8x10 In the Forest of the Night (Grading/Discussion) SPOILERS!

[davejames]

Meh. It's not a completely bad episode, the first twenty minutes or so are somewhat entertaining even if a bit "been there, done that." But when we get the reveal of the dangerous solar flare mere minutes after learning the trees are fireproof, it becomes very obvious the trees are meant for protection. But the episode drags its ass trying to makes us believe the solar flare spells doom that it makes the second half rather tedious indeed. And how does it take a genius over two thousand years old like the Doctor so long to figure out the blindingly obvious. This isn't a case where the Doctor is intentionally playing up his ignorance for comedic effect, as when he does figure things out, he seems genuinely surprised. "Doctor Idiot" or whatever it is he calls himself indeed. Worse, even Missy seems surprised at the outcome. Maybe she missed the revelation the trees are fireproof?

Just because that was an obvious possibility doesn't mean it's the only one. The trees being fireproof could have simply been their own survival mechanism for the coming apocalypse (or something done to protect the Earth itself). It doesn't automatically mean they were out to protect humanity as well, or that such a thing would even be possible.

Until it was brought up at the end, there was nothing to suggest this so-called "oxygen barrier" would have even existed or been able to help.

 

[Lakenheath 72]

The Doctor called it "airbag".

a bag that fills with air to protect a driver or passenger when a vehicle crashes

(http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/air bag)

So, which crashed into whom, the Earth into the solar flare, or the solar flare into the Earth?

The show was called a space fantasy by Verity Lambert and I have heard Barry Letts call it too a space fantasy. However, the show has to be based in some form of grounding, or the audience will have trouble relating to the events in the story, according to them. The show can have some rubbish, but the rubbish shouldn't overwhelm the characters or the story. I don't place the blame squarely on the story's writer; I place it on Moffat for it is him who directs the franchise and is ultimately responsible for what is put on the air. He approved this script.

 

[Starkers]

I think the "power of forgetting" thing doesn't quite work unless there's something more supernatural in play. Yes, it's possible that "last time" people forgot everything but the memory of scary forests, which they put in fairy tales. But the last time was before modern recording devices (it may even have been before writing, they were ambiguous on that point. Certainly before widespread literacy and writing).

Maybe in the real world, but this is a world that's already seen tons of weird things and been through tons of alien invasions. So they'll probably find it a bit easier to move on from it. Especially with the forest having completely disappeared the very same day. Even if it was something you were curious about, there isn't any way to investigate it further, so I imagine people probably would start to gradually forget about it over time.

Well, that's another odd thing. At least to RTD's credit, people knew they were living in a world with aliens visiting Earth. Moffatt retconned that with the cracks so as to at least take away that active knowledge (things are more a mystery once more). But they still want world-changing events without actually changing the world. People aren't "used to it" in the show. In fact, they seem quite surprised every single time.

Did they? I seem to recall the notion of how much people were aware of back in the RTD era being somewhat vague to say the least. One minute people seemed to ignore/forget about alien invasions, the next they were evacuating London because Christmas was coming and they were expecting an alien invasion!

I don't think either RTD or Moffat has been able to reconcile the situation. Re this episode I can accept the trees making us forget, but erasing every pixel of every picture/video...nah

 

[publiusr]

Rewatching the ep. The spirits protecting the Earth made me think of The Green from the Swamp Thing comics.

A third borrowed from Swmap Thing, a third The Lorax and a third Avatar.

Mixed with Little Red Riding Hoodie, and maybe just a little of The Word for World is Forest

I really hated that the Doctor thought Tunguska would have smashed the Earth without trees. Making the forest seem threatening is what made the episode early on. If anything--I had thought the trees replaced London--not just overgrowing it. The wolves I had hoped were actually something else.

The return of the sister at the end was a little too disjointed--although I liked the trippy feel--as if the air were saturated by chemicals.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

I am really curious to see what is going to come from the Missy story with regards to the characters and see if it explains some things. Series 8 has been largely devoid of timey wimey screwball stuff and the arc seem to be more introspective in nature so I'm hoping there's a solid payoff.

