Seasons 1 & 2 Unwatchable?

[Joel_Kirk]

As John Boyega put it eloquently: "Deal with it."

If he and Daisy Ridley have an onscreen relationship (and kiss) in a future 'episode' those racist trolls are going to have heart attacks!

Well, I for one I'm rooting for John Boyega and Oscar Issac being the ones with the onscreen romance in a future STAR WARS episode.

Man, those trolls are going to implode if that happens.

I know Beyond the Trailer had a video about Oscar Isaac being part of the LGBT crowd. I haven't watched it yet since I've yet to see the new Star Wars film, and I'm avoiding any possible spoilers. (Yes, I'm a bit late....a few personal things to take care of. I'm sure I'll see it once, twice, thrice...).

 

[The Old Mixer]

(Remember, this was the 80s and the only interracial relationships that were 'okay' were the white male/Asian female - ex: Keiko and Miles, Nurse Ogawa and the unnamed white officer - and that's still the case in some respects today in non-Trek shows).

The Jeffersons.

 

[ConRefit79]

I don't see what was so awful about Code of Honor. It's not great. But it's certainly not the dullest or worst Star Trek episode I've ever seen. The one I hate the most was the TOS episode with Space Hippies.

The only thing that shocked me about Boyega was seeing him in Stormtrooper armor. Going off the prequels we know the clone troopers were clones of Jango Fett. I've always assumed Stormtroopers were clones. And never saw anything that says they used a different template in ep 4 - 6. I figured he was a rebel in disguise. Maybe even related to Lando. But that's not the case. I have seen trolls try to stir the pot comment boards. But trolls get love doing that.

Honestly the only reason I refuse to see TFA is because Disney replaced 1200 of their American IT staff with H1B replacements. They weren't exactly hurting for money.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

The one I hate the most was the TOS episode with Space Hippies.

Not one of my favorites, but there are some funny parts (e.g. some of the lingo from the space hippies). And there is a hottie in the background I find interesting, one of the Enterprise crew in red, during the 'jam' session...

(Remember, this was the 80s and the only interracial relationships that were 'okay' were the white male/Asian female - ex: Keiko and Miles, Nurse Ogawa and the unnamed white officer - and that's still the case in some respects today in non-Trek shows).

The Jeffersons.

Very true.

But it was always the butt of jokes, it wasn't shown as a normal thing. Even as an addition to the show it was the exception rather than the norm.

Another example is Sanford and Son: Pat Morita was shown with a Caucasian wife with no mention of the different racial backgrounds, yet in the same episode (or another) it was a big issue when Lamont was seeing a Latina whom he was 'just friends' with. (Note: Lamont never, ever had a relationship with a non-black woman on the show).

Even the FOX show True Colors in the 90s had a black male/white female couple who never showed any affections onscreen. A reason, I believe, the initial actor who played the husband left the show.

Usually, if there was a relationship on television that involved a black man opposite a non-black woman (usually white), it was a discussion about race. Not just having the relationship be something 'normal.'

Now, we have Jessica Jones with a black boyfriend...and Supergirl has the hots for a black guy. Not too mention, today we have some sexy black women taking charge in shows like Minority Report (which was cancelled) and Sleepy Hollow...and Ash Vs. Evil Dead (even though Amanda Fisher died). On the other hand, there is How to Get Away w/Murder and Scandal, both which have black female leads and are in mixed-race relationships.

Taye Diggs was opposite a Eurasian/Hapa girl in Day Break, but that was cancelled. (Sidenote: I met John Rubenstein back in 2012 when he was at a Summer Orientation at UC Santa Cruz - a relative was probably going to attend - and asked him about this show).

 

[Shalashaska]

Well, considering the main reason some people, including some of the cast members, dislike that particular episode because it is supposedly racist, this 'making it a stupid racial thing' has been going on for some time.

If you don't see anything racial about it, cool. Some people do, unfortunately....and seemingly for the wrong reasons.

The only racial thing I DO see is, in regards to the episode: It was cool seeing a lot of black faces, which was very new at the time, I want to see that many black faces in a Star Trek movie or episode again.

In regards to Star Wars: Yes, they were trolls. Butt-hurt trolls.

