Starfleet...Military or Not

[The Wormhole]

Is Starfleet military? Yes.

Military with additional responsibilities that today's military forces don't have.

What exactly does that mean? Everything we see Starfleet do has been done my militaries either today or in the past. True, Starfleet does have a larger science division than any military today, but that is a reality of working in space, not indication of being less military or having "additional responsibilities."

I liked nuPike's description of Starfleet as a "peacekeeping armada". Sort of splits the difference between the two.

No it doesn't. Most peacekeeping operations today are handled by the military, and indeed UN Peacekeepers are military personnel acting on detached duty from their nation's forces. So while Pike's description might sound non-military to the layman, it is in fact military.

Gene Roddenberry was emphatic that STARFLEET was not a militaristic organisation. And ... I believe him.

That was with TNG. Go back and watch TOS, Starfleet is very clearly military. TOS season 1 in particular basically is a US Navy ship in space. Plus, we also know from TOS that there is a Starfleet protocol authorizing a starship to wipe out all life on an inhabited planet. Why they hell would any government allow anyone other than the military to make and carry out a decision like that? Hell, it's questionable if even the military should be making a call like that, but that's getting off topic.

Years later, for whatever reason Roddenberry began his tirade that Starfleet isn't military, but simply put, he was wrong. That simple.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

Gene Roddenberry was emphatic that STARFLEET was not a militaristic organisation. And ... I believe him.

Roddenberry said that in a misguided attempt to undermine Nicholas Meyer and Harve Bennett, whom he blamed for taking Star Trek away from him prior to TWOK. Everything about the way TOS was written suggests that Starfleet was a military organization (promotions, demotions, court martials, etc.).

--Sran

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Gene Roddenberry was emphatic that STARFLEET was not a militaristic organisation. And ... I believe him.

Of course Starfleet's not militarISTIC. But it's still MILITARY. There is a difference.

 

[T'Girl]

But during times of war, Starfleet becomes damned militaristic.

Thankfully for the Federation.

 

[BillJ]

Military.

 

[Cyke101]

Military, though I'm of the belief that the term or concept of military could very well change over the next few hundred years, like so many of today's definitions and labels. While it's true that today's military also conducts research and exploration duties, the military of the future could probably place a stronger emphasis on those duties over defense.

With that said, Starfleet also doesn't seem to be focused on a war machine mentality, a mentality that produces for the sake of production and profits under the guise of defense. Indeed, the corrupt admirals we've seen over the years tend to have over-militarization or upsetting the balance of priorities as a common goal. Starfleet isn't a war machine, but we've seen villains who want to turn it into one. Thankfully our heroes are much more levelheaded.

Gene Roddenberry was emphatic that STARFLEET was not a militaristic organisation. And ... I believe him.

Of course Starfleet's not militarISTIC. But it's still MILITARY. There is a difference.

Yep, agreed. Warhawks seem to be few and far between in Starfleet.

 

[IrishNero]

Occupations that wear a uniform:

Pizza Delivery Driver
Nurse
Fireman
Policeman
Military

Occupations that take orders:

McDonalds Customer Service Specialist
Policemen & Firemen
Military

Occupations with military-style ranks:

Policemen
Fireman
Military


Occupations with courts martial (referred to several times in TOS):

Military...

In 'Tomorrow is Yesterday,' Captain Kirk tells John Christopher that Starfleet is a "Combined Service" when asked if the Enterprise was a US Navy ship.

In 'By any other Name,' it is mentioned that Star Fleet has "handled foreign invasions before"

Hmmmm...I don't remember any of the ST crews spending significant time patrolling streets, making hamburgers, arresting thieves, putting out fires or delivering pizzas, so...your guess is as good as mine.

 

[Cyke101]

Occupations that wear a uniform:

Pizza Delivery Driver
Nurse
Fireman
Policeman
Military

Occupations that take orders:

McDonalds Customer Service Specialist
Policemen & Firemen
Military

Occupations with military-style ranks:

Policemen
Fireman
Military


Occupations with courts martial (referred to several times in TOS):

Military...

In 'Tomorrow is Yesterday,' Captain Kirk tells John Christopher that Starfleet is a "Combined Service" when asked if the Enterprise was a US Navy ship.

In 'By any other Name,' it is mentioned that Star Fleet has "handled foreign invasions before"

Hmmmm...I don't remember any of the ST crews spending significant time patrolling streets, making hamburgers, arresting thieves, putting out fires or delivering pizzas, so...your guess is as good as mine.

I once went to a military/Communist-themed Chinese restaurant, complete with tongue-in-cheek propaganda-style decorations of Mao Zedong.

No, I didn't get it, but their menu options had a nice kind of sweet-spiciness at reasonable prices. Though, I wonder if their staff -- who were in military uniforms -- had military-themed ranks, too.

 

[T'Girl]

Occupations that ...

... routinely operate weapons of mass destruction?

... have their own independent legal system that includes courts martials (and use that term)?

