Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Manual?

[Marco Palmieri]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Garrovick:
Time for Paramount to look at allowing some other private individual or group to try their hand at a project. In today's world, books can be printed and distributed one at a time from someone's home.

Please explain. And don't forget to factor in licensing fees, royalties, and distribution costs into your explanation.

 

[TerriO]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Marco Palmieri:

Posted by Garrovick:
Time for Paramount to look at allowing some other private individual or group to try their hand at a project. In today's world, books can be printed and distributed one at a time from someone's home.

Please explain. And don't forget to factor in licensing fees, royalties, and distribution costs into your explanation.

Considering it would almost have to either be POD (which I'd never touch, m'self), or an e-book format.

Think a printable e-book sounds good? How about answering the grouchy readers that have printed the book out for themselves and complain that the print quality of the book isn't as good as the ones Pocket published (but neglect to remember that they don't have a roughly $750 high-end color laser printer to make the spiffy-keen printouts, let alone the print quality of books like Star Charts).

Then there's the average cost to the potential reader of inkjet cartridges and high-quality paper so they can print a passable copy of the book at home, etc.

And the cost of that truly crappy spiral binding at Kinko's.

So, instead of paying, say, $35.00 for a new book with high-quality paper and high-resolution pictures, you're paying, maybe $20.00 for a new electronic copy of the book. You've brought the cost down, right? What about when they end up having to fork over another $60.00 (at least, that's what they cost for my inkjet) in ink cartridges, and another $7.50 or so for a ream of that high-quality paper to print it out on.

And let's not forget all the die-hard "Dead Tree Society" members, who won't buy the electronic copy no way, no sir. What are they supposed to do?

And that's just scratching the surface of the issues.

 

[Garrovick]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Marco Palmieri:


Please explain. And don't forget to factor in licensing fees, royalties, and distribution costs into your explanation.

That's looking at the issue as a "Corporation", not as a "hobbyist", which as you know, have been not totally unheard of over the years. Even if they are forced to hide from Viacom's legal system and bankers.

If "Pocket Books"” is not willing to take risks with it’s profit margin, which I can accept and understand, then it’s time for Paramount to let some one else take that risk.

Not every Star Trek technology fan needs a glossy, fluffy, and corporate designed book that can only be found on the shelves at their local book retailer.

 

[Marco Palmieri]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Garrovick:
That's looking at the issue as a "Corporation", not as a "hobbyist", which as you know, have been not totally unheard of over the years. Even if they are forced to hide from Viacom's legal system and bankers.

If "Pocket Books"” is not willing to take risks with it’s profit margin, which I can accept and understand, then it’s time for Paramount to let some one else take that risk.

Not every Star Trek technology fan needs a glossy, fluffy, and corporate designed book that can only be found on the shelves at their local book retailer.

So you're not actually talking about Paramount "allowing some other private individual or group to try their hand at a project," as you put it. You're talking about Paramount relinquishing any rights it has, as the owner of Star Trek, to be compenstated for technical publications based on their property.

As for Pocket's willingness to take risks, your estimation of it is uninformed.

 

[jadcox@mindspring.com]

Posted by RogueEnterprise:
I'd purchase the hell out of it, especially if it was as awesomely complex and steeped in technobable as the TNG tech manual. MAN I love that thing!

Me, too. Frankly, I'd love to see a new version updated to include the Enterprise-E.

John

 

[ecky]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Marco Palmieri:
The answer is the same as it was every other time you've asked this question: Yes, we'd love to. But we haven't yet found a way to do a proper one affordably, given the current size of the audience for such material.

how about a limited ebook run?

say a 3-part enterprise tech manual? many of those wishing such a manual do tend to be of the online variety, and it might be a potentially successful fishing trip?

it'd cost yes, but if its in an exclusively ebook format you're saving on the printing costs on things like the glossy A3 foldouts which might offset the extra costs of hiring illustrators.

if not feasible now, it might be a cost-effetive way of testing the waters in the future...

 

[KRAD]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

^ It isn't remotely feasible because if you think the sales of a print book are low, that's as nothing compared to how low the eBook sales will be.

Stephen King's eBooks only sold in four figures. And he's the most popular author on the planet.

eBook sales are a dinky fraction of print book sales. The amount saved on printing is a drop in the bucket compared to the huge loss in raw numbers of units sold by going eBook-only.

 

[Trent Roman]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by golakers:

Posted by Dayton3:

Be serious. There are ways to appeal to a broader audience.

Please explain. I'm sure the professionals at Pocket Books would be very interested in your "ways".

Dayton3 works in mysterious ways.

Fictitiously yours, Trent Roman

 

[Alpinemaps]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by SlaveOfSeven:

Posted by Dayton3:
You would thing they would try to break into that wing of the Trek Franchise every decade or so.

You mean in a similar way to you posting this question every few months?

From May 13

Maybe we should sticky this thread? I would have thought that if anything changed in the last two months, with relation to this question, it would have been announced.

I'd love to see your ideas Dayton3. You seem pretty confident that you have the fomula that works. Please share, so we can get some more of those tech manuals out there for all of us to enjoy.

 

[mythme]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Couldn't Pocket try a little "mini tech manuel" at the end of each paperback it releases? Kinda like the way they did a chapter of "Starfleet: Year One" a few years ago.

For me, I don't really care if they're large sized books, I'm only interested in the information. Would it still unprofitable to make such books even if they were standard Trade Paperback size?

 

[Sxottlan]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Gaah! Gaah!

Not this again.