As John Boyega put it eloquently: "Deal with it."

If he and Daisy Ridley have a relationship and kiss in a future 'episode' those trolls are going to have heart attacks!

Oh yeah, it is pretty racist. People hate on it because those "aliens" are just a stereotypical sexist west African tribe, but not because it has black people in it. Big difference.

To your comment about them getting heart attacks, I wouldn't mind that at all

Ahhh, so it's a 'stupid racial thing' unless there is a certain point of view about the episode. Since Trek fans come in all different shades and racial groups and experiences, there are bound to be different opinions.

If it was so racist, 'Code of Honor,' the show should have 'corrected' it and shown the Ligonians again. Expanded upon them rather than just dropping them altogether. (Instead, we had an overkill of Klingons and honor and Borg, oh my). Moreover, if the Ligonians were white or even Asian...there probably wouldn't have been any 'racism' talk.

Again, if the supposed problem was how they - Ligonians - were portrayed rather than the color of their skin....we should have seen them again in a different light. We didn't.

Nobody wanted to see Ligonians again, regardless of their skin colour.

I'm Irish, okay, so for me it'd be like having a bunch of stereotypical Irish ginger men wearing leprechaun outfits and drinking Guinness. But they're "Ligonians", and people didn't like the episode because they had "Irish" people in it, right? No.

That's how I feel it is, but instead of Irish people they're parodying, they seemed to be parodying African people. That's the only racial issue about it.

 

[Shalashaska]

I don't see what was so awful about Code of Honor. It's not great. But it's certainly not the dullest or worst Star Trek episode I've ever seen. The one I hate the most was the TOS episode with Space Hippies.

The only thing that shocked me about Boyega was seeing him in Stormtrooper armor. Going off the prequels we know the clone troopers were clones of Jango Fett. I've always assumed Stormtroopers were clones. And never saw anything that says they used a different template in ep 4 - 6. I figured he was a rebel in disguise. Maybe even related to Lando. But that's not the case. I have seen trolls try to stir the pot comment boards. But trolls get love doing that.

Honestly the only reason I refuse to see TFA is because Disney replaced 1200 of their American IT staff with H1B replacements. They weren't exactly hurting for money.

The clones had accelerated aging, and would have all but died out by the time of Star Wars. The animated show, Rebels, set between Revenge of the Sith and Star Wars, show us a group of rebel former clones who are all old and grey.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

Oh yeah, it is pretty racist. People hate on it because those "aliens" are just a stereotypical sexist west African tribe, but not because it has black people in it. Big difference.

To your comment about them getting heart attacks, I wouldn't mind that at all

Ahhh, so it's a 'stupid racial thing' unless there is a certain point of view about the episode. Since Trek fans come in all different shades and racial groups and experiences, there are bound to be different opinions.

If it was so racist, 'Code of Honor,' the show should have 'corrected' it and shown the Ligonians again. Expanded upon them rather than just dropping them altogether. (Instead, we had an overkill of Klingons and honor and Borg, oh my). Moreover, if the Ligonians were white or even Asian...there probably wouldn't have been any 'racism' talk.

Again, if the supposed problem was how they - Ligonians - were portrayed rather than the color of their skin....we should have seen them again in a different light. We didn't.

Nobody wanted to see Ligonians again, regardless of their skin colour.

I'm Irish, okay, so for me it'd be like having a bunch of stereotypical Irish ginger men wearing leprechaun outfits and drinking Guinness. But they're "Ligonians", and people didn't like the episode because they had "Irish" people in it, right? No.

That's how I feel it is, but instead of Irish people they're parodying, they seemed to be parodying African people. That's the only racial issue about it.

I wanted to see the Ligonians again. I'm sure there are black people who wouldn't have minded seeing a large group of black people, an alien race again.

Irish are considered 'white' and TNG was very 'white' so there wasn't a lack of representation there. Not to mention, in the leads there was English (or a white Englishman portraying one who lived in France)....an Irish man (Miles O'Brien)...a Scot-American (Beverly Crusher, who had a Scot accent come out every now and then)....Greek (at least a Greek Englishwoman portraying an alien)...and after the 2nd season the racial mixture of background characters even was lost.

