Star Trek Beyond pays homage to TOS

[Malaika]

Look at it the other way - Uhura is a strong enough character to get her own story arc, rather than having to tag along with one of the "main" characters.

If there is a supposed 'story arc' for Uhura, we surely have no clue about that since every time Pegg talks about the movie he's all about the male characters and their plot.
Besides, for the sake of continuity, Uhura already has a story arc about her relationship with one of the leads, and a dynamic with the other. Completely ignoring them would be lame not to mention unnecessary if really their good heart's intention is giving her a story. It's also lame to believe she cannot do both and that she can be 'strong' only if some things are mutually exclusive.

Neverthless, frankly no one but Kirk and, secondarily (as we saw in stid), Spock can get their own story and too much screentime unless they interact with the main characters (and even kirk and spock have a dynamic together). Pretending otherwise is a lie. If my point was invalid, Pegg wouldn't need to make it so that Spock spends most of his screentime with Mccoy, nor he'd need to have the kirk/scotty friendship and dynamic he talks about.
The tos movies too had the bad habit of keeping k/s away from the rest and do a 'pair the spares' with the secondary characters that end up having no relevant story arc.

That's actually the opposite of what he was like.

I didn't mean that Chris was being negative or criticizing the movie. He wasn't. They mentioned him that Pegg said there is more to the movie than what we saw in the trailer and Chris stated that well, the movie is indeed action and fun.
His answer comes across, to me, as not disagreeing with Pegg but also not agreeing that the trailer is all lies.

 

[Dales]

re: Malaika,

As star trek is about space explorers and is in the genre of scifi and not romance, we should be worried about Uhura's story arc as a linguist officer. this is her most important continuity. the same with kirk, spock and bones. captain, doctor and first officer.

The first movie was not praised for uhura’s elevated if we solely define her elevated role by been Spock’s girlfriend and I would not say she and Kirk were close for most of ST09. She got on the enterprise's oval office because of Captain Pike. he posted her there not because of Kirk or Spock.

I don’t think fans and critics praised uhura soley because she is now with Spock or because Kirk was trying to get into her pants either.

I never said Uhura needed to be single. I said she does not need to be in a romance to be a good female lead because a romance does not determine if she is a good female character. I do agree that it is unnecessary to get rid of the romance but the romance was not even necessary in the first place.

Its interesting you bring up how kirk and spock was never meant to be this epic friendship that it became but spock and uhura were not the couple that orci originally selected. His first choice was spock and chapel but he swapped it with spock and uhura for writing convenience and after watching some of their scenes in TOS but his first choice was Spock/Chapel because she was the one that openly liked Spock in TOS.

I don’t see the ill straw argument I clearly debunked the myth that women of colour when they are cast in big budget films are not romantic interests. There is halle berry, Whitney Houston, jada smith, vivica fox, Penelope Cruz, Salma Hayek, Eva Mendes and Aaliyah. One thing I know from Hollywood is as long as the woman is beautiful regardless of her skin colour, she is bound to attract men of all races, sizes and shapes.

You also seem to ignore the reality that star wars would have been huge regardless of who was cast. Star wars is not successful because of diverse casting. Anyone can be in star wars even a person that does not speak English and the film will be huge because it is star wars. You have comfortably ignored how huge star wars is regardless of the characters and you used star wars to attack star trek as nothing more but white dudes clubs even questioning the legacy of star trek for this new generation which was very unfair.All Star trek fans would tell you that star trek has never matched star wars in terms of global popularity and commercial sucess. it is not about trek having white dudes.

On TV we have had two black women snatch the golden globe and emmy for best actress in a LEADING ROLE for TV DRAMA and this women have jobs, they are wives and romantic interests in their shows on ABC and FOX which are in the top 5 big channels on TV.