 

[trash80]

I enjoyed the episode, especially the one liners but find Danny Pink... Well just weird. Is he actually human? He doesn't seem to act like one.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Maybe in the real world, but this is a world that's already seen tons of weird things and been through tons of alien invasions. So they'll probably find it a bit easier to move on from it. Especially with the forest having completely disappeared the very same day. Even if it was something you were curious about, there isn't any way to investigate it further, so I imagine people probably would start to gradually forget about it over time.

Well, that's another odd thing. At least to RTD's credit, people knew they were living in a world with aliens visiting Earth. Moffatt retconned that with the cracks so as to at least take away that active knowledge (things are more a mystery once more). But they still want world-changing events without actually changing the world. People aren't "used to it" in the show. In fact, they seem quite surprised every single time.

Did they? I seem to recall the notion of how much people were aware of back in the RTD era being somewhat vague to say the least. One minute people seemed to ignore/forget about alien invasions, the next they were evacuating London because Christmas was coming and they were expecting an alien invasion!

I don't think either RTD or Moffat has been able to reconcile the situation. Re this episode I can accept the trees making us forget, but erasing every pixel of every picture/video...nah

Aliens in London was a statement moment of "this changes things." Some people were exceptions (Donna was one who missed all the important things, to the Doctor's amazement). But that seemed like the exception rather than the rule. Maybe I'm wrong, but I can't remember too many moments of people being genuinely shocked by aliens (terrified, yes, but shocked?). Eleventh Hour made the point that things are back to normal (from our perspective).

Anyway, if trees can make our brains magically lose information, I have no problem with them doing the same to video. I don't see the need to arbitrarily draw the line with magic unless there's some evidence to think it would be the case.

 

[DarthPipes]

I am looking at the monologue in the context of the episode. The Doctor comes off not liking children ("I am not a child minder" and his treatment of Maebe Arden) and not liking the human attitude toward the trees, which can be seen as a war on nature. I don't think that the Doctor was referring to the pain of childbirth; I am thinking he was referring to the human tendency to have children, with parents being child minders. The Doctor I think was implying that being a chlld minder was as problematic as war. (Considering that this franchise began as a kid's show, and evolved into an adult show that kids can enjoy, this was an odd statement to make.)

There is this juxaposition of Maebe Arden' s mother, who leaves the safety of her home and travels on bicycle, to find her missing child and the Danny/Clara pairing and the Doctor who are too busy with their own issues to pay attention to the children in their care. This was raised in the episode where the Doctor said that adults are incapable of hearing to children.

Another point - so the Doctor didn't save his people or his world, as he states that he is the last of his species. So, what exactly happen to Gallifrey and his mission to find this planet? He has apparently given up this search, as now he is saying that Earth is his home.

Another point - I was watching a promo for this season. This Doctor said that he would rectify his past mistakes. I can't remember an instance of him doing this very thing this season.

I didn't think Maebe Arden was schizophrenic. She was in communication with the life force of the Earth, and was able to think a global forest into existence. What wasn't learned, and was glossed over, was how she knew, before the astronomers, that the Earth was facing a life-threatening solar flare. The adults assumed that she was suffering from delusions and placed her on medication. I think it is more scary that Maebe can think her sister into re-existence. Her sister didn't seem overly happy to see her. Did Maebe think her sister into non-existence? This has me thinking of the episode "It's a Good Life" from the Twilight Zone. (On top, I don't think the writer has an understanding of what special needs children were. I was a special needs child - I am autistic with a speech impairment and, although I had teachers who taught me Maths and English, I had one special needs teacher, Ms. Campbell, who helped me with learning difficulties. The children who went to the museum would have been with a special needs teacher, not their English or Maths teacher.)

My theory on saving Gallifrey is simple...the 12th Doctor hasn't gotten to it yet. Remember in Day of the Doctor, it took all 13 Doctors to pull that off and the final Doctor was the 12th one, who finished off the calculations. My guess (hope) is that he still is working on them and when he figures them out, we'll get to see his fleeting cameo in The Day of the Doctor in its proper context.

