CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[Squiggy]

Don't know if this was shared here yet - http://1701news.com/node/980/axanar-will-ruin-fan-trek-everyone.html

Is anyone else seeing Legal Zoom ads in the sidebar? Kinda amusing.

Who the hell is Michael Hinman, and why should I care what he thinks, (even if I happen to agree with him)?

He's the hard-hitting journalist who sixteen years or so ago broke the news that British news presenter Daljit Dhaliwal would be playing "T'Pau" in the new series Enterprise.

About halfway down the page here:

http://www.trektoday.com/news/290301_03.shtml

Nailed it.

 

[Woulfe]

I'm wondering... MST3K raised a ton of money though Kickstarter ( run by the shows creator )

Did Alac see that success & get it in his head to do the same ?

Wouldn't put it past him to think they got millions & millions, I can do that too.

MST3K broke the record for largest crowd funding ever in Kickstarter history.

The MST3K crowdfunding was only in the last month or so. Peters has been doing this thing for years.

I know, but one has to wonder about these things sometimes

His Ego being as big as it is & all.

 

[Kemaiku]

Seriously, that Hasbro doesn't already have a rainbow themed version of Gitmo for people they've C&D'd over the years is a surprise.

CBS is being very lenient and patient with this guy right now.

 

[SeerSGB]

Maybe Peters should try crowdfunding a My Little Ponies fanfilm. My Little Pony: Equestanar. I hear Hasbro is totes cool with fan projects.

Hasbro and Allspark Productions are currently making an MLP 2017 feature film (for everyone not in on the reference).

Hasbro? they'd have raided his studio and cuffed him by now.

That's the real reason Luna got banished to the moon: she was making a Transformers fanfilm.

 

[KennyB]

Don't know if this was shared here yet - http://1701news.com/node/980/axanar-will-ruin-fan-trek-everyone.html

Is anyone else seeing Legal Zoom ads in the sidebar? Kinda amusing.

Who the hell is Michael Hinman, and why should I care what he thinks, (even if I happen to agree with him)?

He's the hard-hitting journalist who sixteen years or so ago broke the news that British news presenter Daljit Dhaliwal would be playing "T'Pau" in the new series Enterprise.

About halfway down the page here:

http://www.trektoday.com/news/290301_03.shtml

Back when Dennis Bailey MADE news happen!!!

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Marc Scott Zicree's thoughts of this, which is just as misguided as the rest.

Here's my stand on what CBS and Paramount are doing re Axanar. they have a right to protect their IP, of course, but they're going about this whole thing in an extremely ill-advised way. As with Trek novels, comics, etc., they should license fan films so they can be sold as downloadable content (and I think this goes for other franchises, too). It would generate millions for the studios and networks, would clearly be non-canon and would not stop a single human being from paying for the "official" Trek movies and TV shows.

Science fiction has a long and honorable tradition of fan fiction -- in fact, many of the top professional writers started out writing fan fiction -- and these fan films are the logical extension of that tradition. More than that, speaking as a professional who's written extensively for all the major studios and networks, the reason I chose to do "World Enough and Time" was that I felt Michael Reaves and I, along with our creative team, could bring as high a level of professional quality to that project as anything we had ever done for the studios and networks. I wanted to work with George Takei, the powers that be were never going to choose to do the ultimate Sulu story we wanted to tell, and it was something we could share with the whole world.

CBS/Paramount views Star Trek as a money machine, and that drives their decision on what or what not to make. This is perfectly justifiable. But it's not what led Gene Roddenberry to create Star Trek, nor is it why Renegades or Axanar are being made. I think often taking a step back, gaining perspective and saying, "How can we create a win/win situation here?" is a good idea. It's what led George Lucas to not only allow Star Wars fan films, but to hold an annual contest recognizing the best ones.

Joy and creative freedom can bring many admirable things to light. Licensing content allows IP to be protected and fans to flourish and be part of the universe they love -- in an active and healthy two-way conversation.

Source: https://www.facebook.com/spacecomma...318854525640/1001150613275791/?type=3&theater

 

[Woulfe]

Comes with Ray Gun - ooooooo

And Space Communicator - wooooow

100% gen-u-whine Mr. Speck from Start Track - gee, golly

How much ?

 

[CRM-114]

Zicree's post ignores an obvious point. Lucas didn't have to allow Star Wars fan films; that was his prerogative, not a moral or legal obligation. Maybe Lucas figured he could better control it by acknowledging it, but that was how he chose to act. By no means was he establishing any sort of binding precedent.

