Voth vs Species 8472 vs Jem'Hadar Battleship vs Borg Tactical Cube vs Scimitar vs Enterprise w/techs
- Thread starter marsh8472
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Hotlinking images would be a stupid thing to have to hand out a warning for. I suggest you stop doing it.
I don't know what that means. I'm not supposed to put images on posts? You must be bored
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/rules-for-posting-on-trekbbs.282289/
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/rules-a-short-guide-to-posting-on-the-bbs.282269/#post-11662568
Sassing a mod...that I'm much more willing to hand out a warning for. Don't push me.marsh8472 said:
Oh ok I'm glad it's an official rule at least.
Q, with a snap of his fingers.
I went ahead and picked the Enterprise. Here's the scenario I envision:
The Borg cube begins scanning each ship with a polaron beam. The Enterprise deploys the armor and raises its shields. The Jem'Hadar Battleship begins firing on the Borg cube. Reman Warbird Scimitar activates its cloaking device and moves away from the Borg cube. The Borg cube locks on a tractor beam onto the Jem'Hadar battleship. Species 8472 fires at the Borg cube causing it to deactivate its tractor beam on the Jem'Hadar. The Jem'Hadar move off while firing at both the Borg cube and Species 8472. Species 8472 fires at the Jem'Hadar causing it to start spinning and losing control of their ship.
The Scimitar begins firing while cloaked at the Bioship, Borg, and Voth all at once. The Bioship, Borg, and Voth start firing at each other in the confusion. The Borg Cube transports 50 drones onto the Jem'Hadar ship and moves off. The Voth City Ship transports the Jem'Hadar battleship and Enterprise inside of it. The Enterprise activates its phase cloak and moves out of the Voth ship.
The Borg Cube fires at the Bioship. The Bioship fires back destroying the Borg Cube. A green mist gets sprayed out of nowhere and onto the Bioship. Bioship starts drifting. Scimitar begins firing on the Bioship while cloaked. The Enterprise decloaks and begins firing randomly. Enterprise gets really lucky hitting the Scimitar with every shot though causing little damage with their antiquated phasers. Scimitar fires back at the Enterprise but is not able to penetrate their armor. Bioship begins regenerating, fires at the Enterprise causing a small penetration in the armor. Scimitar starts firing at the Bioship and the weakened area in Enterprises armor. Enterprise starts taking damage. Bioship fires back at the Scimitar causing a big explosion and destroying it. Bioship fires at the enterprise causing a big explosion and appears to destroy it. Enterprise actually performs a Picard maneuver, jumping to warp while appearing to be destroyed.
Voth board Jem'Hadar battleship and encounter Borg drones. Drones assimilate all the Voth boarding party and then transport onto the Voth City Ship. Voth City ship transports the Jem'Hadar ship outside, fires, and destroys it. Borg drones and Voth fighting on the Voth City ship. Borg capture 10% of the Voth City ship before Voth seal off that area. Bioship comes into the area and fires at the Voth City Ship. Containment is breached and Borg drones start taking over more of the Cith Ship. Voth City ship moves off while pursued by the bioship.
Voth lose control of their ship and the Borg take over, repair all the damage to their ship. Assimilated Voth City Ship comes about and approaches the bioship at ramming speed. Bioship fires at the City Ship and nicks it before bioship is rammed and then destroyed. City Ship sustains heavy damage and loses a quarter of their ship to the damages. Borg begin regenerating.
Enterprise decloaks and begins firing at the Assimilated Voth City Ship. Borg try to transport onto the Enterprise but improbable transporter accidents occur and kill each drone they try to transport there. Borg fire at the weakpoints in the Enterprise armor and damages the phase cloak. Borg transport the Enterprise inside the City Ship and dock with it.
Drones begin boarding the Enterprise. Drones enter the bridge and try to assimilate the crew. Borg drones unable to assimilate the crew. Crewmembers walk through the walls. Mccoy disables one of the drones and beams to sickbay with the crew. Crew invent a new type of forcefield around sickbay that the Borg have trouble penetrating. Mccoy reverse-engineers the nanoprobes of Borg Drone using the teacher device. Mccoy reprograms the drone to assimilate the other Borg with the modified nanoprobes. Federation drone is transported out of sickbay and begins assimilating Borg Drones into the Federation Voth Borg Collective.