By the time we got to ENT, the leads and the background were pretty much 'white.' The only black lead was pretty much a token...and the lone Asian female was being paired (by some fans) with any of the white leads.

Again, there are different viewpoints. As a black man who found the Ligonians interesting, I wouldn't have minded seeing them again and built upon.

I hope we do see them in a future movie or episode. Stir the pot, so to speak.

 

[ConRefit79]

^
DS9 lead is black. Certainly not a token. In many ways I like him more as a follow up to Kirk than Picard.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

^
DS9 lead is black. Certainly not a token. In many ways I like him more as a follow up to Kirk than Picard.

I know people weren't keen on him when he was introduced, especially when he stood up to Picard in that initial episode. Still, Sisko is actually my favorite captain....and yes, as a follow-up to Kirk.

I so want to see Chris Pine's Kirk interacting with a rebooted Sisko someday.

 

[The Old Mixer]

For a more modern example of a black male / white female pairing on TV, there's D.L. and Nikki on Heroes...granted, it was a pretty tumultuous relationship, but they had a pretty strong bond when Jessica wasn't trying to kill D.L., and they had a kid.

I'm Irish, okay, so for me it'd be like having a bunch of stereotypical Irish ginger men wearing leprechaun outfits and drinking Guinness.

In which case, you should forget "Code of Honor" and gird yourself for the coming of "Up the Long Ladder" in Season 2....

 

[Kelthaz]

I don't see what was so awful about Code of Honor. It's not great. But it's certainly not the dullest or worst Star Trek episode I've ever seen. The one I hate the most was the TOS episode with Space Hippies.

Code of Honor is an awful episode because it's a racist piece of shit. Yes, if you ignore the deepest, darkest Africa crap that felt like it came from the 19th century, it's not the worst episode ever.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

For a more modern example of a black male / white female pairing on TV, there's D.L. and Nikki on Heroes...granted, it was a pretty tumultuous relationship, but they had a pretty strong bond when Jessica wasn't trying to kill D.L., and they had a kid.

I would like to see more Eurasian/Hapa women opposite black men. I remember telling Maurice (over lunch) of my dream to have a sequel - better written! - to Meteor Man with Kristen Kreuk portraying my onscreen wife...and having a bit more to do than just being 'the wife.'

I had an idea for a sequel to "Aloha" for Emma Stone's pseudo-Hawaii-born Allison Ng (in a relationship with a 'brutha') since I did have a liking for the character but that'll just probably be perpetuating the whitewashing of the character. Alas, I may still write it as a personal spec.

I don't see what was so awful about Code of Honor. It's not great. But it's certainly not the dullest or worst Star Trek episode I've ever seen. The one I hate the most was the TOS episode with Space Hippies.

Code of Honor is an awful episode because it's a racist piece of shit. Yes, if you ignore the deepest, darkest Africa crap that felt like it came from the 19th century, it's not the worst episode ever.

Considering the racism in the 19th century and how black lives didn't matter much then (and somewhat now)....we probably would have seen Ligonians massively murdered due to what one man did. Not to mention, we probably wouldn't have heard Tasha Yar say she was attracted to Lutan, which probably would have had Picard or someone on the crew call her 'nigger lover.'

Geordi would have been saying, "Yessuh, boss," being a different type of token another variation that he would become later in the series.

 

[Kelthaz]

^
DS9 lead is black. Certainly not a token. In many ways I like him more as a follow up to Kirk than Picard.

I know people weren't keen on him when he was introduced, especially when he stood up to Picard in that initial episode. Still, Sisko is actually my favorite captain....and yes, as a follow-up to Kirk.

Dude, you have a chip on your shoulder the size of a boulder when it comes to racism. No one wasn't keen on Sisko because a black guy had the nerve to stand up to a white guy. People weren't keen on Sisko because we knew Picard and we knew how much he suffered as Locutus, so Sisko blaming Picard for his wife's death felt unfair. And that wasn't a great introduction for a new captain.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

^
DS9 lead is black. Certainly not a token. In many ways I like him more as a follow up to Kirk than Picard.

I know people weren't keen on him when he was introduced, especially when he stood up to Picard in that initial episode. Still, Sisko is actually my favorite captain....and yes, as a follow-up to Kirk.

