Why Did The Enterprise Hide In The Ocean?

[DonIago]

It seems reasonable to assume that for one reason or another the Enterprise's transporters wouldn't function from orbit. Lord knows anyone who's watched Trek before knows the transporters can be finicky. I'm perfectly fine with this not being spelled out in this case.

It does kind of amuse me when people who don't have a full context conclude that the characters must be behaving stupidly, versus assuming that they must know something we don't.

 

[HIjol]

Why did the Enterprise hide in the ocean?

Because it could not walk on water!

<man, I TOLD you not to type that joke...tooooo Biblical, but oh, no, You know EEEVVERYthing!>

 

[F. King Daniel]

This may have been talked about before but I have only been here a short while. At the beginning of the movie the enterprise is hidden in the water to supposedly hide from the aliens. But when they need to save Spock the Enterprise looms put of the water right in view of the aliens. Wouldn't it have been better to orbit the planet? The aliens would at most seen just a small dot or shape on the horizon. Hiding the ship in the water brought the ship to close to prying eyes. I have only seen the movie once so I don't remember if they explained this in the movie. Anyone know or have a explanation?

Same reason they hid the cloaked Holoship underwater in Insurrection.

 

[IrishNero]

All of the reasons mentioned above and also, they were trying to learn about the culture of the natives. I'll point out that stupid and reckless has often defined the actions of the crew. Luck, as much as anything else, has often been the reason for success.

 

[TRON JA307020]

This may have been talked about before but I have only been here a short while. At the beginning of the movie the enterprise is hidden in the water to supposedly hide from the aliens. But when they need to save Spock the Enterprise looms put of the water right in view of the aliens. Wouldn't it have been better to orbit the planet? The aliens would at most seen just a small dot or shape on the horizon. Hiding the ship in the water brought the ship to close to prying eyes. I have only seen the movie once so I don't remember if they explained this in the movie. Anyone know or have a explanation?

Same reason they hid the cloaked Holoship underwater in Insurrection.

So no one would accidently walk into it and bump their noggin?

 

[IrishNero]

This may have been talked about before but I have only been here a short while. At the beginning of the movie the enterprise is hidden in the water to supposedly hide from the aliens. But when they need to save Spock the Enterprise looms put of the water right in view of the aliens. Wouldn't it have been better to orbit the planet? The aliens would at most seen just a small dot or shape on the horizon. Hiding the ship in the water brought the ship to close to prying eyes. I have only seen the movie once so I don't remember if they explained this in the movie. Anyone know or have a explanation?

Same reason they hid the cloaked Holoship underwater in Insurrection.

So no one would accidently walk into it and bump their noggin?

Well, to be fair, that is before they invented the Noggin-bumpin' Avoidance System (NbAS) that was automatically included as part of package C on the Enterpride D model (as long as you also selected the cloaking device, pinstripes and the ashtray-delete options)

 

[Timo]

Considering the cliff and all, it's apparently possible to fly a starship into that location and out of it without being spotted by the natives in their village or its usual environs. That's probably what the shuttle did, too - looping around the mountain and coming in under the horizon. I mean, if such a safe approach route did not exist, how did the ship get there in the first place? It's just that there was no time for the safe route when Spock was about to fry, and the natives were right next to the ship anyway.

Was the underwater parking slot supposed to be a long-term base of operations? Things speaking for a mission that only lasted for a few hours, total:

- Scotty still hasn't come to terms with being underwater
- The plan to evacuate the village is half-baked but clearly extremely time-critical
- Kirk doesn't know that the beast is part of the plan
- The shuttle flight and the evacuation take place in synch, while there is no obvious reason for such synch other than both requiring great hurry

Things suggesting there was some preceding activity before the cameras joined the action:

- Spock has created this device that meets the needs of the day; it's not as if those would be standard issue (or else an expert of Spock's caliber wouldn't be needed for inserting the device)
- Well, not much else...

Yet the heroes have gone to the trouble of taking the ship down, presumably during the previous night (as the location, while below the horizon, isn't all that far from the village). We could plead a combination: the heroes arrived in orbit, spent a realistic time spotting and analyzing the upcoming big kaboom, spent a realistic time devising a countermeasure, and then landed to execute their plan. Possibly the plan included the option of taking all the natives aboard the ship if everything else failed, and that couldn't be done by transporter (too slow) or shuttle (natives putting up resistance, and too slow), but might be done by ushering everybody in through the shuttlebay doors in one great panicky rush!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Dukhat]

This may have been talked about before but I have only been here a short while. At the beginning of the movie the enterprise is hidden in the water to supposedly hide from the aliens. But when they need to save Spock the Enterprise looms put of the water right in view of the aliens. Wouldn't it have been better to orbit the planet? The aliens would at most seen just a small dot or shape on the horizon. Hiding the ship in the water brought the ship to close to prying eyes. I have only seen the movie once so I don't remember if they explained this in the movie. Anyone know or have a explanation?

