• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Why the Ralph McQuarrie-inspired USS Discovery is an incredible design

INACTIVEUSS Einstein

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
It's hard to understand now that we have lots of science fiction, but in the 1960s, Star Trek was literally the only serious space opera that had ever made it onto TV. Hard science fiction fans and authors applauded the show for being unusually literary. It's only rivals were things like Lost in Space. The only feature film that had engaged in similar epic scope was Forbidden Planet, from which it took much inspiration. It featured actual world-building, a ship full of a crew of hundred of astronauts, following a realistic command structure, all set onboard a research and exploration ship with an instantly iconic appearance.

RdhZRPb.jpg


In 1975 Paramount were going to produce a new Star Trek motion picture, called Star Trek: Planet of the Titans, owing to the surprising popularity of the Original Series, which was widely shown on repeat in syndication, and had gained a highly dedicated fan base (perhaps the first such example of a community that dedicated aside from Tolkien's fans). The plans were however dropped and in 1977 a new plan for a TV series called Star Trek: Phase II emerged instead - eventually this became Star Trek I: The Motion Picture. Although eventually a choice was made in favor of the Constitution-class refit that we know and love as the Motion Picture's iconic starship design, there were a number of radical ideas from Planet of the Titans and Phase II that never saw use.

FOuDQWE.jpg


13-ImperialCity.png


nn0IvHS.jpg


Because of the popularity of Stanley Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey in 1969 (with it's cinema-changing practical effects and highly detailed miniature models), the legendary art designer of Star Wars, Ralph McQuarrie was brought onboard to produce more detailed designs and concept art for the Planet of the Titans feature film. He worked on this from about 1976 when he was simultaneously working on 1977's Star Wars, meaning neither franchise stole concepts from the other as people might assume. He produced a USS Enterprise that was a radical departure from the established one, with a triangular engineering hull, similar to the shape of one of his iconic Imperial Star Destroyers. The overall shape (which in one configuration had a huge shuttle bay resembling the launch deck of an aircraft carrier), gave the feeling of a more real-world Navy vessel bustling with activity and cargo loaders. I remember when I first saw these concepts as a kid in Star Trek books, they looked too Star Wars-y to me, but then the Enterprise D also looked completely different to what I thought a Star Trek ship should look like, growing up in the 90s watching reruns of TOS on BBC2. Now I appreciate their elegance.

Pp8U39Q.jpg

MxuiGmw.jpg


o6TVDc1.jpg


As I got older and grew increasingly tired with the art direction of the post-TNG era, with it's compressed organic looking starships like the Sovereign class, I realized that actually I quite liked the Ralph McQuarrie designs because they preserved the NASA-like modular feel of Star Trek better than the amorphous shapes that had become common post-USS Defiant. A Star Trek ship is not a disposable fighter craft, launched in thousands from a factory line; they are each an undertaking in science and engineering equivalent to the years of development and research that went into the Apollo moon missions - each ship has character - they are produced in smallish numbers before a new class is developed, and serve for decades with crews of hundreds. After the Battle of Chintoka, we Trekkies had begun to see them less as the mobile research platforms that they were in TOS, and more like tanks in a strategy game. When Star Trek: Discovery was announced, I had no idea what era or even timeline it was going to be set in, but thought that the Ralph McQuarrie shapes would make for an interesting lost era in starship design somewhere around The Motion Picture - imagine my joy when they revealed her.

zoSipw0.png


dC7d8pz.png


P6SMhju.png


RpV4cHg.png


She's beautiful. The design fits in perfectly as being near TOS and TMP, with the Motion Picture era deflector dish and 1970s shape that looks like it's from around The Original Series. Just enough features to link it to both the Constitution class and the Refit. Bare and unadorned lines, as opposed to the busyness of the post-TNG stuff. Practical in appearance, rather than sculpted and organic. And the design is not even unprecedented - other ships from it's general era may have been seen before. This is because the concept art that Ralph McQuarrie made for Planet of the Titans had been used before as background ships in Star Trek. Study models had been built based on his designs, and they had appeared both in the background in spacedock in Star Trek III, and also in the debris field at the Battle of Wolf 359 and the ship graveyard depot at Qualor II. But I think the thing that attracts me to the design most of all, is that this lost era in Star Trek's history always felt like a lost opportunity - and now it is finally being used - that is a joy to behold - the almost lost opportunity has been seized.

