Star Trek Discovery in trouble, and a de facto reboot?

[captainkirk]

With as many long lived races as there are in the galaxy, it wouldn't be logical to revert to the original name and create confusion.

Plus, all the references to TOS used visual cues from that show.

I agree with you, but it's an example of how their are multiple ways to interpret Star Trek's continuity.

 

[BillJ]

I agree with you, but it's an example of how their are multiple ways to interpret Star Trek's continuity.

I don't see any way that one could interpret that TNG takes place in the Abramsverse. Just no evidence, not even circumstantial.

 

[jaime]

I don't see any way that one could interpret that TNG takes place in the Abramsverse. Just no evidence, not even circumstantial.

I dunno....Wesley as a result of Romulan genetic shenanigans the same night they copped Picards DNA for Shinzon makes sense of all those times he put the Enterprise in danger...I mean saved the ship from danger...though how they managed to clone all of Neros crew and distill it into Wesley is a good question.

 

[Dukhat]

His opinion carries a bit of weight, given that he wrote one of those films and undoubtedly used it to inform his approach to doing so.

In the absence of anything to the contrary being said in the films, it is at least a reasonable explanation.

While I agree with you in theory, if the authorial intent is never specifically seen or mentioned, then it de facto doesn't exist. The authorial intent was that Saavik was half-Vulcan and half-Romulan. But that was never seen or mentioned in the films, so whatever the intent was, in the end she's just a Vulcan.

Now if the idea that time changed both ways is in fact mentioned in a future Kelvinverse production, that's different.

 

[Kemaiku]

The timeline was altered significantly in TNG season 2 when Q threw the Enterprise into the path of the Borg 100 years early. And there was nothing anyone could do about setting that timeline straight again, only Q.

Trek's history was changed forever at that point, yet it's everything after that that gets talked about more?

 

[BillJ]

The timeline was altered significantly in TNG season 2 when Q threw the Enterprise into the path of the Borg 100 years early.

I think there's a bit of contention there, as the Borg were already attacking colonies along the Federation/Romulan Neutral Zone just a year earlier.

WORF: Captain, the sixth planet in the system is Class M.
DATA: There is a system of roads on this planet, which indicates a highly industrialised civilisation. But where there should be cities there are only great rips in the surface.
WORF: It is as though some great force just scooped all the machine elements off the face of the planet.
DATA: It is identical to what happened to the outposts along the Neutral Zone.

 

[Dukhat]

The timeline was altered significantly in TNG season 2 when Q threw the Enterprise into the path of the Borg 100 years early. And there was nothing anyone could do about setting that timeline straight again, only Q.

Trek's history was changed forever at that point, yet it's everything after that that gets talked about more?

I'm not sure how that example is "changing the timeline." It was only Guinan's opinion that humanity shouldn't have met the Borg until later. It's not like she was from the future herself.

 

[jamestyler]

Except they went to the planet Vulcan in "Sarek" and "Gambit II".

Indeed. And of course the obvious one of Scotty showing up and using the holodeck to show the Prime Enterprise. Oh, and Prime Kirk from the late Prime 23rd century teaming up with Picard. And Prime Spock. And then Worf & O'Brien switching series and going to their Prime past with Prime everyone.

It's like the Flat Earthers of Trek.

 

[Kemaiku]

I think there's a bit of contention there, as the Borg were already attacking colonies along the Federation/Romulan Neutral Zone just a year earlier.

That was retconned in though.

In Voyager, Q himself is confused as to how the ship got there, telling Janeway humans aren't meant to be in the Delta Quadrant by their own means for a century more.

 

[BillJ]

I'm not sure how that example is "changing the timeline." It was only Guinan's opinion that humanity shouldn't have met the Borg until 100 years later. It's not like she was from the future herself.

She likely didn't even know about the encounter from the prior year.

 

[BillJ]

That was retconned in though.

Well, no. "The Neutral Zone" was from season one, "Q,Who?" from season two. The writers strike nixed the introduction of the Borg in the beginning of season two, as a continuation of season one.

 

[Kemaiku]

Originally the Ferengi were meant to be the powerful, cannabilistic enemy race of TNG. They made overtures of attacks on the Romulans to set up a further storyline, but mainly using it as a way to bring the Rommies back.

When the Borg were thought up, and the ferengi demoted to comic relief, it was altered so that they attacked the outposts mostly taken as truth. Even so, it's still not outright stated to have definitely been them in Q Who.

Q's spiteful act changed history, bringing a race he says himself don't belong there until about 2470, into the path of a Borg ship in the Beta Quadrant well away from known space.

 

[Dukhat]

That was retconned in though.

In Voyager, Q himself is confused as to how the ship got there, telling Janeway humans aren't meant to be in the Delta Quadrant by their own means for a century more.

That's still not "changing the timeline." Q isn't all-knowing. Just because he didn't know why Voyager was in the Delta Quadrant doesn't mean that something changed.

Originally the Ferengi were meant to be the powerful, cannabilistic enemy race of TNG. They made overtures of attacks on the Romulans to set up a further storyline, but mainly using it as a way to bring the Rommies back.

When the Borg were thought up, and the ferengi demoted to comic relief, it was altered so that they attacked the outposts mostly taken as truth. Even so, it's still not outright stated to have definitely been them in Q Who.

Q's spiteful act changed history, bringing a race he says himself don't belong there until about 2470, into the path of a Borg ship in the Beta Quadrant well away from known space.

Sorry, but none of that is true. It was always supposed to have been the Borg making those attacks, not the Ferengi. And again, Q did not "change history."

The only thing you got right was that the Ferengi were supposed to be the main bad guys, which changed later. But they were never originally responsible for those attacks.

 

[BillJ]

Q's spiteful act changed history, bringing a race he says himself don't belong there until about 2470, into the path of a Borg ship in the Beta Quadrant well away from known space.

Looking at the transcript, the only mention of century is by Guinan talking about her people being attacked. She says "much sooner than it should have come". "Much sooner could be five years or it could be a thousand, but considering the Borg were already scoping out the Federation, I'd say it lands closer to the five year side. Especially considering Starfleet was headed in that direction.

 

[Dukhat]

She says "much sooner than it should have come"...

And again, that's just her opinion, not that she actually had some foreknowledge of future events.

 

[Longinus]

What this Q stuff has to do with the topic?

Anyway, Q probably saved the Federation from the Borg. The Borg were coming regardless, but Enterprise meeting them early gave the Federation valuable knowledge about them and more time to prepare.

 

[Tesophius]

I don't think that Star Trek writers have ever taken continuity as seriously as some fans do. Watching Star Trek, especially across different series and jumping, randomly, from one to another, I always notice inconsistencies and it's clear, to me, that writers just don't really give a damn about it.

 

[Dukhat]

What this Q stuff has to do with the topic?

Someone thought Q changed the timeline, when he didn't. And yeah, I have no idea what that has to do with the topic.

 

[Kemaiku]

The Ferengi were supposed to be the main bad guys.

Which would have been far better than the superzombies.

 

[Dukhat]

Which would have been far better than the superzombies.

I beg to differ.