Enterprise crew releases airborne federation borg nanoprobes throughout the Enterprise assimilating the Voth Borg Drones. Federation Assimilated Voth Borg Drones board the Borg Assimilated Voth City Ship and begin assimilating it. Borg begin firing at the Enterprise. Federation Borg shields activate around the Enterprise. Enterprise projects holograms of itself in 6 places confusing the Borg City Ship. Borg begin firing at the holograms. Enterprise repairs and actives the phase cloak and leaves City Ship. Federation Voth Borg Drones continue to assimilate the Borg Assimilated City Ship. Borg lose control of the Voth City Ship. Federation Voth Borg Drones assimilate the Voth City Ship. Federation Voth Borg activate the self destruct and destroy the City Ship. Enterprise wins.
The Borg cube begins scanning each ship with a polaron beam. The Enterprise deploys the armor and raises its shields. The Jem'Hadar Battleship begins firing on the Borg cube. Reman Warbird Scimitar activates its cloaking device and moves away from the Borg cube. The Borg cube locks on a tractor beam onto the Jem'Hadar battleship. Species 8472 fires at the Borg cube causing it to deactivate its tractor beam on the Jem'Hadar. The Jem'Hadar move off while firing at both the Borg cube and Species 8472. Species 8472 fires at the Jem'Hadar causing it to start spinning and losing control of their ship.
The Scimitar begins firing while cloaked at the Bioship, Borg, and Voth all at once. The Bioship, Borg, and Voth start firing at each other in the confusion. The Borg Cube transports 50 drones onto the Jem'Hadar ship and moves off. The Voth City Ship transports the Jem'Hadar battleship and Enterprise inside of it. The Enterprise activates its phase cloak and moves out of the Voth ship.
The Borg Cube fires at the Bioship. The Bioship fires back destroying the Borg Cube. A green mist gets sprayed out of nowhere and onto the Bioship. Bioship starts drifting. Scimitar begins firing on the Bioship while cloaked. The Enterprise decloaks and begins firing randomly. Enterprise gets really lucky hitting the Scimitar with every shot though causing little damage with their antiquated phasers. Scimitar fires back at the Enterprise but is not able to penetrate their armor. Bioship begins regenerating, fires at the Enterprise causing a small penetration in the armor. Scimitar starts firing at the Bioship and the weakened area in Enterprises armor. Enterprise starts taking damage. Bioship fires back at the Scimitar causing a big explosion and destroying it. Bioship fires at the enterprise causing a big explosion and appears to destroy it. Enterprise actually performs a Picard maneuver, jumping to warp while appearing to be destroyed.
Voth board Jem'Hadar battleship and encounter Borg drones. Drones assimilate all the Voth boarding party and then transport onto the Voth City Ship. Voth City ship transports the Jem'Hadar ship outside, fires, and destroys it. Borg drones and Voth fighting on the Voth City ship. Borg capture 10% of the Voth City ship before Voth seal off that area. Bioship comes into the area and fires at the Voth City Ship. Containment is breached and Borg drones start taking over more of the Cith Ship. Voth City ship moves off while pursued by the bioship.
Voth lose control of their ship and the Borg take over, repair all the damage to their ship. Assimilated Voth City Ship comes about and approaches the bioship at ramming speed. Bioship fires at the City Ship and nicks it before bioship is rammed and then destroyed. City Ship sustains heavy damage and loses a quarter of their ship to the damages. Borg begin regenerating.
Enterprise decloaks and begins firing at the Assimilated Voth City Ship. Borg try to transport onto the Enterprise but improbable transporter accidents occur and kill each drone they try to transport there. Borg fire at the weakpoints in the Enterprise armor and damages the phase cloak. Borg transport the Enterprise inside the City Ship and dock with it.
Drones begin boarding the Enterprise. Drones enter the bridge and try to assimilate the crew. Borg drones unable to assimilate the crew. Crewmembers walk through the walls. Mccoy disables one of the drones and beams to sickbay with the crew. Crew invent a new type of forcefield around sickbay that the Borg have trouble penetrating. Mccoy reverse-engineers the nanoprobes of Borg Drone using the teacher device. Mccoy reprograms the drone to assimilate the other Borg with the modified nanoprobes. Federation drone is transported out of sickbay and begins assimilating Borg Drones into the Federation Voth Borg Collective.