9LXmFwp.jpg


F3H8SI7.jpg


rfdtK12.jpg


The original criteria for the design of the USS Enterprise in the 1960s was that it should have a silhouette that could be quickly and easily identified by the viewer even at a glance. Gene Roddenberry was probably inspired by WW2 recognition charts of enemy planes - by which spotters could identify enemy bombers. The result was something iconic that people across the world today cannot mistake for anything else, while many films are full of identical looking vessels that you couldn't place unless you were a dedicated fan. The JJ Abrams films, whatever else you think about them, had some beautiful starships - the USS Kelvin especially. When it first appeared on screen, with it's modular NASA-like appearance, iconic silhouette and Motion Picture era detailing I was blown away by how Star Trek-like it was. The USS Discovery has one of the most recognizable appearances and recognizably Star Trek-like silhouettes that I have ever seen - it is iconic, easy to pick out from 200 years of Star Trek history.

VxqiaHI.jpg


2DbbPHj.png


In closing, this is why I am hoping the design of the USS Discovery hasn't been altered too much from what we saw in the hastily thrown-together teaser trailer. When I saw that thing, emerging from a McQuarrie style asteroid-Starbase even, I could not have been happier.
 
Last edited:
It's not even remotely close to the ugliest starship design we've seen, there are quite a few outside of star trek, and also some kitbashes that would be much worse, even if I thought it was a bad design.

No, it's actual looks are not in question, what is questionable, however, is the criteria most fans that judged it harshly are using...namely the fact it doesn't quite look like what their mind's eye was expecting, or it doesn't fit into the timeline.

One relies on preconceived notions and nostalgia the other on an already artificially constructed fiction that in fact, does fit fairly close into the timeline in effect because it WAS designed between TOS and STTMP (by two famous, respected designers no less).

By most measures there is nothing particularly odd about the ship, it has all the preconceived parts we ascribe to the fictional universe of Trek, namely a saucer primary hull, a dorsal neck, a secondary engineering hull, pylons and engine nacelles. There is talk of it looking "chunky" but in profile, next to a Constitution, it looks sleeker, and from above, it's delta "wing" pylons do the same.

The coloring is unusual but not unprecedented, we saw rust colored ships in the Kelvin films. It's something easily changed and may have been.

To sum up and to put it bluntly, Trekkies are basically talking out of their collective asses if they think it's an "improper" design. The reasoning is tenuous, Personal taste is a different matter but even there it's hard to fathom the dislike, again as with many things, it is usually low adaptability and lack of imagination from fans that is the problem.

RAMA
 
I'm definitely warming up to her, though I will say I much prefer the implemented look of Discovery compared to RMQ's concept designs for the new Enterprise. The scale between the saucer, secondary hull and nacelles seems off, and I'm not a fan of the exceptionally long and skinny neck and pylons.
 
If you look at the different eras of Star Trek vessels lined up in a row, the Discovery really does look like it could fit anywhere around TOS and TMP - after all, the Kelvin era ships also had glowing deflector dishes - and the general color of the hull and smoothness does with that sort of era, even though we are trying to avoid the suggestion that ships follow a linear progression.

Post-2160 / aka Post Enterprise NX-01

wxoQBAK.jpg


Rjrehmj.jpg


KlKqm4k.jpg


Post-2233 / aka Post USS Kelvin NCC-0514

iafjBbG.jpg


XPDJSCJ.jpg


Wq7HeBG.jpg


Around 2250 / aka the era of the USS Discovery (DSC):

4mdzInz.png


Post-2265 / aka Post USS Enterprise NCC-1701 (TOS)

s2eKyQA.jpg


VcGL0Rv.jpg


Post-2273 / aka Post USS Enterprise NCC-1701 (refit)


00isirI.jpg

Bzja9CY.jpg

Om1MuH2.jpg


Post-2293 / aka Post USS Excelsior NCC-2000


VoNmvTz.jpg


mLRuOWI.jpg


It's not even remotely close to the ugliest starship design we've seen, there are quite a few outside of star trek, and also some kitbashes that would be much worse, even if I thought it was a bad design.