We'd BETTER return to Gallifrey. If you're going to reverse NuWho's defining storyline by bringing back Gallifrey then you've got to use it. Otherwise, it was a one-off gimmick in Moffat's world of no consequences.

 

[Captrek]

I've wondered how it was possible for Donna to be so oblivious. Speculation: when the Doctor erased her memories of him in Journey's End, the process reached back in time and erased her memories of Doctor-related incidents even before she met him.

 

[Snaploud]

I think nuWho largely survives on the charm of the main characters. Unfortunately, the characters and relationships this season have never really gelled, so we're starting to become more critical of plot elements that we might have given a pass in earlier seasons with a Tennant, Smith, Rose, or Donna on-screen.

 

[davejames]

Frankly I think Clara has more than enough charm for the both of them this season. And while this Doctor might not be charming in the same way the previous three Doctors were, Capaldi has been so completely mesmerizing and compelling to watch that it's more than made up for it. At least for me.

 

[diankra]

There has been, since the first present day-ish story went out, the unsolveable problem that if you want to set a story in the present day and have ordinary people be surprised by odd/alien events, you either have to ignore past stories, or put in a less-than-convincing explanation for why things haven't been widely remembered.
Bottom line: present day Earth has been invaded many, many times. But present day Earth will always react as if it's never happened before... because the audience live in a world where we haven't been invaded.

 

[Snaploud]

Clara is fine on her own or with Smith. Capaldi has potential, but I haven't seen him click yet with Clara. The writers/producers may need to find Capaldi a new companion who better fits whatever vision they see for this doctor.

I'm still not quite sure what they're doing with the soldier boyfriend. Maybe he'd be better off without his awkward relationship with Clara weighing him down.

 

[YellowSubmarine]

In all fairness, Danny was, unknowingly to him, used as a tool to deliver the writer's wisdoms that weren't very wisdomy. I don't think this says anything about his character.

 

[Professor Zoom]

This one fell flat for me. It's the second one this season where the action was to take no action. The results would've been the same if the Doctor had been there or not. (Using chemicals to defoliate? Sorry, if the trees wouldn't burn, why would I expect chemicals to do the trick).

Yeah, story wise... meh.
Still I'm enjoying Peter in the role. Just wish he had better stories to work on.

 

[Captrek]

It's the second one this season where the action was to take no action.

By my count the third, after Listen and Kill the Moon.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Deep Breath killed a robot.

"Into the Dalek" Cocked it up, and then had to work hard to put everything back to how it was before he interfered.

"Robot of Sherwood" Killed more robots.

"Listen" Rescued Clara's Grandson, Clara pedotouched the Doctor as a child.

"Time Heist" Predestination, followed instructions. No danger.

"The Caretaker" Shut down an almost robot.

"Kill the Moon" Buggered off, Clara left with two options. Do something or nothing.

"Mummy on the Orient Express" He is a chess piece. Killed a cyborg. Saved a trainful of people.

"In the Forest of the Night" Admitted defeat. Ran away. Realized that it was all good and that he was supposed to do nothing.

 

[Cutter John]

Someone on GB theorized that the reason Clara decided that everyone needed to die is because she believed it would motive the Doctor to think up a solution.

I'm willing to go with this as it at least makes some sort of sense.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

Someone on GB theorized that the reason Clara decided that everyone needed to die is because she believed it would motive the Doctor to think up a solution.

I'm willing to go with this as it at least makes some sort of sense.

What... Like payback for Kill the Moon?xD

 

[Guy Gardener]

8 had this lovely speech about how numbers don't matter. He'll try to save every one he can, and he will never consider that sacrificing some to save more is good because that can spin out of control quickly that he is sacrificing millions to save billions (Because that's something that he did do and it did get out of hand, and he's a better man now... Which if you think about it sounds like a slur against how Seven was near the end.).