Spoilers The Flash - Season 3

[matthunter]

"Reserve Flash" is probably even more demeaning to call Wally than "Kid Flash"

Seriously though, didn't Barry escape Zoom's cage via vibrating his molecules, and isn't that the thing Thawne's kinda shown he's really good at since that first "kali ma!" incident?

 

[tomalak301]

That part bugged me as well. I'm not sure what to make of this episode. I'll try to withhold judgment until we learn more.

I'm starting to get confused with all the time travel stuff. You have remnants, death eaters, or something like that and it's like with all the times Barry has traveled in time, the universe should be pretty fractured by now.

 

[Mr Light]

Yeah, I was really confused about the cage that can contain Reverse Flash for months. Even if Zoom made one in Earth-2, how would Barry know how to make it? And he never managed to get out despite trying for months? That was way too convenient.

 

[Christopher]

Yeah, I was really confused about the cage that can contain Reverse Flash for months. Even if Zoom made one in Earth-2, how would Barry know how to make it?

I figured it was the same containment tech they use in the STAR Labs pipeline to negate metahuman powers. We know that Barry understands that technology, because in Supergirl: "Worlds Finest," there was a throwaway line about the Flash giving the National City Police Department the means to contain metahumans like Livewire and Silver Banshee.

 

[Phoenix219]

Nowhere in any of my post did I compare it to the "Flashpoint" comic or the many impossible things from it. There is no way this was ever going to be like the comic story, and I never wanted it to be - this episode fails completely all on its own.

 

[Mudd]

The resolution of story points on the DC shows tends to be pretty perfunctory; I guess that's not what they're selling.

Nice appearance by Jay Garrick, and clever that he intercepted Barry in 1990. Wonder who he was before he started dicking around with time?

 

[Mr Light]

Interesting episode; didn't go where I expected. When we learned even more differences, I just assumed he'd go back to reset the timeline again, becoming the bright red Flash we saw in the first season finale who stops 1X23 Barry from saving his mom. But no. They stuck with it. Kudos for stick with consequences.... but.... I really miss happy funny Cisco. And I don't like Iris and Joe hating on each other. So that's unfortunate.

I was also surprised to see the Rival immediately in action against the Flash, acting just like the Flashpoint version. And even more surprised when Dr. Alchemy actually appeared to the Flash. I figured that wouldn't happen until the winter finale!

 

[sojourner]

1990.

1996. Dawson's Creek on the TV was an injoke for Shipp.

 

[DigificWriter]

^ Jay dragged Barry out of time in 1998, not 1996. He flat-out says it when Barry asks him where they are.

 

[sojourner]

Ah, I mis-heard it.

 

[DigificWriter]

^ It's all good.

I don't know if anybody else picked up on this, but the reveal that Diggle's daughter is now a son seems to indicate that when the Legends got knocked out of time and ended up in 2026, they entered a "post-Flashpoint" future, which I find kind of neat.

 

[Dick Whitman]

^ It's all good.

I don't know if anybody else picked up on this, but the reveal that Diggle's daughter is now a son seems to indicate that when the Legends got knocked out of time and ended up in 2026, they entered a "post-Flashpoint" future, which I find kind of neat.

I never even thought of that. Good observation.

 

[Christopher]

This was better than last week, though I'm not crazy about the premise. Both Eureka and Fringe made the "permanent timeline change" idea work, but it bugs me here, perhaps because the setup for it was clumsier, or because I'm concerned with how it works in the context of a multi-series shared universe. (Are they really going to permanently change the sex of Diggle's kid? That would seem like a continuity error to anyone watching just Arrow by itself.) Although it was cool to see Barry going to Felicity for advice. Which served the additional purpose of establishing that Arrow's continuity wouldn't be changed aside from that one thing. Good idea to address it there so that Arrow can carry on without needing to bother explaining something from another show. (Aside from that one thing. Weird!)

Anyway, it seems that the team relationships are getting back to normal by the end of the episode, so we're mostly back to where we were before, with a few alterations. Cisco has his sonic powers mastered, Caitlin has powers now, and Barry has a literal and figurative Draco Malfoy to contend with at work. And Doctor Alchemy could provide Wally a way to get his Kid Flash powers from Flashpoint.

It surprised me when the characters talked about not wanting to know what their lives were like in Flashpoint. I thought that Barry in the earlier scene was offering to tell them about their lives pre-Flashpoint, before he broke things.

I'm glad the Rival was just a 2-episode threat -- I didn't want another speedster big bad. Looks like Doctor Alchemy still has some connection to the Flashpoint reality, though. It bugs me that basically everything that's happened in this series has revolved around Barry -- the result of either his actions or the actions of enemies targeting him. Modern TV may be more character-driven and arc-based, but it also tends to be more self-centered, with heroes dealing more with their personal drama than with helping others. Here, the Flash is helping others, but mainly he's protecting them from the consequences of his own problems.