Agree on this 100%. And yes, a lot of the criteria, as you say, on which a few people have said the design looks odd, seem to be criteria that are themselves based on unnatural assumptions about how starships are designed - which if it is anything like real life, could result in a great diversity of appearances side by side even in the same era.
 
Put me in the 'she's ugly' category. The show creators are trying to attract a new generation of fans. You said it yourself, this looks like a 1970's era design. Using a ship design that looks like something their parents or grandparents would have found appealing when they were kids, is not the way to go. There has to be a way to design a ship that both looks appealing today (meaning not clunky and outdated) AND fits into the timeline well enough that older Star Trek fans can overlook any minor questions. The triangle hull design is not the answer imo.
 
At least change the nacelles. By making them cylindrical, the design at least begins to look like it might belong in the lineage of ships seen from ENT to TOS. Otherwise, it's late 23rd Century (Motion Picture-era) or possibly early 24th.

I can even take those Abramsverse designs as an evolution toward the Constitution class, in the way I can simply can't from McQuarrie's design. Undoubtedly because that's not part of his thinking with there. It belongs to a total reimagining of the 60's show, and not an attempt to stay true to any of the prior designs. I'm glad they threw it out on the long journey to Star Trek 1979's rebirth on the big-screen.
 
Last edited:
Put me in the 'she's ugly' category. The show creators are trying to attract a new generation of fans. You said it yourself, this looks like a 1970's era design. Using a ship design that looks like something their parents or grandparents would have found appealing when they were kids, is not the way to go. There has to be a way to design a ship that both looks appealing today (meaning not clunky and outdated) AND fits into the timeline well enough that older Star Trek fans can overlook any minor questions. The triangle hull design is not the answer imo.

Well, the reason I don't agree is that the a good design just looks good in any era, its not like it stopped looking good on Jan 1, 1980 - so yes, I said it was made in the 1970s, and looks like the styles people employed then - I did not however say it looks like it could ONLY come from the 1970s - it could also come from 2010 and indeed has. If you have ever seen Star Wars Rebels, they deliberately follow the style of Ralph McQuarrie because it is iconic and appropriate to the setting. The Ghost, could be straight out of 1970s or 2010s design, just like the USS Discovery - its faithful to Star Wars without looking out of place in any era (the same can be said for the ships in The Force Awakens):

nk30lRE.jpg


lLMopls.jpg


But anyway, even ignoring all that, looking at the concept art for Planet of the Titans, in many ways the 1970s painting that McQuarrie made looks more practical than a current starship design from the bad tie-in Star Trek video games - since they aren't designed for aesthetic appearance like a commercial vehicle (they are an industrial tool of exploration), they would be full of unadorned practical lines - not like the horrible ships we see in say STO, where someone just drew a nondescript vague Star Trek-like shape and made it as busy as they could, with ridges and organic curves everywhere, until it just looks utterly the same as every other design.

o6TVDc1.jpg


RpV4cHg.png


I know that STO is a bad example, but that's the problem that I feel increasingly got worse post TNG. A ship more like something out of Interstellar or The Martian, or else something ultra modern would also look great, but Star Trek isn't Revelation Space hard sci-fi, its pretty hard by TV standards, but the iconic form of it's ships are still somewhat arbitrary in layout, so making Discovery look ultra sleek under the reasoning that material sciences have advanced that far by the 2250s, is also not a good argument, since Star Trek has never built ships on the principle that a swarm of nanobots made it out of a lump of polymer - they have always been engineered more traditionally.

ntC2taK.jpg


Okay so the above piece of art looks really cool - it's an example of a modern take on Star Trek - but it's uncalled for in this particular era, when the design we have will serve the setting better - the ship above which I noticed in a thread a while ago looks beautiful, but would be better used if we ever saw a series set in say the 25th century, which we may yet do. Or it would look better in a full reboot, but we arn't getting one.
 
I have a feeling the colors and nacelles will be more "conventional", ie: appeasing for the unimaginative fans.

