• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Alien 5: An Open Message About Newt, Hicks, and Bishop

Yeah, when Cameron made 'Aliens', all he had to go on was the theatrical cut of 'Alien', so the deleted scene is a non-issue, even if he knew it existed (which I doubt) and even if he did, the audience going to see his film hadn't. Therefore, it's irrelevant.

So what he did was a perfectly valid extrapolation of what the *theatrical cut* of the first movie portrayed and provided a neat way to drastically up the stakes in the final act by showing a bigger, badder version of the title creature.

Indeed, for better or worse, each film has made a point of showing their own unique version from the quadriplegic dog-alien in '3', to the Newborn in 'Resurrection', to even the Pred-Alien in those god awful AvP movies and kinda-sorta whatever that thing was at the end of 'Prometheus'.


He'll Alien Isolation was practically a love letter to the damned film and they pretty much ignored the whole turned into eggs things when they actually bothered to design a corpse for Brett.

Really? That's surprising. I would have thought given it's re-insertion in the Director's Cut that they would have gone with it, given the opportunity.

I'm firmly with Reverend.

Except I loathe the movie. I went with friends who were equally big fans and we adjourned to the pub immediately afterwards. After picking apart its many flaws and shortcomings, we basically sat there with our heads in our hands muttering 'How could they...'

For me, liking or not liking a film is just a personal preference, not a lifestyle choice that must be defended to the death. I'd be delusional if I didn't acknowledge that 'Alien 3' is a *deeply* flawed masterpiece of cinema.

For the record I also rather liked 'Prometheus', despite it being painfully obvious that Scott hacked the plot to near unintelligible levels in the editing room in order to get the kind of pacing he wanted. Poorly explained motivations, characters acting stupidly because the plot demands it (there's those darn contrivances again!) and a very unsatisfactory pay-off that amounts to a one-sided conversation with a god...huh...actually, I think I may have just got the point of that last one.

Still, it's a mess, but I liked it anyway. Noomi Rapace does a very good job of carrying the movie, Michael Fassbender puts in one of the best android performances since Robin Williams in 'Bicentennial Man' (sorry Alan Tudyk.) Charlize Theron and Idris Elba do a fine job with what little they're given to work with. And of course Guy Pearce who may just be the most underrated A-list actor in Hollywood.
And of course, the production design and cinematography is *amazing*.
 
Last edited:
The Alien taking some of their appearance from their host wasn't something invented by Alien 3 though.
 
And of course Guy Pearce who may just be the most underrated A-list actor in Hollywood.
Guy Pearce's characterization of Peter Weyland in the TED Talk viral video was amazing; as good as anything Michael Fassbender did as David. That is the Peter Weyland I wanted to see in Prometheus. He would have helped to make it a better movie. But he got lost and wasted in the hack job.

I would expect a professional like Ridley Scott to know the price of editing for pacing at the expense of story. I would expect him to be fully aware of the balance and exactly what he was doing. I don't see pacing and beauty as any excuse. It's kind of like the difference between manslaughter and premeditated murder.
 
Last edited:
Really? That's surprising. I would have thought given it's re-insertion in the Director's Cut that they would have gone with it, given the opportunity.

Well its from the crew expendable DLC, and that was already taking a few liberties from the part of the film it covers aka the trying to run the Alien out of the vents and into the airlock.

Such as being able to pick from Dallas, Ripley, or Parker, and the plan getting all the way to the getting the Alien in the airlock.
 
^Perhaps one might argue at that point, it hadn't begun cocooning him yet? When Ripley found them later, Dallas was already mostly consumed (and still alive) and Brett couldn't have been there much more than a few hours longer. Either way the process can't take long as the whole film basically takes place over little more than a 24 hour period.

Interesting that none of the films ever really covered how the cocooning process works.
Perhaps it's something like a separate organism, that once secreted can spread and grow all by itself, like the black goo in Prometheus, but more directed and specialised? The crazy DNA recombination and tissue mutation is certainly consistent.

The whole room on the Nostromo was covered in the stuff, not to mention the nest under the Hadley's Hope atmosphere processor. Plus after they took her, Newt was seemingly instantly covered in the stuff.
Given that just after the xeno took her, Bishop said to Ripley they had another 26 minutes before the reactor blew. You know now that I think about it, allowign for how long it'd take Ripley to get back out to the platform after grabbing Newt, that's a shockingly short amount of time for them to get her back to the nest from the colony (presumably via the service tunnel) and cocoon her. Given that Ripley got there via the dropship, it's a wonder she didn't arrive ahead of Newt!