Lucas did it his way, and CBS/ Paramount are doing theirs', and they don't have to be the same. Besides, since Lucas doesn't own Star Wars anymore, it doesn't matter anymore how he did it.

 

[mos6507]

I'm wondering if Kickstarter and/or Indiegogo could dragged into this miss for allowing fanfilms to fund them to fund their projects. Peters has kicked over a hornet's next of issues.

I think they should. This wouldn't have been possible without them. The impact of crowdfunding on society has been pretty far-reaching as it is, and the law hasn't really caught up to it yet.

Marc Scott Zicree's thoughts of this, which is just as misguided as the rest.

It's not so much misguided as it is hopelessly idealistic.

 

[Indysolo]

People need to stop saying, "But Star Wars does it". Has anyone looked at the rules for Star Wars fan films? The time limit is 5 minutes and no union members are allowed to contribute. "Axanar" wouldn't pass that test.

Neil

 

[oswriter]

Zicree's post ignores an obvious point. Lucas didn't have to allow Star Wars fan films; that was his prerogative, not a moral or legal obligation. Maybe Lucas figured he could better control it by acknowledging it, but that was how he chose to act. By no means was he establishing any sort of binding precedent.

Lucas did it his way, and CBS/ Paramount are doing theirs', and they don't have to be the same. Besides, since Lucas doesn't own Star Wars anymore, it doesn't matter anymore how he did it.

More to the point, if someone had set up an entire film studio 10 miles down the road from LucasFilm and raised $1 million promising to make a "real Star Wars" film the same year "Revenge of the Sith" came out, I suspect Mr. Lucas would not have been so permissive.

 

[oswriter]

I'm wondering if Kickstarter and/or Indiegogo could dragged into this miss for allowing fanfilms to fund them to fund their projects. Peters has kicked over a hornet's next of issues.

I think they should. This wouldn't have been possible without them. The impact of crowdfunding on society has been pretty far-reaching as it is, and the law hasn't really caught up to it yet.

I imagine if this litigation gets to discovery--and I suspect it may be over before it comes to that--the CBS and Paramount lawyers will want to know everything they can about Peters and Axanar Productions' conversation with Kickstarter and Indiegogo.

 

[starburst]

Maybe Peters should try crowdfunding a My Little Ponies fanfilm. My Little Pony: Equestanar. I hear Hasbro is totes cool with fan projects.

Hasbro and Allspark Productions are currently making an MLP 2017 feature film (for everyone not in on the reference).

Hasbro? they'd have raided his studio and cuffed him by now.

That's the real reason Luna got banished to the moon: she was making a Transformers fanfilm.

Was she sent to the dark side of the moon?

Marc Scott Zicree's thoughts of this, which is just as misguided as the rest.

Here's my stand on what CBS and Paramount are doing re Axanar. they have a right to protect their IP, of course, but they're going about this whole thing in an extremely ill-advised way. As with Trek novels, comics, etc., they should license fan films so they can be sold as downloadable content (and I think this goes for other franchises, too). It would generate millions for the studios and networks, would clearly be non-canon and would not stop a single human being from paying for the "official" Trek movies and TV shows.

Science fiction has a long and honorable tradition of fan fiction -- in fact, many of the top professional writers started out writing fan fiction -- and these fan films are the logical extension of that tradition. More than that, speaking as a professional who's written extensively for all the major studios and networks, the reason I chose to do "World Enough and Time" was that I felt Michael Reaves and I, along with our creative team, could bring as high a level of professional quality to that project as anything we had ever done for the studios and networks. I wanted to work with George Takei, the powers that be were never going to choose to do the ultimate Sulu story we wanted to tell, and it was something we could share with the whole world.

CBS/Paramount views Star Trek as a money machine, and that drives their decision on what or what not to make. This is perfectly justifiable. But it's not what led Gene Roddenberry to create Star Trek, nor is it why Renegades or Axanar are being made. I think often taking a step back, gaining perspective and saying, "How can we create a win/win situation here?" is a good idea. It's what led George Lucas to not only allow Star Wars fan films, but to hold an annual contest recognizing the best ones.

Joy and creative freedom can bring many admirable things to light. Licensing content allows IP to be protected and fans to flourish and be part of the universe they love -- in an active and healthy two-way conversation.

Source: https://www.facebook.com/spacecomma...318854525640/1001150613275791/?type=3&theater

Much of that does actually ring true to me; Yes sci-fi (amongst other genres) have a long standing tradition of generating fan fiction based on the original show, movie or whatever.