Interesting comment about Mccoy but please remember that it was Mccoy who helped kirk out in the first film and not the other way around. Mccoy got on the enterprise without the help of kirk and his role is to be a doctor. That is mccoy’s role in trek. His lifelong role in trek with or without kirk. You seem to be tiring uhura down to spock by insisting she is only important because if her link to a male character and this is what is problematic. Even if we use the kirk/spock dynamic it is not as problematic because Captain Kirk is famous because he is the captain of the enterprise and one of the best and most controversial and even reckless captains to govern the enterprise. This is why Kirk is so famous and NU Kirk is following his footstep. After that then we can now add his friendship with spock and bones.

Uhura/Scotty were romantically involved in star trek 5 and 6 and the age does not matter. A romance is a romance. You don’t need to be young and hip to have a good romance.

no one said Uhura was getting pushed aside. I did not say that all I said was rumours has it that S/U make break up. You mentioned the romance in your last post because you said uhura’s role was elevated by her link to a male character and that is flawed. Mccoy’s role is not elevated because of Kirk. Mccoy is a doctor first and uhura should be a linguist first and not someone’s girlfriend or friend first. not even Spock is going around thinking he has to be a boyfriend first or a friend first. Spock puts his job as first officer first which is the way things should be for all the characters.

Uhura is with Chekov from the trailer so what makes you think she or they would not have enough screen time? Just because she is not with kirk or spock does not mean she is going to be downplayed.

the dynamic MAYBE shaping up to be

kirk/scotty
spock/bones
uhura/chekov

So this is even a new dynamic for the new film.

its like kirk and spock are even separated in the film or toned down, I guess the writers want to downplay their dynamic the most after how controversial STID was with the WOK call backs. I will wait till the film comes out because right now we are loosing sleep over speculations.

 

[Malaika]

Its interesting you bring up how kirk and spock was never meant to be this epic friendship that it became but spock and uhura were not the couple that orci originally selected. His first choice was spock and chapel but he swapped it with spock and uhura for writing convenience and after watching some of their scenes in TOS but his first choice was Spock/Chapel because she was the one that openly liked Spock in TOS

You keep making different arguments here that have nothing to do with the point. ^ Also, for the sake of since you bring the OT up, you mix things up because yes, Orci once said that they thought about a Spock/Chapel thing originally but it has little do to with what they did with Spock/Uhura in the actual drafts of the movie since their plan for Chapel was that she had an unrequited love for Spock and (citation) he 'didn't give her the time of the day'. Destroying Vulcan wasn't even an idea in that moment.
In the actual story Uhura is Spock's girlfriend, that's hardly replacing Chapel with Uhura when they actually, if anything, replaced a non-relationship with an actual romantic relationship where not only the female character is different, but Spock's own arc itself and the purpose of the relationship is quite dfifferent. Even in terms of tos inspiration, that would be based on two separate dynamics to 'get inspiration from'.
Spock/Uhura was inspired, also, by Sarek/Amanda, which was never the intent with the dropped plot with Chapel.

You are the one here who insists only on the s/u romance in Uhura's character (you are also the only one who brought up any 'rumor' about them breaking up which, honestly, I don't believe based on what the director really said) again totally missing, on purpose, the point to detail the argument with your personal blog posts about other things.

Uhura/Scotty were romantically involved in star trek 5 and 6 and the age does not matter. A romance is a romance. You don’t need to be young and hip to have a good romance.

A romance is romance regardless age but whatever happened in those movies between them is not a romance by any means (BTW, star trek 6 actually pretended what happened in st5 never happened). It surely wasn't for who wrote the novelization or the script, and it really wasn't for the actress who played Uhura and who said Uhura never had any relationship. The fact that not even in her 50s, thus past the 60s when the series was made, Uhura could be showed in an actual romantic relationship and it took a reboot to do better than the kirk/uhura kiss, just proves the point here.
Nevertheless, speaking about being problematic..judging by what seems to be your mindset here , I'm not surprised you are equating mind coercion to romance and Uhura being with Spock on her own free will. I'm also not surprised you cannot tell the difference between a woman having unrequited love for a man, and a woman who is in an actually developed mutual loving relationship with that man.

