First officers pulling double duty - exception or the rule?

[Bad Thoughts]

We did see a lot of the Saratoga's first officer in action, being very Riker-esque (without the womanizing).

 

[J.T.B.]

If being second-in-command of a wooden frigate 200 years ago was enough to be its own non-watchstanding job, it's hard to imagine that the responsibilities of a starship XO would be part-time. But the necessities of TV are that the main characters have to be together most of the time, so the XO has to have duties on the bridge. Having Spock or Riker go to their battle station in auxilliary control every time the Red Alert sounded would not really be an option.

Likewise Scotty was given a bridge station and McCoy and Crusher would just hang around on the bridge, even when they probably should have been taking charge in sickbay. Dramatic requirements.

 

[The Wormhole]

It's definitely an interesting question. I do wonder how conclusive we can really even consider the evidence from 24th century to be, though, since Riker's status can easily be explained by the massive size of the Ent-D's crew, and Kira and Chakotay are clearly in very unusual positions to begin with. Officially neither of them are even Starfleet officers, at least to start with, and their appointments are clearly political (Bajoran Liaison/Maquis integration) as well as meritorial.

Kira was first and foremost DS9's executive officer, Sisko even explains in Emissary he requested a Bajoran national to serve as his XO.

How many first officers did we ever see in the 24th century outside of the hero ships? And were any of them on screen long enough to really get an idea of what their normal responsibilities were?

Surprisingly little. We know from Sisko's backstory that when he was promoted to XO on the Okinawa it meant leaving his duties as chief engineer behind, and indeed we don't see him doing anything else on the Saratoga. Data's XO on the Sutherland seemed to have no other jobs, and neither did Voyager's original XO. Maxwell Burke on the Equinox did sit at one of the bridge stations despite their being a chair for the XO next to the captain's, but that can be explained given the heavy crew losses. Likewise, on the Valiant, another Defiant class ship, the XO, like Worf on the Defiant, operates the tactical console.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Probably the reason we always see XO's doubling up on another bridge position is just so the actor will have a place to sit.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

In ST6, Spock's double duty seems to entail being the Chief Science Officer and Diplomat-In-Residence; whether he's also the XO, we don't really know, as everything following the assassination amounts to another mutiny anyway.

"I assume command of this ship as of zero-two-three-zero hours."

--Captain Terrell

 

[CAPTRousseau]

If being second-in-command of a wooden frigate 200 years ago was enough to be its own non-watchstanding job, it's hard to imagine that the responsibilities of a starship XO would be part-time. But the necessities of TV are that the main characters have to be together most of the time, so the XO has to have duties on the bridge. Having Spock or Riker go to their battle station in auxilliary control every time the Red Alert sounded would not really be an option.

Likewise Scotty was given a bridge station and McCoy and Crusher would just hang around on the bridge, even when they probably should have been taking charge in sickbay. Dramatic requirements.

You may be onto something with that..Dramatic requirement? If it were real, the XO/ 1st Officer would probably be sleeping while the Captain was on duty. And be in the Center Seat when the Captain was sleeping. Unless the ship was on Red Alert.

 

[Bagofmostlywatr]

Or has a high ranking Android you can get to do the **** shifts.

 

[T'Girl]

Oh? The only speaking role was Castillo's, and he was credited as the last surviving senior officer but also as the helmsman. We heard no dialogue mention of an XO.

Okay, then from the time the Enterprise Cee appeared, until the time Garrett was killed, exact who Timo was the ship's first officer?





.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Castillo was only a lieutenant, and that's too low a rank to be the first officer on an Enterprise. So we can assume that the actual XO was killed in the battle before we ever saw the ship. (Castillo may have been the acting XO at the time, but not the real one.)

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

^Right. IIRC, there were only 125 survivors when the ship first appeared through the rift. Castillo was in his early- to mid-thirties (based on his statement about meeting Yar again while in his late-fifties if he survived the battle with the Romulans) but was only a lieutenant, which meant that he either joined Starfleet later than most or hadn't had many opportunities for promotion (maybe he was an earlier version of Harry Kim). Either way, I don't think he would have been the first officer had the ship not been attacked by Romulans.

--Captain Terrell

 

[Timo]

"I assume command of this ship as of zero-two-three-zero hours."

The point is, he could do that while leaving the XO high and dry, by virtue of his seniority. That is, perhaps Chekov was Kirk's second-in-command and Spock was a passenger, until an emergency emerged and Spock changed modes.

Okay, then from the time the Enterprise Cee appeared, until the time Garrett was killed, exact who Timo was the ship's first officer?

Never stated. In theory, it might have been Castillo - but during the time period of interest, Tasha Yar refers to this man merely as "one of the officers of the Enterprise-C", an odd way to speak of the very highest officer who could be identified in very specific terms. So it's possible Castillo went straight from Chief Helmsman to CO, while a high-ranking officer we never saw because she or he wasn't at the bridge (perhaps the Chief Engineer) filled the XO slot till the second attack.