The problem isn't fan fiction itself though its generating money off of that work. I know its slightly different with film but lets say I wrote a Star Trek story which was fairly universally (as much as you could ever with a fandom such as Trek has) deemed the best Star Trek novel/story of all time I really doubt CBS would bat an eye lid even if it won prizes, recognition from who ever or whatever. If I then started selling printed copies, t-shirts, mugs etc etc then they would care.

Creating the content is one thing, having fellow fans crowd fund it is another but I think the general consensus of this board (as well as elsewhere) is that CBS have taken umbridge with them taking it that level above paying for timber to build sets, rental for the studio space etc etc.

As for licensing fan productions to create an unofficial expanded universe that will never and should never happen as it really does dilute your source material especially when 2 of the bigger productions within this community both portray the original Enterprise crew. Books, comics and games I could see the potential for limited licensed fan produced, fan backed material (with some oversight from the IP owners) such as the Enterprise D project we have mentioned a couple of times which I would love to see the proper financial backing to bring to life (visit the Enterprise D... childhood dream).

Other than those sort of projects it would be too much of a hassle and legal headache to keep straight especially as different independent "studios" would never be able to keep a consistent canon between them and we all know how fussy we Star Trek fans can be about keeping a consistent timeline.

 

[dub]

I would have so been in the "I Stand With Axanar" crowd if Axanar had just closed everything down and said:

"We hope to begin shooting in February, but we're trying to work things out with CBS to make sure we're not violating any of their rules regarding fan films. We love Star Trek, we love the fans, and we want to honor both. We'll be back up with news as soon as we have it. Thank you for your support!"

I would be pulling for Axanar right now if that was the way things played out.

 

[Harvey]

(Re: the crowd sourcing companies)

The interesting thing there is that Axanar didn't just set up shop at Indiegogo for their latest fundraiser -- they were negotiating between Indiegogo and Kickstarter, and ultimately went to the site that offered the best rate. I wonder what information was communicated to both companies during that process?

 

[Amaris]

I would have so been in the "I Stand With Axanar" crowd if Axanar had just closed everything down and said:

"We hope to begin shooting in February, but we're trying to work things out with CBS to make sure we're not violating any of their rules regarding fan films. We love Star Trek, we love the fans, and we want to honor both. We'll be back up with news as soon as we have it. Thank you for your support!"

I would be pulling for Axanar right now if that was the way things played out.

Indeed. Their behavior has soured me on the entire project now. Even if they won and made the film, I wouldn't be interested knowing who it came from.

 

[mswood]

I would have so been in the "I Stand With Axanar" crowd if Axanar had just closed everything down and said:

"We hope to begin shooting in February, but we're trying to work things out with CBS to make sure we're not violating any of their rules regarding fan films. We love Star Trek, we love the fans, and we want to honor both. We'll be back up with news as soon as we have it. Thank you for your support!"

I would be pulling for Axanar right now if that was the way things played out.

I would at least feel sympathy for the supporters, and people who have provided their time and services, and a modicum of respect for how they handle themselves.

But after reading, on their own site about their plans for Ares studios with money being sought using the Trek brand there is no way I could support them. I will always stand for CBS, in this case.

Of course after all has been said and done, we have seen and heard evidence that implies there may be a host of very serious reasons why Axanar should not be supported, regardless of if the producers behaved in professional manner after the lawsuit was initiated.

And of course that assumes, that this was literally the very first notice that CBS had issues with them.

 

[Franklin]

On Kickstarter, at the very bottom of the Axanar project pitch page, under "Risks and Challenges" it says, "In addition, 'Star Trek' is a licensed property of CBS and so they have the final say in any 'Star Trek' venture. However, the Axanar team has dealt with CBS and knows the landscape that must be navigated."

Uh, yep.

As I read the terms and conditions of use on Kickstarter, if the movie is not filmed, Axanar Productions will only have to return whatever money has not yet been spent on the project, and then only to those who did not receive their perk for donating.

 

[Iamnotspock]

Is Peters' behaviour reminding anyone else of a certain Captain Garth of Izar? Perhaps he's immersed himself in the character a little too much...

 

[Maurice]

I would have so been in the "I Stand With Axanar" crowd if Axanar had just closed everything down and said:

"We hope to begin shooting in February, but we're trying to work things out with CBS to make sure we're not violating any of their rules regarding fan films. We love Star Trek, we love the fans, and we want to honor both. We'll be back up with news as soon as we have it. Thank you for your support!"

I would be pulling for Axanar right now if that was the way things played out.

That's #crazytalk