The fact, also, you don't get the point about Mccoy and Uhura having equal roles in the narrative of the main characters in st09 and why, is, well, a given at this point. If you think that as Kirk's friend Mccoy isn't more prominent than he would be if Sulu or Chekov were Kirk's friend instead and got his scenes with him, I dunno what to tell you. (And I might add that in both movies Mccoy is far more defined by his connection to one of the protagonists than Uhura ever was in terms of her relationship with Spock, anyway)

Uhura is with Chekov from the trailer

Was Chekov even in the trailer?

 

[Dales]

re :Malaika,


TOS Spock never gave most of the women the time or day. If we go by the parallel reality universe spock and chapel made a lot of sense because in one reality like TOS, it was unrequited love then in another reality the love will not be unrequited. According to the many worlds theories in quantum physics and quantum mechanics spock/chapel made a lot of sense in the new series it is why it was Orci’s first choice but it did not happen.

Spock and Uhura happened instead. Uhura was replaced with Chapel as Spock's romantic interest because both uhura and spock serve at the main seat of the enterprise so commutation was easier and Zachary and Zoe had good chemistry on screen so that made it more believable as well


If you reread my post I only brought up the rumour and romance when you mentioned Uhura’s role was downplayed and I said there is no proof of such things because the only rumour we heard about Uhura is that she and spock may no longer be an item and I went on to say that just because a couple breaks up does not mean their role is been downplayed and I still stand by that. You don’t have to believe the break up rumour which is why it is a RUMOUR.I have to wait and see the film

I won’t get into Scotty/uhura again but what we know is that they were an official couple. How fans views their romance does not negate or force people to pretend that the romance never happened because it did. giving your personal views on how you view the scotty/uhura relationship sadly does not negate the fact that they were not a couple because they were.

I am not equating mind brainwash romance to anything and it is what happens in ship wars. Shippers do their best to delegitimize the other ship they don’t like and you are doing with scotty/uhura. What I know in cannon trek is uhura hooks up with scotty in TOS and with spock in AOS. That is what I know and that is what is canon. I don’t get into ship wars. I just state Trek’s characters history with other characters..


Mccoy and Uhura should be defined by their roles as enterprise officers but in STID Uhura is more defined by Spock than Mccoy is by Kirk and this is clearly seen in the climax of the film.

Uhura goes down to help Spock because Spock is her boyfriend. PERIOD she would not have done so with anyone else.

Mccoy helps saves Kirk’s life because he is the best doctor on the Enterprise not just because Kirk is his friend and he would have saved the life of anyone who was not Kirk as well. In the climax of STID we see Mccoy doing his official job as a doctor which is helping save kirk's life because he was the best equipped person to do so and yes Kirk was his best friend too.

Uhura was not the best equipped person to go down to help Spock. Sulu probably was because he was the best physical fighter on the enterprise and spock and khan were fist fighting but Uhura went only because spock is her boyfriend.


So In STID uhura is defined more by her relationship with spock than Mccoy is with Kirk there is no argument there. Mccoy had no personal story in STID so how can we say kirk defines him more than Spock defines Uhura? We can use that argument in st09 but not in STID and beyond is a follow up to STID and even in ST09 Spock and Uhura had more romantic scenes together than kirk and mccoy had more friendship scenes together. I rather not use the term defined by. I rather say the most focused dynamic of the two films is between
1. kirk and spock
2. spock and uhura

Pegg may shake things up a bit and there is nothing wrong with that too.

