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Who is Starfleet's biggest fizzle?

Who is Starfleet's biggest disappointment?

  • Ensign Travis Mayweather

    Votes: 14 31.8%
  • Lt. Saavik

    Votes: 3 6.8%
  • Commander William Riker

    Votes: 10 22.7%
  • Ensign Harry Kim

    Votes: 17 38.6%
  • Write in from any series

    Votes: 10 22.7%

  • Total voters
    44
None of them have anything on Wesley Crusher. Mr. Child Prodigy who was written as wanting nothing else but to join starfleet and gets Picard to help him get in, then is partially responsible for a cadet being killed and helped cover it up then Picard intercedes and helps him salvage his career, and then Wesley ultimately quit Starfleet a couple years later.

Second place has to go to Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.
 
I'm much less concerned about Spock since, as Nerys pointed out, Spock entered the world of diplomacy. TNG turned him into an ambassador -- which makes sense since Unification/TUC were in overlapping production and TUC starts out with Spock as part of the special Federation envoy to the Klingon Empire. It's also one of the few TNG elements that lived on into the JJverse. So even though he's technically outside of Starfleet, *everybody* in Starfleet during the TNG era regards him as a legend.

It could very well be that while we Trekkies in the real world will always think of him as a First Officer, in-universe he could be much better known as an ambassador, which is a very, very accomplished, respectable feat.

Yeah but even in the period between TVH and TUC there were several years where he seemed to be more a regular line starfleet officer as opposed to his eventual shift towards the diplomatic corps. Why wasn't he apparently he offered his command during that period and just demoted back to first officer. Yeah I know the whole "loyality to Kirk" thing could be played as a card, but it just seemed like a demotion for no good reason to me.

This isn't quite explained, but it could be that Spock still needed some mental recovery and reeducation after the events of TSFS. TVH showed him undergoing the process, but it was interrupted by the trip back to Earth and then the whale probe incident (and then played up for comedy throughout the movie).

But then I'd only say that only really covers TVH - TFF. Between TFF and TUC, that's anyone's guess, but I think TUC implies that eventually he moved into something akin to Starfleet's equivalent of a part-time position for XO while jumping into diplomacy.

Or he could have seen what a shitty job the 3 diplomats on Nimbus were doing and decided to roll up his sleeves to show 'em how it's done.

Though, I think it's important to note that in the real-world US Navy, working hard to the rank of captaincy doesn't necessarily guarantee permanent command since there are only so many ships around. Indeed, there are many officers who rise above the rank of captain but don't command a vessel because that's either not where their careers take them, or they choose not to (and Starfleet, much more than the Navy, seems to allow for a lot more room for personal preference when it comes to career). So Spock could have stepped down from the position by his own choice as well. And it could be that Starfleet regards Spock as a good captain but an even better potential diplomat; where Spock is put to better use not on a single starship, but affecting large scale policy, so he could have been groomed during that time as well. But that's just speculation on my part.

And then somwhow was back in uniform for Riker's wedding.

Starfleet is a very forgiving place. First he commits perjury and partakes in a cover up involving the death of a cadet and then he defies orders and compromises a diplomatic mission, making a volatile situation worse, and then escapes punishment by giving his resignation. And yet a few years later, they take him back! Wow!:rolleyes:

I'm going with the ironically less fantastic idea: that his abilities as a Traveller enabled him to make a uniform out of thin-air like Q.

I'm more inclined to believe that than the idea that Starfleet would take him back, at least.


You're right that's definitely more plausible than Starfleet taking him back.
 
None of them have anything on Wesley Crusher. Mr. Child Prodigy who was written as wanting nothing else but to join starfleet and gets Picard to help him get in, then is partially responsible for a cadet being killed and helped cover it up then Picard intercedes and helps him salvage his career, and then Wesley ultimately quit Starfleet a couple years later.

Second place has to go to Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

Agrred. They did some weird things with both of those characters. The last we saw Wesley? He was back in Starfleet in a weird deleted scene from Nemesis.

He was at Rikers wedding, acting like nothing ever happened.

Ro-- not only did she betray Starfleet two times, but in the novels, they let her back in, and made her the head of DS9 security.
 
