News Meyer: Star Trek: Discovery Is Self-Examination

[BillJ]

That's what Trek has always done though, or strove to do, in my opinion. People wouldn't watch it if it were consistently pedantic without being entertaining. I recently watched Duet again and it is insanely entertaining and the acting and writing are astounding, and yes, it's also about big ideas and moral issues and even has historical relevance. I guess I'm just not sure why when a new show is coming out and Meyer says it'll make you think about yourself and society, people are wagging their finger like, "But you better make it fun or I'll put you in fandom jail!" I mean, Star Trek has been pretty consistent with the balance of thoughtfulness and entertainment. It's kind of its bread and butter. Sure, there's episodes and movies that failed to do both, but...I dunno, I guess I'm inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt until I see some episodes.

I've never said anything about fandom, I'm talking solely for myself. I haven't found Star Trek "fun" since early TNG.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

I've never said anything about fandom, I'm talking solely for myself. I haven't found Star Trek "fun" since early TNG.

Really? That's a long time and a lot of Trek. I guess it depends on your definition of fun (not being facetious, btw). What are you looking for in that sense? Like a lighter tone?

 

[BillJ]

...and I think now he's almost an authority figure on what makes a strong Trek story.

But is he? His stories have just as many holes and 'WTF?' moments as anything else produced in the franchise. Kirk not raising his shields when even a cadet knows to do it is pretty darn close to character assassination.

What saves his movies are the "fun factor" they have. Nothing I've heard from him so far makes me think that angle is going to remain in tact. I could be wrong.

 

[BillJ]

What are you looking for in that sense? Like a lighter tone?

More adventurous tone. I miss humans being humans and making mistakes, I miss 30 foot Gods, I miss the outlandish that used to make Trek stand out. Now it is just bumpy headed aliens acting human and carrying out dour drama (Abramsverse excluded).

 

[Balok's Decoy]

More adventurous tone. I miss humans being humans and making mistakes, I miss 30 foot Gods, I miss the outlandish that used to make Trek stand out. Now it is just bumpy headed aliens acting human and carrying out dour drama (Abramsverse excluded).

I guess there's plenty of episodes where I have that feeling too. That's one of the reasons TOS is my favorite series and I have a soft spot for TAS. But adventurous at that level probably wouldn't hold up today -- it would have to be portrayed differently or else it would be considered "too campy," at least for a wide audience. Yeah I see your point. And if 30 foot gods and outlandish characters are what you want (and lord knows I would like to see that sometimes too!) then you may have reason to be worried. For some reason I'm getting a DS9 feel from DSC, in terms of content and tone. I hope DSC doesn't take itself too seriously either.

 

[INACTIVEUSS Einstein]

For anyone worried about getting hit over the head with social topics, I don't think that is what he was talking about when he talked about exploring human existence - I mean literature explores social topics like death, forgiveness, hope, violence, anger, etc - and the complexes that form around them and through their interaction with each other and the the complexes of others - I don't wanna put words into someone's mouth, but I'm pretty sure he isn't going to preach a polemic (not that I actually mind that in Picard). I mean look at Wrath of Khan, it was a re-populariser of concepts from classical literature like pride, obsession, metis, age and death. I couldn't be happier that Meyer is acting as an influence like this. I just want to see what he does, I don't care to judge it, I just want to see what he brings to this and take the experience as it is.

 

[Mudd]

More adventurous tone. I miss humans being humans and making mistakes, I miss 30 foot Gods, I miss the outlandish that used to make Trek stand out. Now it is just bumpy headed aliens acting human and carrying out dour drama (Abramsverse excluded).

Yep, me too. It's why I prefer nuTrek over most of the Trek spinoffs - it better captures what TOS was about.

I'm not sure about "campy," but I know that Trek ought to jettison the solemn self-regard that dragged the later shows down.

Meyer directed and/or wrote a couple of good Star Trek movies and one bad one. He's not an authority of any kind on what makes Trek work - as he readily admits in almost every interview - and is certainly not experienced with current-day television. I'm more encouraged when I see young writers, and writers with no previous Star Trek experience, signing on.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

Yep, me too. It's why I prefer nuTrek over most of the Trek spinoffs - it better captures what TOS was about.

I'm not sure about "campy," but I know that Trek ought to jettison the solemn self-regard that dragged the later shows down.

Meyer directed and/or wrote a couple of good Star Trek movies and one bad one. He's not an authority of any kind on what makes Trek work - as he readily admits in almost every interview - and is certainly not experienced with current-day television. I'm more encouraged when I see young writers, and writers with no previous Star Trek experience, signing on.

I agree with this. With one thing said above, it's that latter-day Trek that had that solemnity to it, that almost preachy quality to it, and it's tended to color a lot of fans' view of what Trek "should be".

