DISTURBED by The Quality of Life

[suarezguy]

So you don't think he was deliberately condemning Geordi and Picard to certain death; he fully trusted that there would be alternative ways to save them (eventually concluding that self-sacrifice was the only answer)?

It's unclear but that seems most likely, he was definitely, firmly rejecting one way of saving them (again he was somewhat simple-mindedly focused on the fighting for that stance) but (maybe because Riker emphasized the loss of Picard and La Forge) he agreed they should be saved in some other way no matter the consequences to him (or the exocomps if they chose to do so).

The episode's ending was disappointing that Picard and La Forge expressed no unease about Data having unclear or bothersome priorities and disregarding orders although TNG tended to be, let alone in the latter years, somewhat lax in discipline for violating orders.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Murderer = has lost human rights.

Um, no they haven't. We're not fucked up as a society enough to do something like that.

 

[JesterFace]

Um, no they haven't. We're not fucked up as a society enough to do something like that.

Perhaps it's just a personal opinion.

 

[Paradise City]

There should be no controversy here bar personal unease. Data discharged his duty as a Starfleet officer to protect the rights of new lifeforms. Once the fact that these are recognised as new lifeforms, Picard and LaForge from a professional standpoint know that Data discharged his duty appropriately.

All that is of course if the powerdrills are on par with humanoids and Soong-type androids. If we're dealing with the mechanical equivalent of Lassie the Dog or Gary the Goldfish, now we've got problems.

 

[Mojochi]

All that is of course if the powerdrills are on par with humanoids and Soong-type androids. If we're dealing with the mechanical equivalent of Lassie the Dog or Gary the Goldfish, now we've got problems.

I don't think that's how they see it

Picard: I would argue that the Crystalline Entity has as much right to be here as we do.

The situation, as I recollect it, is that exocomp lady intends to send one down to self-destruct in lieu of a torpedo. Data points out that it's very likely the exocomp will refuse to do so, in that being sentient beings, they protect themselves. (& he's probably right) She rebuts by suggesting that they disconnect its command pathways so it has no ability to refuse, & already having shot down Data, Riker immediately orders that to be done.

At this point, Data is in no position to offer himself. He is the only advocate for the exocomp about to be forcefully destroyed. He must act on that 1st, as he does, by locking out the transporter. Then when Riker expresses a lack of other options, Data offers himself, & Riker refuses

To me, Data acts on behalf of an unknown life form in accordance with the same principles, priorities & methods someone like Picard might, if it were some random sand sucking microorganism, that's displayed intelligence. (Just as the exocomps did) If they begin feeling like the life of some unknown entity is worth less than their own, then they really are of no benefit in being out there at all, imho

 

[xanne]

It's simpler than that: Picard chooses to beam over there as Geordi does, the exocomps doesn't. Just at the very end of the episode and because Data forces the situation, they let them choose. End of story. I do like this episode because of that. It's not so hard to understand, what I do find hard to believe is that humans should have gone that far without taking any consideration or respect to the lives of other lifeforms.

 

[Showdown]

It's simpler than that: Picard chooses to beam over there as Geordi does, the exocomps doesn't. Just at the very end of the episode and because Data forces the situation, they let them choose. End of story. I do like this episode because of that. It's not so hard to understand, what I do find hard to believe is that humans should have gone that far without taking any consideration or respect to the lives of other lifeforms.

I agree. Both Picard and LaForge also chose to join Starfleet and chose go on dangerous missions.

 

[Panem et circenses]

As a minor note they were recently talking about this on the Misson Log podcast and brought up the fact that Data is also choosing between the life of 3 exocomps and 2 humans. Essentially, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Even is it is only one more life. Doesn't add much to this conversation, but still interesting to consider I think.

 

[Mojochi]

As a minor note they were recently talking about this on the Misson Log podcast and brought up the fact that Data is also choosing between the life of 3 exocomps and 2 humans. Essentially, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Even is it is only one more life. Doesn't add much to this conversation, but still interesting to consider I think.

Interesting point, & an interesting side note to this episode is that the Exocomps have similar values, in that they send three, but sacrifice one, to save two

 

[Triskelion]

I'm not even convinced Data is alive, let alone those little windup toys.

I am convinced they are carrying out programs written by an intelligence, however.

If Geordi and Picard want to give their lives for a software simulacrum, it's their prerogative. I'd personally think twice about it.

And yes, I like Data. That is an emotional personification.

 

[Gary7]

There is one other consideration. A machine can be duplicated. Even an exocomp. Down to the very last circuit. Even the resident memory. In essence, the circuitry is identical for all of them. The only difference is individual experiences. But for humans, we're all different because of the combining nature of DNA. We're more "unique." What they could have done for an exocomp is rapidly download the full data set of the device. After being destroyed, replicate a new one and upload the full data set. You can't rebuild a human being and upload a stored consciousness into it. Of course, this starts to touch on the whole transporter concept (are we creating exact copies and destroying the original?).

 

[Paradise City]

There is one other consideration. A machine can be duplicated. Even an exocomp. Down to the very last circuit. Even the resident memory. In essence, the circuitry is identical for all of them. The only difference is individual experiences. But for humans, we're all different because of the combining nature of DNA. We're more "unique." What they could have done for an exocomp is rapidly download the full data set of the device. After being destroyed, replicate a new one and upload the full data set. You can't rebuild a human being and upload a stored consciousness into it. Of course, this starts to touch on the whole transporter concept (are we creating exact copies and destroying the original?).

Yes. You could create trillions of these sentient drills and they'd all need their rights protected. The dilemma is worse then with sentient holograms. All you need is a few mischevious words and you've a squillion new Federation citizens that you have to handle.