Though Riker did turn down advances, I wouldn't call him a fizzle. He did wonders for Starfleet in that Klingon exchange program (taking command of the ship), saved the Earth from the Borg, and (though only Picard and Q know) he saved the galaxy when he came to the rescue in All Good Things.

So he thought he had more to learn from Picard. I wouldn't call him a fizzle for that. He ultimately became a Captain anyway.

...Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

She's my write in. Though I enjoyed the character, she fits the title. Not only did she get a second chance, but she got it on the flag ship and the renowned Picard gave her that chance.
 
None of them have anything on Wesley Crusher. Mr. Child Prodigy who was written as wanting nothing else but to join starfleet and gets Picard to help him get in, then is partially responsible for a cadet being killed and helped cover it up then Picard intercedes and helps him salvage his career, and then Wesley ultimately quit Starfleet a couple years later.

Second place has to go to Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

Agrred. They did some weird things with both of those characters. The last we saw Wesley? He was back in Starfleet in a weird deleted scene from Nemesis.

He was at Rikers wedding, acting like nothing ever happened.

Ro-- not only did she betray Starfleet two times, but in the novels, they let her back in, and made her the head of DS9 security.

Actually, it's a bit weirder than that. When she was DS9's chief of security, she was a Bajoran Militia officer. When she does get reinstated in Starfleet, she's made DS9's commanding officer, a position she still holds in the current novel continuity.
 
...Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

She's my write in. Though I enjoyed the character, she fits the title. Not only did she get a second chance, but she got it on the flag ship and the renowned Picard gave her that chance.

Actually, it's a bit weirder than that. When she was DS9's chief of security, she was a Bajoran Militia officer. When she does get reinstated in Starfleet, she's made DS9's commanding officer, a position she still holds in the current novel continuity.


So, if we took the novels seriously, Ro got reinstated twice after insubordination (without being demoted) and then promoted 3 times afterwards.

I don't knock the novels, but this one strains belief a bit.

After committing both insubordination and treason, there's no way StarFleet would let her back in, let alone promote her.

I can see the Bajoran militia recruiting her, because they don't have a history, and they hate Cardassians, but Starfleet would never trust her again.
 
None of them have anything on Wesley Crusher. Mr. Child Prodigy who was written as wanting nothing else but to join starfleet and gets Picard to help him get in, then is partially responsible for a cadet being killed and helped cover it up then Picard intercedes and helps him salvage his career, and then Wesley ultimately quit Starfleet a couple years later.

Second place has to go to Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

Agrred. They did some weird things with both of those characters. The last we saw Wesley? He was back in Starfleet in a weird deleted scene from Nemesis.

He was at Rikers wedding, acting like nothing ever happened.

Ro-- not only did she betray Starfleet two times, but in the novels, they let her back in, and made her the head of DS9 security.

With regards to Wes, perhaps it was the little known seldom used reserve activation clause.
 
None of them have anything on Wesley Crusher. Mr. Child Prodigy who was written as wanting nothing else but to join starfleet and gets Picard to help him get in, then is partially responsible for a cadet being killed and helped cover it up then Picard intercedes and helps him salvage his career, and then Wesley ultimately quit Starfleet a couple years later.

Second place has to go to Ensign Ro. Dishonorably discharged, given a second chance, then stabs Picard and crew in the back and betrays them before leaving starfleet for good. I hate that character with a passion.

Agrred. They did some weird things with both of those characters. The last we saw Wesley? He was back in Starfleet in a weird deleted scene from Nemesis.

He was at Rikers wedding, acting like nothing ever happened.

Ro-- not only did she betray Starfleet two times, but in the novels, they let her back in, and made her the head of DS9 security.

With regards to Wes, perhaps it was the little known seldom used reserve activation clause.

What's that?
 
Agrred. They did some weird things with both of those characters. The last we saw Wesley? He was back in Starfleet in a weird deleted scene from Nemesis.

He was at Rikers wedding, acting like nothing ever happened.

Ro-- not only did she betray Starfleet two times, but in the novels, they let her back in, and made her the head of DS9 security.

With regards to Wes, perhaps it was the little known seldom used reserve activation clause.

What's that?

When McCoy is beamed aboard the Enterprise in TMP Kirk teases him by saying how apparently he said he'd never return to Starfleet.