 

[Malaika]

TOS Spock never gave most of the women the time or day. If we go by the parallel reality universe spock and chapel made a lot of sense because in one reality like TOS, it was unrequited love then in another reality the love will not be unrequited. According to the many worlds theories in quantum physics and quantum mechanics spock/chapel would have made more sense in the new series it is why it was Orci’s first choice but it did not happen.

well, I didn't know that the 'many worlds theories in quantum physics and quantum mechanics' say that it makes more sense for the alternate version of Spock to be in love with someone he explicitly said he didn't love in an other reality, than the alternate version of Spock being in love with someone he had showed attraction for in said other reality. (someone please tell Leila Kalomi!)
Thank you for enlightening me about the inner workings of quantum physics I'd ask you to elaborate, but I fear my IQ isn't high enough to grasp this complex concept anyway.

I'm also sure Orci would appreciate your interesting interpretation of what he actually said, too.

/////////////////////
Edited to add (because why not? it's funny, and because I bet 90% of the people reading our convo don't even know that we are talking about and it's not nice ^ )
this is the interview Dales is referring to (sort of...) (I honestly have no idea why she even mentioned any of this, to begin with ^ but oh well.. Let's derailllll maybe someone here can turn that into something in topic with 'tos homages')
From Chapel memory alpha:

In an interview with screenwriters Alex Kurtzman and Roberto Orci, Kurtzman explained, "In our original, original draft we wrote some scenes with Nurse Chapel but ended up losing them. Even in our first draft it's not included. We originally had a flirtation between her and Spock: Nurse Chapel was obviously really obsessed with him and he was not giving her the time of day, which we thought was funny, but then we came onto the Spock/Uhura connection [established in the film] and that's why Nurse Chapel ended up by the wayside." (Star Trek Magazine issue 146, p. 38)

And this is what they said about the s/u connection they came onto for the actual movie:

Orci and Kurtzman explain that Spock and Uhura's relationship "it brings out his human side, it fits Spock’s arc for the surprise of the fact that he does share humanity and in the revelation that his father did love his mother, and therefore Spock himself is then capable of that and you see that with him and Uhura. It fits him."

(They also mentioned the flirtation they noticed in tos as inspiration (in terms of 'why Uhura'.) They also talked about contradicting the trope that Kirk would 'get the girl' because Uhura is, instead, more interested about the nerdy guy who fits her personality more.)

I guess if one is being very creative they can totally believe that their original idea for Spock/Chapel was the same exact relationship they were later inspired to make with him and Uhura, and thus Uhura 'replaced' Chapel as the girl Spock was in love with but, frankly, from the writers' quotes it's obvious we are comparing oranges and bananas here and they didn't simply replace one girl with the other: they literally replaced one kind of dynamic (unrequited love with character A) with another (actual relationship with character B) (And thank God they did. I'll watch tos if I want to see the unrequited love/pining girl dynamic) .

/////////////////////

If you reread my post I only brought up the rumour and romance when you mentioned Uhura’s role was downplayed

you're the one who believes that breaking up S/U is the be all and end all of 'downgrading' Uhura's role.
I was sharing concern over the fact that they seem to have replaced the Kirk/Uhura/Spock trio with a Kirk/Scotty/Spock/McCoy thing.. or at the very least tone Uhura's role down by keeping her away from the main characters as a sly way to not deal with her existing dynamics with them (so that Pegg can have dynamics with the main characters and the secondary male characters only) and get back to how things were in tos.

Of course, when you bought up the S/U romance and dismissed it as unimportant for the characters (and in terms of social commentary) I pointed up that while Uhura doesn't need to be with Spock to have a good role in the story or be a good female character, it's also true that her relationship with him already exists and is important for the characters and it would be problematic for me if out of all the dynamics with the lead male characters in these movies, her relationships are the only ones getting toned down or swept under the rug to focus on the dudebro dynamics only. It would also make trek go backwards because it's getting back to the 60s where the male leads were only allowed to have meaningful relationships with other male characters. This specific point isn't even just about Uhura (though, unlike your denial and your fanfictions about her supposedly having a romance in tos already - that she actually never had - her being a woc allowed to be the love interest of an iconic character like Spock has a significance for many), but also Spock being once again reduced to just the nerdy alien friend who can have feelings and express them only for his male friends.