Military with additional responsibilities that today's military forces don't have.

What exactly does that mean? Everything we see Starfleet do has been done my militaries either today or in the past.

Defence, offence, exploration, first contact situations, engage in diplomacy/treaties, form alliances, pure science missions, mapping, help after natural disasters, search for natural resources.

And more.

 

[IrishNero]

Occupations that ...

... routinely operate weapons of mass destruction?

... have their own independent legal system that includes courts martials (and use that term)?

You're not telling me anything. I was fined $86 dollars under Article 15 (Non-judicial punishment) in 1990 for tearing up the commander's golf course with a dirt bike. Doesn't sound like much I know, but it adds up.

 

[Rincewiend]

Gene Roddenberry was emphatic that STARFLEET was not a militaristic organisation. And ... I believe him.

Of course Starfleet's not militarISTIC. But it's still MILITARY. There is a difference.

Same with Nasa...
Navy IIRC...

 

[Nightdiamond]

If you go AWOL, you can be punished for it. Sounds like some type of military to me.

Obviously the military, Starfleet just won't admit it for some reason.

If they're not, all they had to do was just explain exactly what they were and what they do.

Trek was weird that way.

 

[T'Girl]

Obviously the military, Starfleet just won't admit it for some reason

24th century politically correctness no doubt.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

So, Starfleet... Hot or Not?

 

[Ithekro]

Unless by the 24th century, they consider military to mean army, again. A force that is used to take planets and fight on the ground. That is definately not Starfleet's usual method of conducting themselves. Sure they have security personal, but they are not suited for the task of taking and holding planets. They can barely keep the ship's captain safe from whatever alien plants they run into that week.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Unless by the 24th century, they consider military to mean army, again. A force that is used to take planets and fight on the ground. That is definately not Starfleet's usual method of conducting themselves.

No DS9 shows Starfleet has ground forces.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

Unless by the 24th century, they consider military to mean army, again. A force that is used to take planets and fight on the ground. That is definately not Starfleet's usual method of conducting themselves.

No DS9 shows Starfleet has ground forces.

And a fat lot of good they do.

 

[Lance]

I have heard debate both in person and on these forums about whether or not Starfleet can be considered "Military." Being military myself I see a lot of similarities between military life and Starfleet, yet I distinctly remember several episodes in several series' where they specifically say they aren't military. That being said I know many people who do consider Starfleet to be military.

I am on the fence. I say this because they do say several times they are not a military, that they are dedicated to space exploration, yet there are episodes throughout all the series' where they go to "war" with alien races, that's a very "military" act. On top of that they maintain military structure, wear uniforms, follow a chain of command structure, and have ships specifically for battle situations (DS9). All of that makes me think they are military. Yet the military isn't dedicated to scientific exploration, so that leads me to think it isn't.

Well, with due respect to you and your service to the military, I don't think that your statement that "the military isn't dedicated to scientific exploration" is historically true.

What we need to take into account is that Starfleet isn't like the military now, in our day and age when the entire surface of the planet is known and quantified and the only mission objectives that a military has are of either a peacekeeping or warmongering nature..... no, Starfleet is instead like the military back in the golden age of sail, in the 17th and 18th centuries, when much of the world was yet to be explored, and the great military leaders were not just fighters and tactitians, but explorers and scientists as well. Bare in mind that two of the most important people in the militaries of old were the cartographers, whose job it was to map out the coastlines of strange new lands, and botanists, whose job was to, once landfall had been made, take samples of local flora and fauna for scientific study.

Basically, militaries have always had a primary objective of territorial expansion (as you put it, "war"). But their secondary objective, in the old days, included discovering more about the world, and adding to the collective knowledge of humanity. Charting 'the great unknown', as it were. Sounds a lot like Starfleet to me.

 

[Ithekro]

Unless by the 24th century, they consider military to mean army, again. A force that is used to take planets and fight on the ground. That is definately not Starfleet's usual method of conducting themselves.

No DS9 shows Starfleet has ground forces.

Are they actually Starfleet though, and not some other orginization that was taken to places by Starfleet to use in times of war. We only see these people during the war with the Klingons.

 

[DavidGutierrez]

For me, this all revolves around Picard's assertion in "Peak Performance" that "Starfleet is not a military organization." I think that was a simple case of poor writing, or at the very least a line being written by someone with little to no military experience. I don't know very much about David Kemper (the episode's writer), but I can't find any evidence that he ever served in the armed forces.

Starfleet is clearly a military organization. However, combat is not its primary mission, as it is in most of our modern militaries in today's world. Starfleet's primary mission, as stated time and again, is exploration. They are capable of self-defense, defending the interests and installations of the Federation, and even waging war, but Starfleet is first and foremost an exploration entity.

I don't think this is a bad thing. I think that the writers should have leaned into it, honestly. They could have instantly made Star Trek that much more relatable if they had talked about characters joining Starfleet in the context of why some people join the military today: they answered a call to explore.