McCoy responds by saying that they used a little known, seldom used "Reserve activation clause...In other words they drafted me" Until he realizes Kirk was behind it all and he needs Bones as a friend because Kirk is starting new.
 
^this proves one thing, the novels are completely unreliable.

The novels also say Ro Laren had a sexual relationship with Quark.

I never understood the tendency to keep adding far out premises to characters and story lines in the novels.

Some of them are a pretty good read, but they have tendency to go way out into la la land. That's where I begin stop to reading the book.
 
With regards to Wes, perhaps it was the little known seldom used reserve activation clause.

What's that?

When McCoy is beamed aboard the Enterprise in TMP Kirk teases him by saying how apparently he said he'd never return to Starfleet.

McCoy responds by saying that they used a little known, seldom used "Reserve activation clause...In other words they drafted me" Until he realizes Kirk was behind it all and he needs Bones as a friend because Kirk is starting new.

The difference being that McCoy is a hero and Wes is guilty of grievous offenses, twice. As a matter of law you don't draft delinquents, especially, I would imagine in Starfleet, with its high moral standards and all.
 
Nooo... Harry is the best!! I like that guy!!

My write in candidate is Seska, what a loser she is. Okay she isn't exactly Starfleet, but ... First she hangs with the cool Maquis, then she gets an opportunity on the awesome Voyager. But what does she do? She betrays them all and joins the Kazon, the K a z o n, the dumbest savages of them all. And to top it off, she conceives a child just to blackmail Chakotay. How pathetic is that!?!
 
What's that?

When McCoy is beamed aboard the Enterprise in TMP Kirk teases him by saying how apparently he said he'd never return to Starfleet.

McCoy responds by saying that they used a little known, seldom used "Reserve activation clause...In other words they drafted me" Until he realizes Kirk was behind it all and he needs Bones as a friend because Kirk is starting new.

The difference being that McCoy is a hero and Wes is guilty of grievous offenses, twice. As a matter of law you don't draft delinquents, especially, I would imagine in Starfleet, with its high moral standards and all.

Let's see he was given a formal reprimand and had to resit his year in "The First Duty", so he served his punsiment. As for "Journey's End" as far as can be dertermined no charges were brought so in the eyes of the law he wasn't guilty of any offense. Besides how many times have we seen people violate Starfleet General Order One aka the Prime Directive and get away with it?

You could make a case that in Journey's End Picard knew what they were doing was wrong, relocating a people against they will is wrong, if they choose to accept the risks i.e being Cardassian subjects then that's their choice. But they still have the right to choose relocation or stay put.
 
When McCoy is beamed aboard the Enterprise in TMP Kirk teases him by saying how apparently he said he'd never return to Starfleet.

McCoy responds by saying that they used a little known, seldom used "Reserve activation clause...In other words they drafted me" Until he realizes Kirk was behind it all and he needs Bones as a friend because Kirk is starting new.

The difference being that McCoy is a hero and Wes is guilty of grievous offenses, twice. As a matter of law you don't draft delinquents, especially, I would imagine in Starfleet, with its high moral standards and all.

Let's see he was given a formal reprimand and had to resit his year in "The First Duty", so he served his punsiment. As for "Journey's End" as far as can be dertermined no charges were brought so in the eyes of the law he wasn't guilty of any offense. Besides how many times have we seen people violate Starfleet General Order One aka the Prime Directive and get away with it?

You could make a case that in Journey's End Picard knew what they were doing was wrong, relocating a people against they will is wrong, if they choose to accept the risks i.e being Cardassian subjects then that's their choice. But they still have the right to choose relocation or stay put.

The question is Wesley's act of insubordination plus his inflammatory harangue to the locals. He really stepped into it, that time. The matter of whether they were doing the right thing wasn't his to question, at least as far as a starfleet tribunal is concerned.
 
I went with Mayweather, not for anything reasonable, but for the act....ing....... The................ actin.......g

I don't know it's the acting. I think it's probably sub par writing: no character development for Travis and no screen time for the character. Just like TOS Uhura, she had wayyy to little to do in the series, while the new movies prove that she can be an interesting character. I also suspect that Chakotay is one of the worse characters and therefore boring.
 
Riker. Did anybody ever have high expectations for Kim?

I suppose Bashir. If he had only not mistaken that pre-ganglionic nuclei for a post ganglionic fiber!
 
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