Then again, perhaps Yar was being circumspect because she didn't want everybody to jump straight to the conclusion that she was shagging the attractive-looking XO?

One'd think the XO of the ship would have had better things to do at the time than work or play with Yar, however.

Castillo was only a lieutenant, and that's too low a rank to be the first officer on an Enterprise.

At the start of this thread, the assumption was made that Number One was Pike's XO. And her rank was specifically stated to be Lieutenant (unless that was another nickname, "My lieutenant", independent of rank).

In absolute terms, the C is a bigger command. But she only warranted a Captain as the CO, the same as the Nil. And while the Nil may be argued to have had a mere Commander there in "Where No Man" (see Kirk's braid) and possibly a senior Lieutenant in "The Cage" (no visible difference between the braids of Pike and #1), many of the sisters of the Nil seemed to warrant a Commodore!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

Of course, that raises the question of where Number One normally sat...

Either on the steps next to Pike or on his lap

 

[dswynne1]

We really should include "WNMHGB" in order to legitimize this thread "Johnny". Just because YOU don't want deal with, that doesn't mean we have to do so as well.

Anyway, in my opinion, Spock was first officer only (hence the gold shirt), but then returned to his duties as head of Science ever since. Also, keep in mind, Uhura wore a gold shirt at one point, in an established episode, so she could have been in Operations. Oh, well.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

About Number One: It should be noted that in "The Cage", Roddenberry didn't exactly have Starfleet's rank system nailed down yet. I believe he considered having Starfleet have Air Force-style ranks (Gene himself was a veteran). It wasn't until WNMHGB that Starfleet was established as a 'space navy' and the ranks of Lieutenant Commander and Commander were introduced.

That being said, in-universe it's always possible to explain around it. It could be any of these:

1) Number One was actually a Lieutenant Commander, and Pike messed up and called her "Lieutenant" instead of "Commander" (that mistake's been made before - at various times, LCDRs such as George Kirk, Deanna Troi, Geordi LaForge and Liz Shelby have all been called 'Lieutenant')

2) the Enterprise's actual first officer was on leave, or injured and recovering at a starbase (could have been one of the victims of the 'fight on Rigel VII' spoken of in the episode), and Number One was just filling in for that person.

3) Or even she wasn't the first officer at all, just the senior officer of the watch at that time.

 

[T'Girl]

Roddenberry was in the US Army, he flew bombers.

 

[The Wormhole]

"I assume command of this ship as of zero-two-three-zero hours."

The point is, he could do that while leaving the XO high and dry, by virtue of his seniority. That is, perhaps Chekov was Kirk's second-in-command and Spock was a passenger, until an emergency emerged and Spock changed modes.

Kirk refers to Spock as the first officer during dinner with the Klingons.

3) Or even she wasn't the first officer at all, just the senior officer of the watch at that time.

Then she wouldn't be called "Number One." That nickname is reserved exclusively for the XO, and has been throughout history.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ True dat. Still, though, Number One doesn't have to be the actual first officer; she might only be the acting one. If, as I suggested, the real XO was off the ship for whatever reason. (This is assuming Number One's rank really is "lieutenant," which is also not certain.)

 

[Nerys Myk]

Roddenberry was in the US Army, he flew bombers.

He was in the US Army Air Corps which became the US Army Air Forces in 1941.

 

[T'Girl]

the Enterprise's actual first officer was on leave, or injured and recovering at a starbase (could have been one of the victims of the 'fight on Rigel VII' spoken of in the episode), and Number One was just filling in for that person.

It wouldn't be impossible that the "original" first officer was killed and she was assigned to the position of first officer.

As first officer she still could have held the rank of Lieutenant, as first officer she wouldn't have to out rank everyone aboard the ship other than the captain (although I understand it helps), her position would give her authority over higher ranking officers.

If the ship's chief engineer were a Lt. Commander, as first officer she could legally issue that person an order.

Roddenberry was in the US Army, he flew bombers.

He was in the US Army Air Corps which became the US Army Air Forces in 1941.

Yes, the Air Corps arm of the US Army.

 

[MacLeod]

the Enterprise's actual first officer was on leave, or injured and recovering at a starbase (could have been one of the victims of the 'fight on Rigel VII' spoken of in the episode), and Number One was just filling in for that person.

It wouldn't be impossible that the "original" first officer was killed and she was assigned to the position of first officer.

As first officer she still could have held the rank of Lieutenant, as first officer she wouldn't have to out rank everyone aboard the ship other than the captain (although I understand it helps), her position would give her authority over higher ranking officers.

If the ship's chief engineer were a Lt. Commander, as first officer she could legally issue that person an order.

I supose the extreme case of postional authority we have seen is Chief of O'Brien an NCO who is Chief of Operations DSN and Cheif Engineer USS Defiant.