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"Hell Bent" Grade and discussion thread

Grading

  • Be a Doctor

    Votes: 58 43.9%
  • Gallifrey Stands

    Votes: 37 28.0%
  • A Hybrid

    Votes: 19 14.4%
  • Gallifrey falls

    Votes: 10 7.6%
  • Sent it to the end of time

    Votes: 8 6.1%

  • Total voters
    132
Do the Time Lords know that Clara is still frozen in a moment and will eventually come back to the time when she dies and therefore that everything is ok or do they still think the whole of time is in jeopardy of fracturing? If it is the latter, then the Time Lords should be really pissed at the Doctor and treat him as a dangerous outlaw since endangering time itself is an incredibly dangerous threat.
 
The more I think about it, the more I think that the episode derailed when Clara and the Doctor steal the Tardis. I feel like it would have been better to cut out the whole part with Clara and Me running off in their own Tardis. Instead, I would have preferred to see Clara and the Doctor have an adventure on Gallifrey (include lots of world building where Clara is amazed at Gallifreyan tech and society), solving the mystery of the Hybrid and then Clara going back through that portal to face her death, then the Time Lords thank the Doctor for saving Gallifrey once more, recall his Tardis, and the Doctor says farewell and leaves.
 
I'm positively shocked, SHOCKED that so many people seem to rate this episode so highly. Honestly, I thought it was the worst NuWho finale since the River Song one.

Really. At least last year's, as terrible as it may have been, was more thought-out, had stakes and an emotional ending that made sense.

This episode is enigmatically bad. Like, Moffat didn't even bother to make the plot consicse or the threat understanable - what the the fuck is the Hybrid? Why are the Time Lords afraid of it, especially considering that EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE UNIVERSE WANTS THEM DEAD?! Why is this suddenly an issue? Do we even know who the hell the Hybrid is at the end? Honestly, I loved the rumored idea that Oswin from Asylum was the one, cause that'd be great twist way to end the Clara run and all that.

BUT FUCK THAT! Lets make the Doctor irrationally agonizing over Clara for NO good reason. Suddenly she means so much more than every other companion he's ever had? Just awful.

Really, I imagine Moffat just had no idea what the write and did this over a weekend. I imagine that wasn't the case, but really... bring Gallifrey back, and not explain how Missy got away, how Gallifrey escaped, HOW they were able to communicate via the crack in Time and how they magically managed to send him regenerations? Honestly, I was fully expecting all of those, but nothing.

And what the hell is it with the Sisterhood of Karn? So they can exist like they are at the end of time? WTF?

Also, to me, the whole Me sub-story was the most vacuus, time-wasting, pointless, going-nowhere story arc that never went N.O.W.H.E.R.E. Just fucking terrible.

Overall, I'm not kidding at all when I say I hated this. This is one of the very, very worst DW episodes I've ever seen. And considering it came off at the heels of the very best of Capaldi's entire run, its bewildering. Maybe he was spent? I dunno.

Terrible, terrible, terrible. Just... ugh!
 
For my money, it was a pretty good episode. But I really wish they'd have just let Clara die again with some dignity. Jenna Louise is a fine actress but I'm really tired of Clara.
 
I feel Moffat is trying his hardest, in a round-about way to convince the BBC to sanction spin-offs.

Give the Paternoster Gang a spin-off!

Give the Osgoods a spin-off!

Give Clara and Maisie Williams a spin-off!

You get a spin-off, you get a spin-off and...
tumblr_nyy03svYf01r4pq4io1_500.gif



The episode was ok. I'm glad Clara got a happy ending of sorts, rather than dying.

Galifrey and that whole chase scene was a waste. Just like Zygons in TDOTD, the Galifrey storyline just disappeared as the story progressed.

The Hybrid subplot was rubbish. Moffat thinking he's clever by giving us a non-answer. There's a difference between ambiguous and undefined, and Moffat flirts with both a lot.
 
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BUT FUCK THAT! Lets make the Doctor irrationally agonizing over Clara for NO good reason. Suddenly she means so much more than every other companion he's ever had? Just awful.

Which makes Adric's death actually funnier

"yeah, he's dead, nothing anyone can do".
 
I'm not sure it's worth discussing any of this with you since you seem pretty determined to dislike this, but what the hell, I'll give it a shot:

This episode is enigmatically bad.
Was that a typo? What does 'enigmatically bad' mean? Was it supposed to be 'epically'?


Why are the Time Lords afraid of it, especially considering that EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE UNIVERSE WANTS THEM DEAD?!
Yes, but the Time Lords are pretty confident they can handle everything else in the universe. They know they are badass, so the only thing that could really threaten them is something that IS them. Which is pretty much true - the Doctor has 'stood in the ruins of Gallifrey' several times over.


