Did Leia use a Force choke to kill Jabba?

[Mr. Laser Beam]

This has always kind of mystified me. Exactly how was Leia able to kill Jabba in ROTJ?

I mean, sure, Leia is no weakling, she has a healthy amount of physical strength. So normally it wouldn't be an issue for her to wrap a chain around somebody's neck and kill them. But Jabba is a Hutt - his entire body is MASSIVE. How could any human being possibly be strong enough to kill him?

The only explanation I can think of is that Leia used a Force choke on Jabba. She is Force sensitive, isn't she?

Leia was no doubt angry enough at Jabba, due to her enslavement, that she could have Force choked him out of sheer rage. (Meaning, she thought she was strangling Jabba with the chain, but she was 'subconciously' Force choking him without even knowing what she's doing.)

OTOH, Force choking might be mostly a Dark Side power, like Force lightning presumably is, but (especially if Leia doesn't yet know she is Force sensitive) she might have accidentally been able to tap into it due to the extreme circumstances.

Thoughts?

 

[Locutus of Bored]

I don't see any reason to make this more complex than it needs to be. She strangled him. He's just a giant slug, so they might be fairly easy to kill.

 

[JoeZhang]

I've checked and she seems to be using a large chain - however if someone could do a 4K screen-grab that might be useful for further investigation.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I don't see any reason to make this more complex than it needs to be. She strangled him. He's just a giant slug, so they might be fairly easy to kill.

Guess it would depend on whether a Hutt's body is mostly muscle or fat.

Although if Hutts are physically weak on their own it would help explain why Jabba is always surrounded by a huge entourage. Without them he might be helpless.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I don't see any reason to make this more complex than it needs to be. She strangled him. He's just a giant slug, so they might be fairly easy to kill.

Agreed. It was a chain. Leia did not display even a single force power in the OT. She had to kill to the best of her regular abilities.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Leia did not display even a single force power in the OT.

Are you sure? I seem to remember a scene or two when she was (at least on some level) aware of Luke and what was happening to him.

 

[TwoJakes]

Leia's ability to sense twin brother would seem to be the totallity of her "force abilities."

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Yeah, Leia heard Luke calling to her in the Force when he was hanging from Cloud City. Her memories of her mother in RotJ could have also been a result of a Force connection, since she died right after giving birth. If you're really stretching it, her "Somehow, I've always known" line when Luke told her he she was his sister could also be an indication of a Force connection between them, though not a very specific one, since it didn't put the brakes on them kissing each other. She just felt a vague connection to him.

 

[Reverend]

I wouldn't go so far as to say she force choked him, but I could buy into the notion that she unknowingly drew some strength from the dark side. The recent 'Bloodline' novel revisits that event and while no direct reference to force use is made, an emphasis on her emotional state was made. Pretty sure the words "hate" and "anger" came into play.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Are you sure? I seem to remember a scene or two when she was (at least on some level) aware of Luke and what was happening to him.

Meaning use the force in the form of action or physical ability, like choking, super-leaping, use of a lightsaber, etc.

 

[The Wormhole]

Also, the aforementioned novel Bloodlines makes it clear Leia doesn't really have any Force abilities beyond an ability to sense certain things. Which is in line with what we see in the movies.

 

[Set Harth]

OTOH, Force choking might be mostly a Dark Side power, like Force lightning presumably is

Force choking, in theory, is just an application of TK, so I don't think it's innately a dark side power in the same way that lightning is said to be. But as an indicator of an emotional state or intention it's clearly somewhat linked to darksiders.

 

[DimesDan]

Didn't Luke kinda force choke the pig like aliens as he was entering Jabba's palace though?

 

[Reverend]

Didn't Luke kinda force choke the pig like aliens as he was entering Jabba's palace though?

It certainly looked that way. When Vader does it though, you can hear bone and cartilage being crushed and they fall down dead.
It seems what Luke did was a little more gentle in that he close their windpipes until they passed out. That or he made their bodies *think* they were choking, causing them to pass out without actually doing any damage.

The idea that certain powers are only dark side and some only light side is more of an old EU video game idea. We saw in AotC & RotS that Yoda (who trained in an era where the Sith were supposedly extinct) is perfectly capable of deflecting and absorbing force lighting. He can probably throw it too if he wanted to. Likewise the very fact that Maul and Vader lived despite their injuries shows that they're not only capable, but very adept at force healing.
Corrupted and turned inward sure, but one imagine the basic principle is the same.

The dark side isn't separate from the light side. They're inexorably interlinked. They both make up the Living Force.


Anyway, as for Leia, while we have seen a number of instances of her empathic abilities, we've no reason to believe she's ever been able or even attempted to use telekinesis.

 

[TwoJakes]

Her memories of her mother in RotJ could have also been a result of a Force connection, since she died right after giving birth

I think that was Leia talking about her adopted step-mother.

 

[Reverend]

I think that was Leia talking about her adopted step-mother.

I thought that until the recent 'Bloodline' book, in which we learn that it was never a secret that Leia was adopted and she was even publicly known to be a war orphan (apparently this doesn't create a problem in terms of royal lineage. The Elder Houses recognise adopted children as every bit the legitimate heirs as a blood relation.) So yeah, Leia always knew that the Organa's weren't her birth parents, so her response to Luke would have to actually be about Padme.