Enterprise crew releases airborne federation borg nanoprobes throughout the Enterprise assimilating the Voth Borg Drones. Federation Assimilated Voth Borg Drones board the Borg Assimilated Voth City Ship and begin assimilating it. Borg begin firing at the Enterprise. Federation Borg shields activate around the Enterprise. Enterprise projects holograms of itself in 6 places confusing the Borg City Ship. Borg begin firing at the holograms. Enterprise repairs and actives the phase cloak and leaves City Ship. Federation Voth Borg Drones continue to assimilate the Borg Assimilated City Ship. Borg lose control of the Voth City Ship. Federation Voth Borg Drones assimilate the Voth City Ship. Federation Voth Borg activate the self destruct and destroy the City Ship. Enterprise wins.
Voth wins
A little fantasy never hurt anyone
Hey, I'm not objecting to the fantasy; I love who-would-win analysis, and I'm a big "DeathBattle" fan.
I'm just saying that this specific one is so complicated that I don't think you can actually figure out an answer, because it's entirely unpredictable. There is no way to answer it, because it could be dependent on things as arbitrary as who is where at the start of things. Just swapping around the position of two ships could lead to an entirely different result.
The only weapon we have seen even effect 8472 ships is the nano tech invented by Voyager's crew, which according to the lovey diagram is not on the Ent's specs and they have now have countermeasures to.
We know the Borg can't touch them and Dominion tech is not all that fundamentally beyond the Federation's, in many ways seemingly behind. this leaves the Voth as an unknown, but we've seen nothing from them to suggest the sorts of feats which 8472 are capable of.
We know the Borg can't touch them and Dominion tech is not all that fundamentally beyond the Federation's, in many ways seemingly behind. this leaves the Voth as an unknown, but we've seen nothing from them to suggest the sorts of feats which 8472 are capable of.
But it is still only a single bioship with a single pilot most likely. The Hirogen were able to take on a single bioship and a Borg cube rammed a bioship to destroy it that way. The radiation weapon on the simitar may be able to affect the Bioship since it attacks organic matter. The teacher device could give them access to ways to defend against the Bioship too.
Ramming is a desperation ploy and every other encounter between the two has been overwhelmingly in favour of 84712, The Ent would do nowhere near the same amount of damage as the tactical cube did. The Teacher device is the product of a society that had no knowledge of 8472, fluidic space or their technology so would be unlikely to offer anything to help.
The Hirogen sadly aren't one of the choices
The Hirogen sadly aren't one of the choices
Ramming is a desperation ploy and every other encounter between the two has been overwhelmingly in favour of 84712, The Ent would do nowhere near the same amount of damage as the tactical cube did. The Teacher device is the product of a society that had no knowledge of 8472, fluidic space or their technology so would be unlikely to offer anything to help.
The Hirogen sadly aren't one of the choices
The builders may have been aware of species 8472. They had more surgical knowledge than the EMH doctor who devised a defense them. Species 8472 was vulnerable to the vulcan nerve pinch and the conventional weapons of the hirogen. Species 8472 also has to get past the phase cloak and armor technology of the enterprise and stop themselves from being rammed by another ship.
Based on the most probable protagonist perspective, I'd say the Enterprise.
Based on the actual capabilities we've seen, I'd say probably the Voth.
Based on the actual capabilities we've seen, I'd say probably the Voth.
The Vulcan Nerve pinch shouldn't really be a factor given that the scenario is explicitly ship v ship.
My problem with the idea of the Teacher device is that we are told clearly that 8472 have had no prior knowledge of our reality. Whilst it is possible the builders covertly entered fluidic space at some stage and observed 8472 without making contact per se we would really be theorising outside of the canon there. Occams Razor would suggest no contact between the two and thus little for the devices to offer.
Again the Hirogen aren't one of the options and we don't have anything like full knowledge of how their "conventional weapons" work in relation to the physics of other spatial planes. Everything we have seen of Borg and 24th century Federation weapons suggest immunity.
The phase cloak and armour are interesting points, but the fact remains neither would give the ENT any offensive capability, merely a means to slow the bioship down and/or hide.
I'm still going for 8472 based on observed feats.
Species 8472 and the bioship is organic. In episode "Prey", the Hirogen chased species 8472 for six months. The bioship became weak and fire power did no damage to the Hirogen vessel as a result. Then species 8472 had to abandon the bioship and attack them directly. I'd say the longer the battle goes on the less of a chance species 8472 has. With all the special tech of the enterprise and the tech of the others there is potential for a battle like this to go on for quite a while.
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