You've already answered your own question.

The whole point of having the Enterprise under water was so that the natives could see it, start drawing pictures of it in the sand, and start worshiping it as a god. Oh, and because of that, it was a huge factor in Kirk being seen as too reckless and having his ship taken away from him. None of that could very well happen if the ship was in space, now, would it?

It's called a plot contrivance, and it's nothing new to Star Trek.

 

[BillJ]

Why Did The Enterprise Hide In The Ocean?

It couldn't fit in the closet!

 

[Cyke101]

It's called a plot contrivance, and it's nothing new to Star Trek.

Another example: a Starfleet with an untold but large number of vessels, and Enterprise is the only ship in range. Even if she's parked at Earth! And why? So that it can be the first and only ship on the scene for the sake of adventure. It'd be pointless if, by the time Enterprise got there, the emergency had been resolved by another ship.

It actually hasn't happened in the JJVerse, and if they can avoid that little plot contrivance, I'll continue to be happy.

 

[BillJ]

It actually hasn't happened in the JJVerse, and if they can avoid that little plot contrivance, I'll continue to be happy.

Well, it kinda did when the Enterprise drops out of warp near Earth and is the only ship around and then gets beat up by the Vengeance.

 

[Dukhat]

It actually hasn't happened in the JJVerse, and if they can avoid that little plot contrivance, I'll continue to be happy.

Well, it kinda did when the Enterprise drops out of warp near Earth and is the only ship around and then gets beat up by the Vengeance.

And let's not forget Starfleet sending all their ships to the Laurentian Sector in the first movie for no reason that was mentioned (other than to get them all out of the way of the story).

 

[Cyke101]

It actually hasn't happened in the JJVerse, and if they can avoid that little plot contrivance, I'll continue to be happy.

Well, it kinda did when the Enterprise drops out of warp near Earth and is the only ship around and then gets beat up by the Vengeance.

I stand corrected, but the Vengeance was also jamming their communications, starting from the warp speed chase, so there's at least that.

It actually hasn't happened in the JJVerse, and if they can avoid that little plot contrivance, I'll continue to be happy.

Well, it kinda did when the Enterprise drops out of warp near Earth and is the only ship around and then gets beat up by the Vengeance.

And let's not forget Starfleet sending all their ships to the Laurentian Sector in the first movie for no reason that was mentioned (other than to get them all out of the way of the story).

But they still left Enterprise with a small group of ships for Vulcan, correct? Or was that after Vulcan's destruction? My memory is a bit hazy. Though you're right, they never did explain why the bulk of the fleet was in the Laurentian sector.

 

[eyeresist]

It was the rule of cool, but it does raise the interesting possibility that the Enterprise is tougher than was previously thought, able to withstand all sorts of hostile environments. Even a Star Trek forum!

 

[Timo]

Well, it kinda did when the Enterprise drops out of warp near Earth and is the only ship around and then gets beat up by the Vengeance.

And why not? The Enterprise is an enemy vessel, the Vengeance is the valiant defender of Earth. So say we all! Why should the other vessels of Starfleet interfere when the good side, that of Admiral Marcus, is winning, and telling others to stand back?

And let's not forget Starfleet sending all their ships to the Laurentian Sector in the first movie for no reason that was mentioned (other than to get them all out of the way of the story).

But that was also clearly established as the modus operandi of the villain: disinformation was his best weapon, and making entire fleets of starships dance to his tune is what allowed him to destroy Vulcan. It should not require much speculation to accept that Nero sent the ships to Laurentius!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[IrishNero]

It should not require much speculation to accept that Nero sent the ships to Laurentius!

Timo Saloniemi

Yes I did. You know me so well.

 

[shapeshifter]

We didn't get to see the ship launch from Earth in ST09, this made up for that that.

Plus, it foreshadowed the climactic ending of the film when the same gravity overcoming system saves Enterprise from her death dive.

 

[Dukhat]

But that was also clearly established as the modus operandi of the villain: disinformation was his best weapon, and making entire fleets of starships dance to his tune is what allowed him to destroy Vulcan. It should not require much speculation to accept that Nero sent the ships to Laurentius!