RAMA
 
The problem isn't the design. It's fans that are incapable of looking beyond what's there. If this wasn't seen during TOS, according to them, it simply does not exist. In real life, there are uncounted wonders you have never seen. Doesn't mean they aren't there.

The simple concept of accepting this design has, retroactivly, been part of Starfleet all along, is beyond them.
 
At least change the nacelles. By making them cylindrical, the design at least begins to look like it might belong in the lineage of ships seen from ENT to TOS. Otherwise, it's late 23rd Century (Motion Picture-era) or possibly early 24th.

I can even take those Abramsverse designs as an evolution toward the Constitution class, in the way I can simply can't from McQuarrie's design. Undoubtedly because that's not part of his thinking with there. It belongs to a total reimagining of the 60's show, and not an attempt to stay true to any of the prior designs. I'm glad they threw it out on the long journey to Star Trek 1979's rebirth on the big-screen.

But there is an assumption here that warp nacelles represent a linear progression. There is no evidence that this is true. Sure, designs from the same era have tended to have similar nacelles, but there are also examples to the contrary. Moreover, in real life, it would be unlikely....

Like I said in another thread:

0FzZN0k.jpg


In real life, a design, say of a plane or a space capsule, can come from the same era, but be quite radically different in overall appearance. This is because you can have multiple lineages of design philosophy and theory running side by side. Technological design is not a single line; its a series of lines like an evolutionary family tree in a way. While one shipyard may be building a project commissioned in 2245, another may be building a project from a different design team from 2238 still. The later commissioned project may even make it into space first, if the earlier one runs into delays. The more modern project may be scrapped in favor of the older tech. There may be an economic advantage to sticking with a proven nacelle on some projects.

mzJDoZc.jpg


The Federation kept using the above nacelle design for decades right into DS9. The Constitution class had been decommissioned long ago by this point, but the Miranda class was still a feasible spin off and presumably cheaper to construct due to existing infrastructure, than an entirely new class.
 
Though I kinda got the impression this was a post on you and not that much the design, I like the design. That is, the inspired design. The one that looks like 3 nacelles in one casing(and therefore 6 nacelles over all), though Trekyards prefers to stick on naming it "single nacelle 3 bussards"(it doen't make more sense to me, since as far as I can remember, nacelles always had their own bussard scoop, so 3 nacelles doesn't alienate me). To each their own(better if they don't explain it so we can both keep our opinions on it) I guess.

Trekyards basically said the design changed considerably though(I hope not for the worst. I don't like the version in the comparison pic for instance). We don't have many details on it though, unless you trekbbsers think they are modelling a step at a time after the feedback they get here(and potentially other forums). The shape is important, but even a texture change can make it or break it(as is displayed in their recent Shenzou episode.)
 
Last edited:
It's not a bad design. It's an ugly design. I don't much care for the practical vs. impractical discussion. It's Star Trek, they're making most of this stuff up anyway.

That said, the ship design doesn't really matter to me. It isn't going to affect my enjoyment or lack thereof of the show, at all. Voyager was lazy, the NX-01 was literally a rehash. The last really appealing design in Star Trek was the E-E, and that's just because her sleeker lines were so different from the safe, somewhat bulbous E-D and her ilk. Doesn't change the fact that every appearance of the E-E save First Contact wasn't very good. This McQuarrie design is ugly. Doesn't mean it can't be iconic, or well received. A lot of his Star Wars designs are ugly, including the Falcon, but that doesn't mean they aren't beloved.

If nothing else, the design we've seen so far is instantly recognizable. No confusing it for any other Star Trek. The moment you see it, you know you're looking at the Discovery. That may very well be a good thing, differentiating this show from the past. And especially from the various Enterprises. Obviously, we'll see if any of that changes once the final design is revealed.
 
I like this design. It's fits more in the Star Trek universe than something like DS9's Defiant which is one of the ugliest ships I've seen.
 
The three bussards in the nacelle cowling don't suggest a different era to me, just a difference in design within the same era. Anyway, I hope they haven't completely changed it to something unrecognizable. Like Xerxes said, even if you think it's ugly, it would have been utterly iconic, and many beloved ships are ugly.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top