To me, Star Trek Beyond, in having Lin directing, Pegg and Jung writing, gave it a new take but harkened back to the TOS style which carries a spark and energy that the writing by committee concept that came about during TNG through to ENT lost as time went on.

DSC so far looks to have potential for that spark to come back to television, as long as it stays away from the trap of being on a soap box every week.

 

[BillJ]

TOS could be solemn and did some damned good work with episodes like "The Conscience of the King" and "Obsession", but managed to balance it out with episodes like "Arena", "Errand of Mercy" and "The Man Trap".

I guess what I'm looking for is a balance that has been missing from Star Trek for a long time.

 

[INACTIVEUSS Einstein]

How about another member of the writing team that Trekkies are familiar with - Kirsten Beyer.

Anyone here read the Voyager books, and if so, what is she bringing to the table style wise?

Like I don't really know anything about them - do they have interesting cutting edge science in them? A sense of exploration of space? Or are they surprisingly political, full of the rise and fall of civilizations?

 

[KirkusOveractus]

TOS could be solemn and did some damned good work with episodes like "The Conscience of the King" and "Obsession", but managed to balance it out with episodes like "Arena", "Errand of Mercy" and "The Man Trap".

I guess what I'm looking for is a balance that has been missing from Star Trek for a long time.

To me, two episodes that really stand out are "Arena" and "A Taste of Armageddon", the latter being my favorite TOS and maybe favorite Trek episode of all.

These in particular, while having some great adventure and good moments of action, had a story to tell and message in them. But it didn't smack you over the head with it. You took away from them what you felt like. It wasn't done for you.

 

[BillJ]

How about another member of the writing team that Trekkies are familiar with - Kirsten Beyer.

Anyone here read the Voyager books, and if so, what is she bringing to the table style wise?

Like I don't really know anything about them - do they have interesting cutting edge science in them? A sense of exploration of space? Or are they surprisingly political, full of the rise and fall of civilizations?

Basically back to the Delta Quadrant with a fleet to clean up prior messes. I only got about three books in before abandoning ship. She is a talented writer, but I would've rather them picked someone with a track record of writing 23rd century material, like Greg Cox or Dayton Ward.

 

[BillJ]

To me, two episodes that really stand out are "Arena" and "A Taste of Armageddon", the latter being my favorite TOS and maybe favorite Trek episode of all.

"A Taste of Armageddon" is my personal favorite episode, as well.

 

[INACTIVEUSS Einstein]

Balance of Terror for me, with Devil in the Dark and Space Seed coming close

God what an amazing show - its first season hit the ground running.

 

[a thousand-yard stare]

Kirk not raising his shields when even a cadet knows to do it is pretty darn close to character assassination.

Followed by;

I miss humans being humans and making mistakes,

Kirk was overconfident. He made a mistake. He admitted it and was angry with himself.

In 'ST: Into Darkness', what does Scotty call him?
"Captain James Tiberius Perfect"?

These are all filmmakers subverting the popular image and we see character growth.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[INACTIVEUSS Einstein]

Basically back to the Delta Quadrant with a fleet to clean up prior messes. I only got about three books in before abandoning ship. She is a talented writer, but I would've rather them picked someone a track record of writing 23rd century material, like Greg Cox or Dayton Ward.

Not read much of their stuff, aside from the Eugenics Wars, I was hoping Christopher Bennet might be on the team, as I liked The Buried Age, and would like some archeology to appear in Discovery (god I miss SG-1 and Daniel Jackson for that).

 

[BillJ]

Kirk was overconfident. He made a mistake. He admitted it and was angry with himself.

But Kirk had someone right there reminding him of the proper procedure. Not only is he responsible for their lives, he's responsible for setting an example for a cadet crew.

There is an interesting issue of DC Comics first run Trek, either issue #46 or 47. Where a cadet ends up in command and is acting the way he think Kirk would. Which ends in disaster and Kirk having to take a look at himself. Great stuff.

In 'ST: Into Darkness', what does Scotty call him?
"Captain James Tiberius Perfect"?

Perfecthair.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

Balance of Terror for me, with Devil in the Dark and Space Seed coming close

God what an amazing show - its first season hit the ground running.

I agree completely! While the second season is great and third has really good episodes, that first season was incredible.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

"A Taste of Armageddon" is my personal favorite episode, as well.

Taste of Armageddon might be my favorite too. That or Journey to Babel and Devil in the Dark.

 

[BillJ]

I really need Discovery to have a total 'WTF?!?' moment like we have in "The Omega Glory" when the Yangs trot out the American flag and Kirk reads the US Constitution.

Seriously, that moment has sparked fifty years of discussion and theories.