Dude, you have a chip on your shoulder the size of a boulder when it comes to racism. No one wasn't keen on Sisko because a black guy had the nerve to stand up to a white guy. People weren't keen on Sisko because we knew Picard and we knew how much he suffered as Locutus, so Sisko blaming Picard for his wife's death felt unfair. And that wasn't a great introduction for a new captain.

You don't know me, sir, nor my experiences as a black man in America. And let's not make this personal; I believe we comment on the post, not the poster.

As for people not liking Sisko, there were probably different reasons...which included some racism from fans. At the same time, Sisko was justified. He lost his wife so Picard could and should have had some sympathy. I mean, the guy - Picard - cried like a little baby when his nephew and brother died and we, the audience, were supposed to feel for him like the people on screen were doing (It could have been 'person,' since I believe he was talking to Troi in that particular scene from GEN).

Picard shouldn't be the only one to have emotions when losing a family member.

 

[poundpuppy29]

I am in the middle of a rewatch now in the middle of season 2 and I am very much enjoying it I was surprised how much the stories help up and are very timely to now I watched it first run and caught a rerun occasionally but it has been many years since I have watched it there was a couple eps that made me roll my eyes the one you mentioned and the one where they were all blond and scantly clad but I still love the all the characters I did before there is no one I did not like the only thing I don't like is the part of Riker that is a male slut but I remember I didn't like that before I was a young teenager when I watched before but I don't hate him.

 

[Granola Gwen]

A show grows and changes over time, I like the weird vibes these two seasons gave me. It shows how much the series as grown.

 

[2takesfrakes]

The only real flaw that gives me pause about Season 2 is the absence of Doctor Beverly Crusher - the finest Chief Medical Officer in the entire franchise. The character of Kate Pulaski had some potential, especially when her relationship with Kyle Riker was revealed. It's so unfortunate that it turned out to be of very little value to Will Riker's narrative. Kate's attempts to channel her Inner "Bones" McCoy were a terrible misstep, but Diana Muldaur wasn't at fault for any of this. In hindsight, it seems like this was done to ensure that Pulaski was not favoured over Bev, which I find unnecessary. It was Gate McFadden's gig and her return in Season 3 did so much to help it earn its celebrated position in fan circles. Otherwise the second season offers much and it looks great doing it. The addition of Whoopie Goldberg was a smart move, and after an awkward start, she's fixed firmly in Trekkie's minds as a memorable and important contributor to the STAR TREK mythos.

 

[Maurice]

re "Code of Honor", when the episode started I was pleased to see they chose not to go with the usual lily-white cast, But I did become bothered that so much of the portrayal of these people via old-school Hollywood generic "exotic" shorthand. I don't think it's any one thing that leads some people to conclude it's "racist", but rather a combination of elements. So I certainly get where that makes some people uncomfortable, and how many some other people don't see it that way.

But consider this: the very fact that people question if it's racist or not means the audience has come to be aware of how minorities are portrayed in media, something they likely would not have given a second thought in prior decades. Sure they might overreact or even be wrong, but at least they're not just blindly accepting portrayals without a second thought.

 

[ConRefit79]

^
I realize it was cheaper for them to not make the Ligonians appear more alien. But they could have been humans. I'll have to look it up. But we've seen instances where some human cultures chose to leave Earth and the Federation and set up colonies where they can live as they want without outside interference. Like the Irish settlers in Up the Long Ladder and the Native Americans we saw when Crusher resigns from Star Fleet.

 

[Joel_Kirk]

re "Code of Honor", when the episode started I was pleased to see they chose not to go with the usual lily-white cast, But I did become bothered that so much of the portrayal of these people via old-school Hollywood generic "exotic" shorthand. I don't think it's any one thing that leads some people to conclude it's "racist", but rather a combination of elements. So I certainly get where that makes some people uncomfortable, and how many some other people don't see it that way.

But consider this: the very fact that people question if it's racist or not means the audience has come to be aware of how minorities are portrayed in media, something they likely would not have given a second thought in prior decades. Sure they might overreact or even be wrong, but at least they're not just blindly accepting portrayals without a second thought.

A very diplomatic answer...