What are your thoughts about seeing the prime universe again?

[jaime]

That didn't make a lot of sense...did you just use the word to define the word? Pretty sure that's not how it works.

It does make sense when you put it in context of the conversation he was having 'some people think prime means x' 'no, to me, prime means prime'.
Pretty sure that is how it works. Also, Wheatons law applies extra when there is a danger of actually being wrong.

 

[jaime]

Doesn't make sense to me either. By definition, "post-Nemesis" would be the prime timeline, because "Nemesis" was a movie made in the prime timeline.

Technically the entire Kelvin Timeline is also post Nemesis, both as it was made after, and because Old Spock and Nero, instigators and antagonist, were from that continuity. Time Travel's a bastiche.

 

[jaime]

You know, I don't think you meant to imply the Prime universe is a brainless, shambling, and rotting member of the undead - making one last desperate grasp at sticking its teeth into the brains of innocent passerby.

Not to say that wasn't an appropriate description at times, but it seems a wee-but harsh.

If you prefer you think of it as Lestat.

 

[Trekkin]

If you prefer you think of it as Lestat.

You meant that it's second appearance should have also been its last?

 

[skip bittman]

I don't expect everybody to love Zombie Trek, what with the stench -- but it's welcome to gnaw on my flesh whenever!

 

[jaime]

You meant that it's second appearance should have also been its last?

Hmm. Good point. Though I am a purist. His first should have been his last. I still kept going. Blood Canticle was the Nemesis of Anne Rice novels.

 

[Rahul]

After reading through two of those threads linked earlier, it's hard to take some of these voices seriously who were wrong on almost every condescending point made for several years. Points argued from a position of authority that was never earned, with maximum nastiness employed. Small wonder there's an "I told you so!" thread, then. It's a great franchise and usually the fans are ok, but the GLEE exhibited by those doing an extended dance on Prime's grave was a bit much and desperately premature.

Good thing a hand came out of the grave and grabbed their ankle, then. Prime lives!

Considering the talent involved, Discovery is going to be a blast to discuss! I lurked here starting at the tail end of Enterprise but damn -- I won't be missing the fun this time around! This time with an ignore filter, thank gawd.

It will be interesting to also see how a floundering Kelvin continues at an even flounder-ier Paramount, but nowhere near as interesting as discussing proper TV Trek!

Yeah, that's pretty much it.

It was quite annoying to hear all those "prime is dead and you are stupid for believing it will EVER return" posts that have completely taken over any serious discussion, not by the number of people believing it, but by the sheer number of useless, condescending, often only one-word posts with which they flooded literally all threads.

The most sad part is that now, after it turned out they were wrong, they still refuse to aknowledge reality, and rather critizise, badmouth and outright hope for failure of the new Trek show, just so that they don't have to deal with "being wrong". Yeah, that happens. But because of the sheer aggressiveness and sometimes downright awfulness with which they represented their (now confirmed wrong) theories makes it hard for some people to aknowledge the new reality, and they would rather burn everything down than admitting any wrong-being on their part.

I know this thread is gloating. And I'm not a fan of that. But what many of those "prime-is-dead" people are now posting here is not only just worse, it's downright stupid.

At least it was most of the time. This current page has become downright civil. That's something new. We should try that more often.

 

[BillJ]

...badmouth and outright hope for failure of the new Trek show...

Would you care to quote a post where anyone has badmouthed Discovery or hoped for its failure?

 

[Finn]

I wonder if it's just how he interprets posts. Some people do have an issue with interpreting intent, tone, things like that in a conversation. I've seen folks interpret negatively when the conversation was actually neutral or positive.

Otherwise, Rahul should cite like Billj suggested

 

[jaime]

I wonder if it's just how he interprets posts. Some people do have an issue with interpreting intent, tone, things like that in a conversation. I've seen folks interpret negatively when the conversation was actually neutral or positive.

Otherwise, Rahul should cite like Billj suggested

Nah, it's an Internet forum, not an academic paper. Besides the fastest thing to do to find the original things he is talking about is to scroll through those forums until you see benedict cumberbatch staring at you and read around those areas.

There was much.....celestial templery going on.

This thread is much better, and has actual discussion happening. Most of the posts that seem...aggressive, adversarial, were later softened or clarified by such discussion. Apart from the goalpost moving ones...but at least those are pleasant, conversational and don't involve Benedict bloody Cumberbatches face.

He was in spooks you know.

 

[BillJ]

Nah, it's an Internet forum, not an academic paper. Besides the fastest thing to do to find the original things he is talking about is to scroll through those forums until you see benedict cumberbatch staring at you and read around those areas.

It would need to be in this forum, as most of the threads submitted were made before Discovery was ever announced.

 

[Trekkin]

Nah, it's an Internet forum, not an academic paper. Besides the fastest thing to do to find the original things he is talking about is to scroll through those forums until you see benedict cumberbatch staring at you and read around those areas.

