Your honest opinion on the Berman era
- Thread starter Starflight
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Quadrotriticale?
You think TOS had worse treatment of the mentally ill or criminals that we do now? We saw a couple of deeply troubled asylums, but they were also shown as absolutly unusual, for the very remain remaining mental patients who are not responding to treatment. For people in general, I don't think so. Many hospitals for the mentally ill now are horribly overcrowded and underfunded, only slightly better than them being on the streets.
I wish all the VOYAGE HOME scenes were as great as McCoy's hospital cure.
Which is why I said mental health and crime, not medical. Medical looks pretty good, despite the lack of a cure for the common cold. But, the continued use of the asylum model, and the mind wiping technology and drugs is concerning to me.
Regardless, I do not see utopia.
I'm not a fan of mind wiping, but asylums definitely should still be around, even at that time. Where else are you going to keep the nutjobs who are dangerous to people around them?
Don't they usually get promoted?
I don't mind asylums, to a degree. But, their use needs specific and limited, and the models in TOS feel very 60s.
I changed my vote from "I like two or three of these shows" to "I love the era". Even though I don't love every show, I love the idea of what I think of as good-hearted science-fiction. Somewhere in each of these shows there is a desire to act from a principled stand, to be generous and compassionate with other life forms and cultures, to be curious and want to learn and form new bonds. It doesn't shine all the time but it's in there, along with some joyful humour, and that's what keeps me coming back. For me, Voyager succeeds the most in this and over time I have pretty much fallen in love with Captain Janeaway.
Now that Netflix has lost rights to the franchise I am considering getting a subscription to Paramount and watching some of the younger series. However, when J J Abrams came out with the first Star Trek movie, post purchase, I was extremely disappointed in it. It seemed to me that it had lost that heart, that central core, and had become just another good-versus-evil shoot 'em up bang bang, in which I have no interest at all. I was also very irritated by the change of established personalities of the people involved, especially Spock. (Although I haven't seen it since it came out so I can't remember any more detail than that.) I am curious to know which of the later series you might recommend as still holding that old theme.
How is that a 60s thing? The people that were in aslyums in TOS were actually dangerous to other people. Why would any civilized society want dangerous nutjobs out in the world where they can hurt or kill others?
That there is no plan for discharge. Just put in and never to be released.
Why is there no way to manage mental illness to allow them back in to society in some way rather than just locked up?
Again, they have a use but there's also treatment for improve their stability and utilize community resources to give them support in a normal life.
There needs to be a balance rather than just locked up.
We never see a discharge plan because we aren't sticking around past those episodes, like "DAGGER OF THE MIND" or "WHOM GODS DESTROY", so we don't know for sure if there is none.
And if someone is dangerous enough to be required to be in an asylum, why would we want them released, even when on meds? First, how can you be sure they are taking the meds they are prescribed. Second, meds don't always stay effective. Over time, they can work less and less, and then you're back to the same problem that got the nutjob committed in the first place.
If someone is a danger to other people, they shouldn't be around other people.
I'd say, "Strange New World" is the new show that covers this spirit best. It's also closest to the Berman era, storytelling-wise.
Because of how asylums have been abused in the past I am inherently distrustful. I've still seen safe people left in asylums because there's nowhere else they're accepted.
It feels very of its time and without improvement.
LOWER DECKS does a superb job of having that feel of the era and the spirit of the franchise. There are many scenes where we get dialogue of exactly WHY Starfleet and the Federation is great.
PRODIGY does this, too. While it's geared more for kids and simplifies some of the plots, it definitely reminds us of why the Federation and Starfleet is a good place and something to aspire to.
STRANGE NEW WORLDS is, overall, pretty good. Though the recent third season was a significant downgrade.
PICARD: season 1 had some good ideas, with some good execution, but overall was rather in the middle. The less said about season 2, the better. Season 3, while it had some issues, was FAR superior to season 2 and better than season 1, overall.
DISCOVERY: while this does have the spirit of the franchise in it and had one great character (Saru) with a few other good ones (Stamets, Culber, Rayner), the arc based storylines were not good. All except one had a terrible to meh ending, and most of the arcs themselves meandered a lot. It felt like stretching 3 or 4 episodes worth of material into a 13 episode season. It was a slog to get through, most of the time. I have other big issues with DISCO, but I'll not mention them so it doesn't color your perception should you decide to watch.
My answer, short version: I'd recommend all of them except DISCO. For me, it's 11th place out of the 11 shows, so I can't in good conscience recommend it.
(Having said that, you may actually enjoy it, so you should give it a shot.)
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I more or less agree on everything you said, especially regarding LD and PRO.
Probably it's a matter of taste if you enjoy an animated show as much as life action, as it's a different kind of animal ... but if you do, yes, these shows have a lot of the Star Trek core spirit.
Lower Decks makes Berman era better. Things are not taken for granted.
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