I read somewhere that part of the official thinking on this is that while there may be something of a force impression there (Leia has consistently shown to be more innately force empathic than Luke) part of it may also simply be an artefact of how we retain very early memories.
We all probably have very early ones that we can't be 100% sure are actual memories or something we constructed ourselves at some point from things our parents told us way after the fact.

Plus as Leia said, it's really just images and feelings. It's not like she can remember Padme's face (newborns can't focus their eyes yet, anyway) her last words or that Bail, Obi Wan and Yoda were right there.

Side note: again, according to that novel Leia did find out Padme's identity years prior to that story (which is itself set about 5 years before TFA.) I'm assuming it wasn't long after RotJ.
Once she knew her and Luke's father was Anakin Skywalker, even with most official records missing or altered it probably wouldn't take a huge amount of digging to narrow down who his lover could possibly be. While Anakin's DNA record was "gone" (as stated in the book) but there's a fair bet Padme's was still in the system, if not on Coruscant then on Naboo.

Side side note: apparently Bail did a pretty good job keeping the secret as not even his closest allies knew (though Mon Mothma always suspected, which makes sense.)

 

[Kor]

Are you sure? I seem to remember a scene or two when she was (at least on some level) aware of Luke and what was happening to him.

Her sensitivity to certain things appears to come from her connection to "The Force."

Also see the scene in ROTJ when Luke reveals that he and Leia are brother and sister, and she says, "I know. Somehow I've always known."

...which makes that sloppy kiss in ESB even more wrong.

Kor

 

[Set Harth]

Didn't Luke kinda force choke the pig like aliens as he was entering Jabba's palace though?

Yes, and ( like the color scheme of his clothing ) that is part of a suggestion that Luke could be in danger of turning at some point.

I think that was Leia talking about her adopted step-mother.

Luke makes clear that he is not talking about Breha Organa when he says "your real mother". So we really don't need a book to explain that it's not Leia talking about Breha, that's sufficiently clear from the film.

The idea that certain powers are only dark side and some only light side is more of an old EU video game idea.

It's a Lucas idea. He's referred to lightning as a dark side power in the sense that it identifies a darksider by its usage, something it would not do if it was a universal power. Moreover, there is the fact that in the films it is only lightsiders who ghost, and indeed Anakin's ghosting is used as a signifier of his return to the light, which would not really work if ghosting were a universal power. The Lucas-edited ROTS novelization made it explicit that Sith cannot ghost. The "anything you can do I can do too" approach to Force powers may have been promoted by certain authors in the old EU but we have evidence that Lucas believed differently.

We saw in AotC & RotS that Yoda (who trained in an era where the Sith were supposedly extinct) is perfectly capable of deflecting and absorbing force lighting.

And that is entirely consistent with the approach taken by the video games ( and some textual sources ), in which Yoda's ability here is a power other than lightning, a light side ability known in some games as "Force Absorb".

He can probably throw it too if he wanted to.

But would he, if it means using the dark side in a way that the Jedi, as a rule, abhor?

Likewise the very fact that Maul and Vader lived despite their injuries shows that they're not only capable, but very adept at force healing.

Speaking of Vader, in Shadows of the Empire, Force healing is a dark side ability. Of course, other authors and the video games rushed to the overly simplistic fantasy-RPG stance of "healing = good". In any event, not all abilities are side-specific, it is just that side-specific abilities exist.

I read somewhere that part of the official thinking on this is that while there may be something of a force impression there (Leia has consistently shown to be more innately force empathic than Luke) part of it may also simply be an artefact of how we retain very early memories.

I'd be interested to know where this notion has been expressed as official thinking. As we know, the original intention was that Leia's memories were supposed to be from the few years that Leia spent with Padme, before the prequels retconned the timing of Padme's death. Assuming that Leia actually retains memories from the birthing chamber is something of an untenable leap, especially given that it is arguably unnecessary given what we know about the Force, nor does Leia's brief description in ROTJ really match what was going on with Padme in that room on Polis Massa.

 

[Ithekro]

It does match what Padme was going through on her way from Coruscant to Mustafar, and possibly for much of the pregnancy.

 

[Reverend]

I'd be interested to know where this notion has been expressed as official thinking. As we know, the original intention was that Leia's memories were supposed to be from the few years that Leia spent with Padme, before the prequels retconned the timing of Padme's death. Assuming that Leia actually retains memories from the birthing chamber is something of an untenable leap, especially given that it is arguably unnecessary given what we know about the Force, nor does Leia's brief description in ROTJ really match what was going on with Padme in that room on Polis Massa.

"Official" may on reflection be too strong a word. I'm fairly certain it was something Pablo Hidalgo said recently, but I can't really find the source just now. Even if I'm recalling correctly, it only points to the LFSG's inclination which may change by the time some form of explanation shows up in canon.

Still, the fact is that the current canon states that Leia being adopted was never kept secret. Not from Leia and not from anyone else. Only her true parentage was hidden. So when Luke asks her about her "real mother", her response can't be in reference to her adoptive mother.

Personally, I'm fine with the idea that Leia had a force sense-memory of Padme while Luke did not. Whether intentional or not, she's been consistently shown to have an innate talent for empathic sense, without any training. Sensing Luke's call on Bespin. Sensing the truth of Luke's admission on Endor. Sensing that he survived the second Death Star's destruction. Even in the recent post ANH comics there's a beat where she feels the echo of both Padme and Maul while on Naboo. And of course there's her reaction in TFA.

Now I'm not saying Luke has no such ability, just that perhaps Leia's is considerably stronger.