by the idea of Kirk being made captain after only attending 3 years of the academy. Not to say that led to Beyond's box office problem, but it is hard to understand why it wasn't successful, considering it is considered the best in the series. It could have been just poor promotion or publicity.

But sometimes when you tamper with a script too much----think the Terminator franchise.

 

[fireproof78]

Perhaps if there had not been a writer's strike, there could have been some additions and corrections.

Also, as a question of general curiosity, why am I asked to cut VOY some slack and imagine things between episodes, but Kelvin Trek doesn't get the same leniency?

 

[Refuge]

Why should it?

 

[fireproof78]

Why should VOY?

 

[Refuge]

Voyager isn't cut any slack..

Next..

 

[fireproof78]

Voyager isn't cut any slack..

Next..

Ha-ha. I've been accused, in various threads on this sub-forum, for not having any imagination, for not having a sense of humor, and wanting to see Voyager repaired after massive damage. I've been told that it "obviously happened off screen-move on." in more or less terms.

But, I ask for Kelvin Trek to be cut slack? Nope. Hmm....that's very interesting.

 

[Refuge]

It's unfortunate I'm afraid. In this 'sub-forum' I've also been accused lol. Of being obtuse, obnoxious, disingenuous, needing my meds, lacking language and grammar ability.. a whole variety of things in this thread as well. Some of it ridiculous and weird. You've got to roll with the punches.

However the freedom to not cut Voyager any slack has been well observed here. Pages of opinion freely flowing so when a few comments in just this thread is a tiny little bit critical of the Kelvin Universe it is.. interesting all right.

 

[fireproof78]

And, yet, it is being insisted that VOY is "superior" and "the best" and that there needs to be more slack given. So, I am sensing a double standard regarding Kelvin Universe. And I have seen others wish that Star Trek burn to the ground before Abrams makes another Star Trek film, so there's plenty vitriol for that. Kelvin universe does not get any slack either.

Also, I'll shed no tears over what I'm called hear.

 

[Refuge]

I see the double standard the other way round. If it's fine to express opinion about Voyager without slack then why is it not okay for other shows in the franchise or the movies to be scrutinised? You know this is the Voyager.. sub-forum, some people like the show, lol.

 

[fireproof78]

I like VOY fine. I just think it could have been done better.

I think that way about all Trek incarnations.

Also, you clearly have not been to the Kelvin forum on any site.