now I have a feeling you will say that neither Scotty or McCoy will kiss Kirk or Spock.

and I said there is no proof of such things because the only rumour we heard about Uhura is that she and spock may no longer be an item and I went on to say that just because a couple breaks up does not mean their role is been downplayed and I still stand by that. You don’t have to believe the break up rumour which is why it is a RUMOUR.I have to wait and see the film

again, you're the only one who cares about said 'rumor'. It was never part of my point. Like, not at all. Not even one bit.
For me it isn't even a 'rumor' but just the speculation of someone who isn't exactly the most 'neutral' about the reboot (and thus the S/U relationship too), anyway. I read what Justin Lin actually said and even *I* thought that Faraci was way off base with his speculation because the director said nothing of the stuff he's claiming he said.
and If it still isn't clear to you I'll try to make it so: even if someone in the team said that the movie ends with S/U married on new vulcan or what have you, my opinions and concerns wouldn't change.

Frankly, you're just using my comment as a pretext to make blog posts about other things. It's ok but next time don't quote me and make it seems you're replying to me when really you aren't doing that and, if anything, you're simply derailing my point for your own agenda.

I won’t get into Scotty/uhura again but what we know is that they were an official couple. How fans views their romance does not negate or force people to pretend that the romance never happened because it did. giving your personal views on how you view the scotty/uhura relationship sadly does not negate the fact that they were not a couple because they were.

How can they be an official couple if canon doesn't make them one? Nichelle Nichols herself said they were just friends when she got asked about that. Whatever the fans want to interpret some of their interactions as romantic that's the speculation here, not those who just don't read into it more than what is actually showed in the movies and developed by the writers (and thus written in stuff like the script and novelization)

if you're trying to invalidate the point that Uhura was denied a romance in old trek because of racism (along other reasons) you're failing if everything you get is that Scotty/Uhura thing.

Uhura goes down to help Spock because Spock is her boyfriend. PERIOD she would not have done so with anyone else.

except, she went there only when they found a way to save Kirk and thus they needed someone to stop Spock from killing Khan (and it's legit to believe he'd probably listen to her). Her also saving Spock was a sideffect but not her main motivation for getting there (that was saving Kirk), for what she knew Spock was killing Khan (not the other way around) and he didn't need her help.

Mccoy helps saves Kirk’s life because he is the best doctor on the Enterprise not just because Kirk is his friend and he would have saved the life of anyone who was not Kirk as well. In the climax of STID we see Mccoy doing his official job as a doctor which is helping save kirk's life because he was the best equipped person to do so and yes Kirk was his best friend too.
Uhura was not the best equipped person to go down to help Spock. Sulu probably was because he was the best physical fighter on the enterprise and spock and khan were fist fighting but Uhura went only because spock is her boyfriend.

lol ok.

 

[Nyotarules]

because apparently to some the speculations of a biased fanboy (Devin Faraci) over what the director said, and his sensational click-bait articles, matter more than what the director really said.



I don't even get what's your point here

besides, if you want to compare Uhura 'directly' to Rey in terms of being 'progressive', your comparison is flawed because it's ignoring the little detail that what might be progressive for characters like Rey (white girls that are very often portrayed as love interests by hollywood) is the very opposite thing for characters like Uhura (woc, who are very often portrayed as 'strong independent woman who doesn't need no man' by hollywood). I get you don't like to get reminded of the race of the characters but in this case it's unavoidable.
tl;dr: if your intent was making a statement about 'feminism' (good luck) then the fact that Uhura is a love interest in trek is as progressive as Rey not being one in star wars.

but really there is no connection between Rey and Uhura beyond the fact that both movies are directed by JJ
If your point is that JJ is someone who is all about women needing to stay single forever you probably got that wrong too. In his work, JJ had never been one against romantic relationships (if anything, all his major female characters and female protagonists are strong women that have relationships) and even in trek the S/U romance apparently was (at least according to Orci) among one of the reasons why he accepted to direct the first movie.