Makes you wonder if that woman they saw get chest-bursted earlier on had only been captured earlier that day, probably the last colonist to survive other than Newt.
 
I'm firmly with Reverend.

Except I loathe the movie. I went with friends who were equally big fans and we adjourned to the pub immediately afterwards. After picking apart its many flaws and shortcomings, we basically sat there with our heads in our hands muttering 'How could they...'

I was in the booth next to you.

Loathesome piece of shit movie.
 
I'm firmly with Reverend.

Except I loathe the movie. I went with friends who were equally big fans and we adjourned to the pub immediately afterwards. After picking apart its many flaws and shortcomings, we basically sat there with our heads in our hands muttering 'How could they...'

I was in the booth next to you.

Loathesome piece of shit movie.

Was that sobbing noise you ?
 
Re: The Prometheus Japanese novel


Maybe it actually makes sense?

Probably, assuming you can read Japanese.

Seriously though, I have had a look at some of the deleted scenes and the bits of the shooting scripts that were cut or altered and it made a *bit* more sense, though not by much.
The whole "cave painting of the constellation Reticulum somehow leads them directly to a moon of a gas giant orbiting Zeta-2 Reticuli and then they land practically on top of the facility with out so much as an orbital scan" still makes absolutely no sense. Nor does the idea that this race would leave directions to their bio-weapons facility. And the less said about the whole "Jesus was an Engineer and that's why they wanted to kill us all" thing the better.

The Alien taking some of their appearance from their host wasn't something invented by Alien 3 though.

Fell free to point out where exactly where anyone said that it was. Or do you just like smacking around straw men for giggles?
 
Last edited:
Re: The Prometheus Japanese novel


Maybe it actually makes sense?

Probably, assuming you can read Japanese.

Seriously though, I have had a look at some of the deleted scenes and the bits of the shooting scripts that were cut or altered and it made a *bit* more sense, though not by much.

Hasn't anyone else noticed that Ridley Scott's generally a bit er...crap ?

Sorry, heresy I know...
 
I like him, although he has become very self indulgent these days. His movies used to be a lot tighter, up to the Black Rain sort of period, with the excpetion of Legend perhaps. Things started to go wrong in the 90s.
 
When it comes to the nuts and bolts of actual filmaking, there are few who can match him, but yeah, the last 20 years or so he seems to have developed a habit of neglecting the "big picture" stuff like storytelling, characterization and a cohesive narrative in favour of the details of making great shots and set pieces. It's a habit Spielberg has gotten into as well.
But no, he's not "crap". Far from it.
 
Holy Nostromo! and I thought the Star Trek Threads could generate some debate!!! What a Premium Thread. To all who contributed...thank you!...seriously!!!

I had agreements and disagreements, but what I do hope for is a decent outing, and a significant role for Ron Perlman...I know, I know...but was so awfully good!!! :)
 
I thought you all - or many of you - would enjoy this quote from James Cameron at San Diego Comic-Con 2016:
James Cameron said:
I thought it was dumb [that Hicks and Newt were killed off]. I thought it was a huge slap in the face to the fans. I mean look, [David] Fincher’s a friend of mine, and David is an amazing, amazing filmmaker, unquestionably. That was kind of his first big gig, and he was getting vectored around by the studio, and he dropped into the production late and they had a horrible script and they were rewriting it on the fly, and it was just a mess. I think it was a big mistake. So I certainly — had [producer Gale Anne Hurd and I] been involved, we would not have done that because we felt we earned something with the audience with those characters.
http://screenrant.com/aliens-sequel-sigourney-weaver-cameron/

Fox suits were idiots.
 
Where can this franchise go from here?

There are AvP novels set on other planets.

Consider humans encountering both species out there, in a "cold, dark, hard universe", to quote matron 2112.
 
And yet it was cut from the film. Or at least the turning into a egg part was. Which means Cameron was under no obligation to give a flying fuck about it.

It's kind of how deleted scenes work. Otherwise Brett couldn't possibly be an egg after the Alien crushed his skull.

He'll Alien Isolation was practically a love letter to the damned film and they pretty much ignored the whole turned into eggs things when they actually bothered to design a corpse for Brett.



It was cut from the theatrical cut aka the one that most people are likely to have seen. Hell until I bothered to look it up online I thought it was some bullshit some fan made up.

That means making it the defacto explaination comes into similar territory of making someone have to read a tie-in novel because that's where importan plan information was discussed and the film assumes you know this.

I seem to recall after I visited the hive a log in the medical section referencing a corpse becoming an egg.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top