Funny enough, refusing to provide evidence for a claim pretty much invites a Cumbernope response. The freely asserted is freely deserted.

You don't have to back up an accusation, but then you cannot complain about the subsequent piercing and cheekboney glare. Which is apparently a bad thing to look at, and is not sexy and smouldering at all.

 

[Marsden]

There's one thing I noticed, I looked up what Bryan Fuller actually said. I can't find that quote now, dammit, but it said the time frame is ten years before the original series.

Well, there is no original series in the Kelvin timeline. I think the word Prime isn't even needed after that.


Why it matters to me, I really like the original setting, I didn't want to see it die but it sure seemed dead to me after ST'09 so I assumed it was many of the things I loved that was cancelled, like Star Trek was originally in 68. So having it continue with some people that also like it but aren't also chained to it, i.e. they aren't going to slavishly follow it to satisfy some guy somewhere but let the story flow to be as best as it's possible, then I'm very happy. Star Trek is something I love and I am looking forward to see how these developments affect the whole universe, but I'm also looking forward to how they stand on their own. And how it stands on it's own is by far more important.

And as far as reimagining, he's said there is a woman commander, presumably Human. Isn't that a bit of a reimagining already? While I don't believe it was ever an actual thing in Star Trek, there wasn't a woman captain shown in the original series or the animated either. So there's that. Plus, new make up techniques and different materials for uniforms are available now. Computers and internet are things that didn't exist when Star Trek was made, if the crew has better displays than the original's pictures on the walls representing screen, that's a reimagining, too. It's still in the same universe though, and can sit together with the others. So I'm happy the story isn't over.

 

[Kemaiku]

If you prefer you think of it as Lestat.

I take it you won't be buying Lestat in Atlantis when it comes out in November?

 

[Mr Awe]

And with the wave of a magic wand, a few chicken scratches, and an attaboy, all that can easily be changed.

There is nothing inherently exclusive to the Primeverse or the Kelvinverse or the Discoverse or the multiverse or the reverse or the unicornverse.

Nothing.

That's not true at all. Each universe has it's own history which affects how the drama unfolds. We saw how Kirk losing his father changed his character, how he grew up, and why/how he joined Starfleet. It had lasting implications--even going into ST: Beyond. So, no, you can't just hand wave it all away.

Mr Awe

 

[Rincewiend]

Nah, it's an Internet forum, not an academic paper. Besides the fastest thing to do to find the original things he is talking about is to scroll through those forums until you see benedict cumberbatch staring at you and read around those areas.

There was much.....celestial templery going on.

This thread is much better, and has actual discussion happening. Most of the posts that seem...aggressive, adversarial, were later softened or clarified by such discussion. Apart from the goalpost moving ones...but at least those are pleasant, conversational and don't involve Benedict bloody Cumberbatches face.

He was in spooks you know.

Nah, i want proof...
How many people where going "PrimeTrek is Dead! Deal With IT!"?
And if they where as annoying as Rahul or Visitor1982 are now...
Personally o thought PrimeTrek was comatose and a new show set between 2 existing ones might not be the best premise/idea, especially when one of the shows it will be set between was a prequel show that was hampered by canon...

 

[CorporalClegg]

So, no, you can't just hand wave it all away.

Writers do this all the time.

 

[jaime]

Nah, i want proof...
How many people where going "PrimeTrek is Dead! Deal With IT!"?
And if they where as annoying as Rahul or Visitor1982 are now...
Personally o thought PrimeTrek was comatose and a new show set between 2 existing ones might not be the best premise/idea, especially when one of the shows it will be set between was a prequel show that was hampered by canon...

He linked up to the forums, there was plenty. I even gave you a tongue in cheek way to single out those sections that are most likely to contain the posts. Unsurprisingly I was in those discussions myself, putting out logical reasons why I felt the Prime Universe wasn't done with. So, if it helps, you can take my word for it, there were angry tribbles aplenty, and manners left the building.

 

[jaime]

I take it you won't be buying Lestat in Atlantis when it comes out in November?

Oh I will be....I was fifty on fifty on prince Lestat. It was definitely a step up on the last one, and felt like someone doing an Anne Rice impression. Plus I like the Halloween Tradition of a new chronicles to read. Reminds me of when I was young and naive and confused people without having to type.

Also...with that title, we could be deep into borderline self parody, like the second half of the last one. She'll probably kill off someone from the last book just cos she can't be arsed, and at some point there will be an allegory or message so thinly veiled it will be obscene.

 

[mos6507]

All the logic on Vulcan said that the "prime" continuity was dead and going to stay dead. Believing otherwise and being right (remains to be seen) is nothing more than a case of the broken clock being right twice a day.

All the logic on Vulcan said that a TV show would not happen, period. Remember this story from as early as last year?

http://www.blastr.com/2015-4-30/jonathan-frakes-addresses-rumors-star-trek-tv-series

What people outside of showbiz can't seem to understand is that while yes, Hollywood may be dominated by bean-counters, green-light decisions in Hollywood are not always predictable.