yeah, but if you gonna keep all the dynamics and 'bromances' between the male characters (and even add new ones of that kind) and make them stronger and front and center, all the while the only relationship/dynamic that is sacrificed or toned down is the relationship with the woman, it's going to look a tiny bit suspect. At the very least, that's getting back to the 60s where the main male characters are only allowed to have feelings and express them for their male friends (and if they do for a woman, the latter must die or vanish by the end of the episode)



The first movies elevated Uhura at the level of the original trio and they did that by creating a connection between her and one of the main male characters (or both if you count Kirk's attraction for her and later friendship with her).
There is nothing sexist about that because this is the same exact way Spock and Mccoy became part of a trio in tos and thus more prominent than the other characters: because they were best friends, and thus shared a connection with, of the protagonist who was Kirk. If you read some old Roddenberry's letters this concept is pretty clear.
Even in the reboot itself, MCCoy was more prominent than, say, Sulu or Chekov, *because* he's Kirk's friend ( and the same will happen in star trek beyond to both him and Scotty if they share most of their screentime with Kirk and Spock)
The fact that the connection Uhura shares with Spock in the reboot is also romantic in nature is just a plus, but that in her case becomes relevant in light of the fact that the original Uhura was denied a romantic relationship because of racism so, in her case, making her 'the friend' would be nothing 'new' neither for this franchise, nor for hollywood (and not even for Spock's character, tbh, because he already has the 'friendship' subplot)

What is sexist is people holding Uhura to double standards and essentially deem as problematic the very same thing that is considered a natural occurrence when it comes to the narrative of the secondary male characters.
What is sexist is the idea that a female character cannot get developed both as an individual and in a relationship, and somehow while the male characters are allowed to have relationships, the woman must pay a 'price' and cannot be amazing and have a relationship at the same time.
So much for Roddenberry's 'ideal' and optimism the fans preach so much about, yet we're supposed to think it would be positive to see that apparently even in the century where Uhura lives a woman cannot have both a career and a relationship.
What is sexist is the idea that the writers must tone down the relationship between the female character and one of the protagonists in order to make the male friendships more relevant and give them more screentime.

Applause, applause, for decades Hollywood has desexualised woc in TV and movies, the S/U romance in ST09 had the audience in the cinema cheering. Human females of African descent are hardly or NEVER considered love interests for the leading man. Culturally woc are not considered the woman that you marry or take home to your momma but the bit you have on the side. I would hope in the ST universe that racist nonsense will no longer exists where humanity is supposed to be way above our present day racism, sexism and other isms. Normal women have relationships and a career every damn day in RL so I see no reason why this cannot be reflected in a futuristic movie.

 

[Noname Given]

I thought CBS and Paramount are not the best of friends? (except for suing Axanar perhaps)

So I think there might be no obvious connection between JJTrek and 2017.

Lets see - they cross promoted ST09 and ST:ID - and in the Star Trek Online MM0 (released in February 2010 per a license from CBS) - CBS had the game developers include the Hobus Supernova and the destruction of Romulus (from Paramount's ST09 film) into that game's storyline (causing some already nearly completed PVE mission content to be scrapped because the developers were not informed of the Hobus storyline inclusion that CBS wanted until VERY late in development.)

My point: If CBS and Paramount were at odds over Star Trek, you certainly couldn't tell from the way they were cross-promoting a number of things since 2009.

 

[Ovation]

Besides, isn't one of the producers for the new Trek TV show a key member of the production company that made the new films? How likely would that be if the two didn't get along?

 

[Malaika]

Where did this rumor of them NOT getting along come from? Faraci? ^
I think for those who own trek as long as they get profit from it in some ways everything is good

 

[Trekkin]

The ongoing comic series (and the novels, a teensy little bit) have also embraced both universes.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I think the idea of CBS/Paramount infighting comes from those unsourced articles about Abrams supposedly wanting CBS to withdraw TOS merchandise during Into Darkness' launch.