I do not recall anywhere in the movie where it was implied or outright stated that Nero was the reason why Starfleet sent all their ships to the Laurentian Sector. Would you care to enlighten us as to where this idea came from?

 

[Timo]

Oh, it's been discussed often enough... Two factors would make this the preferred interpretation.

1) Anything else would be a coincidence too unrealistic even for the fantasy setting of the movie. Sure, the writers may have chosen to rely on coincidences. But the in-universe characters have no need for that.
2) Nero fools the fleet of ships crewed by the cadets, so it's pretty likely he fooled the other fleet, too. He's a man of habit, to his peril even.

The emergency call from Vulcan is faked: there are no seismic disturbances yet when the signal is sent. Nero only starts drilling later, when the fleet is already underway. So the fleet is lured into a trap, making a "peacetime" downwarping right in the middle of Nero's kill zone; the massacre makes both Vulcan and Earth defenseless (non-starship defenses apparently succumb because Nero always captures somebody who knows the necessary codes and tortures those out of the poor sap).

Now, it would be an incredible coincidence that Starfleet is leaving Vulcan and Earth underdefended exactly when Spock arrives from the future - within a couple of hours of that event, as stated. But there is no need for that to be a coincidence, as we know Nero is in the habit of sending false signals, just as he is in the habit of kidnapping Starfleet officers in the know.

And that fits the picture, too, as Nero is no soldier. Of course he would have habits, an extremely limited number of tactics at his disposal. Telling Starfleet that "there has been a big battle with Klingons, a massive Romulan ship slaughtering them wholesale" would send the main fleet responding to that crisis - if 47 Klingon ships won't cut it, then Starfleet better send at least a couple of hundred...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Dukhat]

1) Anything else would be a coincidence too unrealistic even for the fantasy setting of the movie. Sure, the writers may have chosen to rely on coincidences. But the in-universe characters have no need for that.

This is no different from every other time there are no other ships in the sector except for the Enterprise. The only difference here is that someone actually decided to come up with a reason for it, albeit a not very descriptive one.

2) Nero fools the fleet of ships crewed by the cadets, so it's pretty likely he fooled the other fleet, too. He's a man of habit, to his peril even.

How did Nero fool the cadet ships? If you're implying that he was the one who faked the distress call, that makes no sense whatsoever. Why would he do such a thing? He only wants to destroy Vulcan while Spock Prime watches from Delta Vega as revenge. Nero has no interest whatsoever in luring 8 ships to Vulcan just to destroy them too. Obviously the distress call came from Vulcan.

The emergency call from Vulcan is faked: there are no seismic disturbances yet when the signal is sent. Nero only starts drilling later, when the fleet is already underway. So the fleet is lured into a trap, making a "peacetime" downwarping right in the middle of Nero's kill zone; the massacre makes both Vulcan and Earth defenseless (non-starship defenses apparently succumb because Nero always captures somebody who knows the necessary codes and tortures those out of the poor sap).

Again, we have no idea what the Narada was doing before it started drilling. It could have been taking out Vulcan's orbital and planetary defenses. That would give Vulcan plenty of time to send out their distress call before Nero even started up his drill.

Now, it would be an incredible coincidence that Starfleet is leaving Vulcan and Earth underdefended exactly when Spock arrives from the future - within a couple of hours of that event, as stated. But there is no need for that to be a coincidence, as we know Nero is in the habit of sending false signals, just as he is in the habit of kidnapping Starfleet officers in the know.

See my first response.

And that fits the picture, too, as Nero is no soldier. Of course he would have habits, an extremely limited number of tactics at his disposal. Telling Starfleet that "there has been a big battle with Klingons, a massive Romulan ship slaughtering them wholesale" would send the main fleet responding to that crisis - if 47 Klingon ships won't cut it, then Starfleet better send at least a couple of hundred...

Again, you're implying a link between what Nero did to the 47 Klingon ships, and Starfleet sending their ships to the Laurentian Sector, when there's only the barest of circumstantial evidence that this was the case, if even that. We have no idea how long the fleet was there. It could have been there for months. And even if Nero was responsible, why would he make such a lure? If destroying those 8 ships over Vulcan was that easy, then he would have just destroyed the rest of the fleet, not lure them away with some silly pretense. Nero also never admitted he had done anything of the sort, and he is most definitely the type of person who would admit such a thing to Kirk, Spock, Pike, or anyone the first chance he got.