Do we even know who the hell the Hybrid is at the end? Honestly, I loved the rumored idea that Oswin from Asylum was the one, cause that'd be great twist way to end the Clara run and all that.
How would that possibly make more sense than what we actually got? Oswin never got anywhere near Gallifrey or knew what a Time Lord was. At least this conclusion actually used the characters who were already established as part of the story.


BUT FUCK THAT! Lets make the Doctor irrationally agonizing over Clara for NO good reason. Suddenly she means so much more than every other companion he's ever had? Just awful.
Well, she is the one who voluntarily split herself into infinite parts just to protect him, with no expectations of her own survival. She is the one who persuaded him not to give up and find a way to not destroy his own planet. She is the one who persuaded the Time Lords to give him more regenerations when he thought he was out of them. She is the one who told him that being afraid was okay when he was a scared little kid. She is the one who stuck by him through what was probably one of the more traumatic regenerations he ever had, given the whole 'new cycle' thing. She is the one who pushed him to greater extremes of action than most.

You may complain about Moffat loading too much 'special snowflake' stuff onto one character, but you can't possibly claim that this came out of nowhere. Given all of the above, it only makes sense that the Doctor would have more of a connection to this one woman than some of the others who just happened to be along for the ride without really contributing anything but who he just kept around to have someone he could impress.


bring Gallifrey back, and not explain how Missy got away, how Gallifrey escaped, HOW they were able to communicate via the crack in Time and how they magically managed to send him regenerations? Honestly, I was fully expecting all of those, but nothing.
Well, I would have liked some of that too, but it's not over yet. We have time. And as for 'how', well the Doctor said it himself: "Short answer - Time Lords are clever." Honestly, what answer would have satisfied you? Would you rather spend 15 minutes explaining all the technobabble of Time Lord technology, or would you rather get on with the story?


Also, to me, the whole Me sub-story was the most vacuus, time-wasting, pointless, going-nowhere story arc that never went N.O.W.H.E.R.E. Just fucking terrible.
Not my favourite storyline the show has ever done either, mostly because I was singularly unimpressed with Maisie Williams' acting. But I think part of it was another misdirect - create a character who superficially was the Doctor's perfect companion to replace Clara, since we all knew she was leaving... but then twist it so that she actually became Clara's companion instead.

.
 
-next season's arc will most likely bring Gallifrey fully back once and for all, or at least some major revelation.

I think people have missed this - it's fully back once and for all - there is nothing in the episode to indicate the Doctor doesn't know where it is and he can get them as simple as setting the co-ordinates in his TARDIS. What you saw in the episode was the grand return of Gallifrey.

I stand corrected, but I wouldn't call it a "Grand" return, but rather just a return, since it was so unceremonial -- no rejoicing, no gasping, etc, though the episode subtly -- and rightfully, imo -- shifted focus from Gallifrey to Clara & Ashildr. It's just that, I suppose that I'm used to the large scale finales, which we've gotten every single time. This finale was satisfyingly different to me, in that while there were no major battles or extreme cases of wibbly-wobbly space/time warping, everything felt really personal, so surprisingly small scale for a finale, especially given the lengths we saw the 13 Doctors go in Day of the Doctor.

I still predict Gallifrey playing a large role for Series 10, simply because it's the anniversary of the revival.
 
I'm still confused on the confession dial. Why was it sent to Missy in the season opener? The Doctor wasn't close to death.
 
I feel Moffat is trying his hardest, in a round-about way to convince the BBC to sanction spin-offs.

Give the Paternoster Gang a spin-off!

Give the Osgoods a spin-off!

Give Clara and Maisie Williams a spin-off!

You get a spin-off, you get a spin-off and...
tumblr_nyy03svYf01r4pq4io1_500.gif

The BBC announced a spin off and everyone complained.
 
-Rassilon kept his funky metal power glove, which shows some neat consistency with Dalton's incarnation

It wasn't the same glove (prop) though. The one from TEOT was a full glove (or had a black glove underneath), this one was a half-glove (open palm).

No reason I can see not to use the same one (for consistency ;)).
 
I sas this one at a local theater and the visual effects of Gallifrey looked awesome. The Gallifrey scenes were nicely done, but it's getting tiring sending the Doctor to the end of time. And really there was no great discovery of Gallifrey by the Doctor, so much for his great search for the planet. And really the Doctor has gotten irrational over a number of companions, so his attempt to save Clara wasn't so far out for me. And I loved the old console room and we got a new sonic screwdriver. The second part though I thought was better than the first, they spent too much time on the time loop last week, so the pacing in the last half of this week's ep. was rather fast.
 
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