 

[M'Sharak]

I think the idea of CBS/Paramount infighting comes from those unsourced articles about Abrams supposedly wanting CBS to withdraw TOS merchandise during Into Darkness' launch.

One unsourced article in particular. The rest do no more than point back at it and repeat the claim as unvarnished fact.

 

[eyeresist]

Where did this rumor of them NOT getting along come from?

I think it's due to the lack of merchandising associated with the new Trek movies.

 

[drt]

One unsourced article in particular. The rest do no more than point back at it and repeat the claim as unvarnished fact.

Plus, the article says that the "problem" (if it ever really existed) occurred around the time of ST'09, and that CBS and Bad Robot worked together more by the time of Into Darkness, by way of the video game release.

 

[Dales]

I think it's due to the lack of merchandising associated with the new Trek movies.

For some weird reason trek has never had the best merchandise. maybe its the whole star trek is more for adults and star wars is for kids thing.

 

[fireproof78]

Plus, the article says that the "problem" (if it ever really existed) occurred around the time of ST'09, and that CBS and Bad Robot worked together more by the time of Into Darkness, by way of the video game release.

Which is a ridiculous assertion, in my humble estimation, since we only had some Kree-O sets released, and Hot Wheels, unlike the better selection of action figures, play sets, costumes and toys for 09. I think 09's merchandising was much better than ID.

 

[F. King Daniel]

That CBS are making a new Star Trek series, with reboot co-writer and co-executive producer Alex Kurtzman at the helm, pretty much says it all. CBS and Paramount get along just fine.

 

[eyeresist]

^ Then where's my "Angry Quinto Spock" action figure? Press the button and watch him punch!

 

[Dales]

Applause, applause, for decades Hollywood has desexualised woc in TV and movies, the S/U romance in ST09 had the audience in the cinema cheering. Human females of African descent are hardly or NEVER considered love interests for the leading man. Culturally woc are not considered the woman that you marry or take home to your momma but the bit you have on the side. I would hope in the ST universe that racist nonsense will no longer exists where humanity is supposed to be way above our present day racism, sexism and other isms. Normal women have relationships and a career every damn day in RL so I see no reason why this cannot be reflected in a futuristic movie.

I can not believe people are willing to use the race card to this extent to defend the S/U romance. which was written well in ST09 but horribly written in STID.

I really can not believe people are trying to play the race card instead of looking at how horrible the romance was in the last film especially for a series like star trek.


Not to mention the false idea that WOC have achieved something great when they are paired with the leading men. Of all the film I have watched whenever there is a leading WOC she always gets with the leading guy. it is not a rare thing or a thing that audiences in the cinema cheer because it is so new and ground breaking. it was already common in the 1990s.

I doubt people where shocked in a good way to see a white man and black woman kissing when they saw ST09. Interracial relationship was already very common in the 1990s and even now in the 2010s where the rate is growing fast.

As for Hollywood desexualising WOC that is complete nonsense to me and I say this after the Grace Jones's Bond era was over because some of the world sexiest women in the present day are black women.

A woman who is natural sexy and down right beautiful can never be desexualised unless the role demands her to be and this is not secluded to WOC. Please just watch Charlize Theron in Monster or Angelina Jolie in A Mighty Heart

the S/U romance is not judge on race, so I wish people will drop the race card. The romance is judged by their storyline which was far from great in the last film and that is what people criticised just like the whole film.

 

[Nyotarules]

Let's just say considering the history of Hollywood, woc achieve something great when they get a leading role in any major movie. IRR being more common place or on the rise in real life is one thing, especially (WM/BW). IRR being shown on the screen of a movie is quite another, so yes it is ground breaking for audiences because it is not a common thing in the history of cinema, which as we know reflects real life oh so well.
Its easy to say 'drop the race card' if you belong to the club that makes the rules of the game.