Nice to see Jay again. He's an interesting character to have, a veteran speedster/hero who's been where Barry is and can offer advice. His presence implies that it's fairly easy for speedsters to cross universes, which should be useful for Supergirl crossovers.

 

[kirk55555]

I've had to catch up since I didn't watch episode 1 the day it premiered. So, Episode 1 was basically completely skippable, a time travel episode with an obvious reset button (that didn't reset enough, ironically) that doesn't even tell a good enough story to make the 40 minutes worth watching (especially since it all gets recapped in Episode 2). I'm glad I just skimmed it, I'm completely done with "Barry f&*^s up time" episodes.

Then, Episode 2 ruins half the good characters on the show, making Cisco dark and broody and making Joe/Iris have a generic "troubled relationship", because Arrow isn't the only show Berlanti will turn into a soap opera. Nothing goes from amazing to crap as fast as a show Greg berlanti is messing with To make Episode 2 worse, it has Felicity in it. Is this just the TV season where every good to great superhero show becomes complete crap? Maybe this means the qualities of shows are flipping, and Supergirl and Arrow might become good? Actually, forget that. There isn't a universe where those shows aren't garbage.

I'm not going to give up on The Flash, but it better, at the very least, restore the real Cisco. Either with time travel or just having him get over his stupid brooding phase they've put him in. Going from the second best Flash character (in a show were the worst main cast member, Iris, is still decent) to being an outright terrible character is a shocking drop for the character. I mean, again, its a Berlanti show so I should have expected it, but The Flash has never really suffered from the same garbage Arrow (post Season 2) and Supergirl have. It was only a matter of time, apparently. Well, at least it still has a better cast then Arrow or Supergirl, outside of Cisco being terrible now.

 

[DigificWriter]

The way they're handling the "post-Flashpoint" timeline reminds me of the way Buffy the Vampire Slayer handled the introduction of Dawn: treating things as they are now as if that's the way they've always been, which works really well.

 

[sojourner]

LOL, you really should charge people to read these insane rants.

 

[kirk55555]

The way they're handling the "post-Flashpoint" timeline reminds me of the way Buffy the Vampire Slayer handled the introduction of Dawn: treating things as they are now as if that's the way they've always been, which works really well.

I remember that. The worst character in the Buffy franchise introduced in the worst season of any Joss Whedon show. But, they did it smoothly, I guess. Introducing a character for the sole purpose of giving Buffy an annoying brat to constantly rescue was not a great decision, but they could have done it worse.

LOL, you really should charge people to read these insane rants.

I guess "insane rant" = "opinion someone doesn't agree with". Its a forum, sometimes opinions opposite of your own will be posted

 

[DigificWriter]

I remember that. The worst character in the Buffy franchise introduced in the worst season of any Joss Whedon show.

My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle.

Calling the 5th season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer "the worst season of any Joss Whedon show" is the strangest and most inexplicable thing you've said to date.

 

[sojourner]

I guess "insane rant" = "opinion someone doesn't agree with".

Nope. There is definitely a difference.

 

[kirk55555]

My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle.

Calling the 5th season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer "the worst season of any Joss Whedon show" is the strangest and most inexplicable thing you've said to date.

Its a season where I legitimately (with no hyperbole, and I know I have a tendency to get a bit hyperbolic sometimes) can't think of a single episode I liked. I hated the main villain, really disliked Dawn and the whole "Key" plot, and thought that the fan favorite episode (The Body) was mediocre and easily the most overrated episode of the show. I tried to rewatch it when I got the season on DVD (for very cheap, I probably wouldn't have gotten it otherwise) and I can't even get through it a second time. That's all just my opinion, but I easily consider it the worst Joss Whedon thing I've seen.

Nope. There is definitely a difference.

Well, since I didn't post an "insane rant", just an opinion different then yours, I guess I just don't know what you mean.


Also, back on the topic of the thread, since I've cooled down a bit after watching episode 2 I can say a few good things about it. The Jay Garrick scene was great, Caitlin's secret is interesting, its nice to see Cisco have some control of his powers and I did seem to breeze past the fact that Joe/Iris fixed their relationship at the end, so that's one less negative for the episode. On the other hand, Alchemy (who I forgot to mention) is another "character in name and power only", like Atom Smasher and Dr. Light from last season, but at least its a name actually used by a villain and he seems to have an interesting plan. So, even though he's nothing like the actual Dr. Alchemy, at least he's an interesting villain.