William Shatner Apologizes For Star Trek V

[locutus101]

I'd say it's better than borderline. It's clear that some effort went into it, and the grammatical oddities give it a certain poetic quality, whether or not that was an accident. It's quite appropriate for an old song.

The Klingon in Star Trek: The Motion Picture is perfectly correct by definition, since it is the source that the language was built on. Apart from that, Okrand wrote dialogue and sometimes coached actors for TSFS, TFF, TUC and STID and a few episodes of Enterprise (The Augments, Affliction and Divergence, I believe), so those are all excellent, even if some of it had to be retconned after the fact due to mistakes or editing. Apart from that, there are a handful of epiodes that only use a handful of phrases, which are often correct.

The deleted Klingon scenes in STXI are a bit of a mixed bag, likely due to editing which was never fixed since the scenes ended up being cut. The scene where the Klingons tell Nero and the crippled Narada to surrender is excellent, the prison scene is weird.

The Final Frontier is the gleaming example of well-written and excellently performed tlhIngan Hol dialogue, so it's a real shame it isn't a better movie.
....

Thank you for all that! You must be an expert in Klingon language! I am impressed.

 

[loghaD]

Thank you for all that! You must be an expert in Klingon language! I am impressed.

Thanks; I've been studying Klingon since before I started watching Star Trek, so when I see a thread like this, I can't help going on a bit

 

[locutus101]

Thanks; I've been studying Klingon since before I started watching Star Trek, so when I see a thread like this, I can't help going on a bit

Well, it's nice to talk to people who really know their stuff.

 

[loghaD]

Well, it's nice to talk to people who really know their stuff.

And likewise nice to talk to people who are willing to endure my nitpicking

 

[locutus101]

And likewise nice to talk to people who are willing to endure my nitpicking

Not at all. I like learning about these things.

 

[eyeresist]

I don't think SFX was the problem with Star Trek V. I doubt fighting rock monsters would've improved things, either, it would have just looked lame, particularly since this was 1989 and the technology wasn't good enough anyway.

I agree with this. Neither the things I like, not the things I dislike, about TFF involved the effects. The effects are good enough to tell the story. And I think the climax actually works pretty well.
(at least up until "Not in front of the Klingons", when the movie reverts to the smirking tone that is its real problem.)

 

[2takesfrakes]

It was great that Shatner left Sybok's fate in question. It would've been cool to have him as a guest star in TNG, or even on VOY. A terrific opportunity was wasted, there, probably because the franchise kind of "disowned" TFF. He was so charismatic and entertaining to watch, he was sort of like Harry Mudd, in that respect. I wouldn't have minded seeing Sybok's new tricks and other mischief in the 24th Century ...

 

[eyeresist]

He might have made an interesting ongoing character, but I think Sybok was probably killed by "God".

 

[WHF]

I've been studying Klingon since before I started watching Star Trek

Fascinating, why did you start studying Klingon?

 

[loghaD]

So, earlier today the site Out Of Lives published an article called Good Things about Star Trek V: The Final Frontier. I think I agree with all of the points.

It was great that Shatner left Sybok's fate in question. It would've been cool to have him as a guest star in TNG, or even on VOY. A terrific opportunity was wasted, there, probably because the franchise kind of "disowned" TFF. He was so charismatic and entertaining to watch, he was sort of like Harry Mudd, in that respect. I wouldn't have minded seeing Sybok's new tricks and other mischief in the 24th Century ...

It might be quite interesting if the character is used in the reboot films (or perhaps a tie-in novel or comic), but preferably with a completely different plot. If he's one of the surviving Vulcans (perhaps largely thanks to his exile), the Vulcans might consider bringing him back because their species and culture is so endangered, but at the same time worried about the influence he might exert on the now much smaller population.

Fascinating, why did you start studying Klingon?

A previous interest in invented languages and an interest in MMORPGs (both of which were brought to their peak while role-playing an orc in Ultima Online) got me interested in Star Trek Online, which had been announced to be in development. I knew Star Trek had a conlang associated with it thanks to an old Donald Duck comic that parodizes Star Trek :P

 

[2takesfrakes]

It might be quite interesting if the character is used in the reboot films (or perhaps a tie-in novel or comic), but preferably with a completely different plot. If he's one of the surviving Vulcans (perhaps largely thanks to his exile), the Vulcans might consider bringing him back because their species and culture is so endangered, but at the same time worried about the influence he might exert on the now much smaller population.

I must be Frank & Ernest: Sybok only interests me, because of Lawrence Luckinbill's performance. William Shatner did not pen the script for TFF, himself, but he created the character and on his own ... Sybok doesn't work. He's too problematic. He needs plenty of revision and reimagining. But, for now, I can't see myself taking a liking to Sybok in a reboot story.

 

[eyeresist]

It was great that Shatner left Sybok's fate in question. It would've been cool to have him as a guest star in TNG, or even on VOY. A terrific opportunity was wasted, there, probably because the franchise kind of "disowned" TFF. He was so charismatic and entertaining to watch... I wouldn't have minded seeing Sybok's new tricks and other mischief in the 24th Century

Sybok doesn't work. He's too problematic. He needs plenty of revision and reimagining. But, for now, I can't see myself taking a liking to Sybok in a reboot story.

Aren't you contradicting yourself?

 

[2takesfrakes]

I'm only Human ...

I assure you, eyeresist, I was referring to Laurence Luckinbill's performance as to what made Sybok interesting and worth revisiting in Berman's Star Trek. A reboot Sybok is not going to feature Luckinbill, therefore, the distinction. Larry has gone on record as saying that Leonard Nimoy actually wanted to play both Spock and his brother. So, the performance of Sybok could've been all the more interesting, indeed ... but William Shatner had other, princely plans.

 

[eyeresist]

Okay, I understand now, thanks.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Had the studio put its proverbial foot down and demanded that The Shat abandon his Kirk Meets & Defeats The Almighty concept, has there ever been discussion of what he might've chosen as his subject matter, instead? I'm confident of 2 things, had that happened: 1) It would've remained a valentine to Captain Kirk, 2) It probably would've had a Sybok-type character with which to take Shatner's ire out on Nimoy's success in the director's seat and beating him to it, in the first place.

 

[Haggis and tatties]

I quite enjoy STV, yes it is not the best story or has the best effects, but for charactors seem to enjoy themselves, and it has some nice little charactor moments like the brig scene, and of course Rocket boots. ha

 

[eyeresist]

Had the studio put its proverbial foot down and demanded that The Shat abandon his Kirk Meets & Defeats The Almighty concept, has there ever been discussion of what he might've chosen as his subject matter, instead?

My understanding is that what we saw was the compromise. Originally, Shatner wanted Kirk to meet ACTUAL GOD.

 

[locutus101]

My understanding is that what we saw was the compromise. Originally, Shatner wanted Kirk to meet ACTUAL GOD.

But then we wouldn't have been treated to: "What does God need with a starship?"

Or did he want an "actual god", whatever that is, to ask for a starship?

 

[Warped9]

I don't have a problem with TFF's subject matter. It's the execution thats at issue.

 

[locutus101]

I don't have a problem with TFF's subject matter. It's the execution thats at issue.

I half agree with that.