 

[MichaelS]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Are you thinking of something like the pages about the Gorkon that were included at the back of The Brave and the Bold, Book Two? I know it probably wouldn't work, but I'd love to see more of those data compilations, detailing the most important new ship in the novel in question.

 

[GodThingFormerly]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

If I may recycle an argument I made here in late 2002, Kluwer routinely charges several hundred dollars per volume for scientific/engineering monographs because - as was explained to an indignant customer (me) a decade ago by the managing editor - when you can only sell at most 500 copies of a specialist title, there is only one way to make a profit on it. If the Modern Trek Tech Manual has indeed evolved into a niche product due to circumstances beyond Pocket's control, then it may be time to consider going into the high-end boutique publishing path for this particular subgenre.

TGT

 

[Marco Palmieri]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

^I've investigated this possibility. For a variety of reasons having to do with the costs uniquely associated with licensed fiction, it won't work. In addition, while such an approach might indeed satisfy a few ST tech fans passionate enough (and financially able) to spend that much on a ST technical publication, far more will cry foul at being shut out.


We continue to keep our options open. We continue to investigate ways to publish books of this type affordably. Thus far, we haven't found one, but we haven't given up. And while I understand that that these answers are cold comfort to some, I have no others to give.

As a fan, I would love to be able to publish a new tech manual every year, or even every five years. But I also deal on a daily basis with the realities surrounding such projects, and if some among you really don't believe what I say on this subject, why even seek answers?

 

[Racer_X]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Marco Palmieri:
...and if some among you really don't believe what I say on this subject, why even seek answers?

Just to get a long-time frustration off my chest, years ago on the old SimonSays board, I remember people asking Margaret Clark if one of the new hardcover behind-the-scenes books (Star Trek: Where No One Has Gone Before: A History in Pictures) was ever going to come out in paperback, and she said no. But lo and behold, a year or so later, the book was published in paperback. And to add insult to injury, the paperback had new material added to it! And then it happened again with another behind-the-scenes book (STTNG: The Continuing Mission: A Tenth Anniversary Tribute), coming out first in hardcover, then being followed-up in paperback with new material added to it (And didn’t this also happen with one of the hardcover versions of the Star Trek Encyclopedia? No paperback version was planned, but eventually came out after everyone purchased the hardcover?).

Now I’m willing to bet that the stock reply to these instances would be “well, we realized after the hardcover was released that we *could* release the book as softcover, but to entice readers to purchase it, we had to add some new material” or some other similar excuse. But as a loyal customer who purchased these hardcover books immediately when they came out, and relying on good faith that they would not come out in paperback (At least not so soon after the original release), these actions by Pocketbooks were, well, to be blunt, pretty damn crappy.

Since then I’ve learned my lesson, and while it’s interesting to read posts from Pocket Book representatives, at the end of the day, I just don’t trust you guys. So, yes, I do not believe what you say on this or any other subject; it’s as simple as that.

 

[BigFoot]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

^ Man, someone has their panties up their bunch.

 

[Stevil2001]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Racer_X:
So, yes, I do not believe what you say on this or any other subject; it’s as simple as that.

I am reasonably certain that at some point in his life, Marco Palmieri has stated the Earth is round; are you telling me he was lying and it's actually flat?

What conceivable advantage would Pocket gain from not publishing tech manuals if they really are profitable, anyway? What would they get out of lying to you about it?

Maybe to make everyone happy, Marco really should lie and say there's a book coming out in a few years.

 

[Warped9]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

I can understand to some extent Pocket not being interested in publishing any more of these books if past sales of such works have been lacklustre. OTH the past recent examples of these books have been exorbitantly prced in my view to the point that that may partly account for lacklustre sales. I was interested in picking up the DS9 Technical Manual, but I balked at the extortion stickered on the book. I kept waiting for it to offered on sale or as a remainder sometime. Eventually I gave up and no longer have any interest.

I also have to wonder (just to play devil's advocate) how much impact the internet may have had on these books. A lot of information and images can be freely had over the net to the point that such books could be considered redundant and only hardcore fans would still be willing to buy the hardcopy compilations.

 

[Marco Palmieri]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Racer_X:
I remember people asking Margaret Clark if one of the new hardcover behind-the-scenes books (Star Trek: Where No One Has Gone Before: A History in Pictures) was ever going to come out in paperback, and she said no. But lo and behold, a year or so later, the book was published in paperback. And to add insult to injury, the paperback had new material added to it! And then it happened again with another behind-the-scenes book (STTNG: The Continuing Mission: A Tenth Anniversary Tribute), coming out first in hardcover, then being followed-up in paperback with new material added to it (And didn’t this also happen with one of the hardcover versions of the Star Trek Encyclopedia? No paperback version was planned, but eventually came out after everyone purchased the hardcover?).

Now I’m willing to bet that the stock reply to these instances would be “well, we realized after the hardcover was released that we *could* release the book as softcover, but to entice readers to purchase it, we had to add some new material” or some other similar excuse. But as a loyal customer who purchased these hardcover books immediately when they came out, and relying on good faith that they would not come out in paperback (At least not so soon after the original release), these actions by Pocketbooks were, well, to be blunt, pretty damn crappy.

The problem with the examples you're citing is that at the time those questions were asked, the answers given were the honest ones. Within the ST editorial department, there was no expectation that those books would ever be reissued in a softcover format, because of prevailing company policy at that time. Circumstances changed, and decisions were made at an administrative level that made those earlier statements by the editors wrong. Those of us who answer questions about the books have since become very careful about speaking in absolutes. Anyone who reads this forum and others we participate in will attest to that. We don't set out to mislead people.

I'm sorry you felt burned by that experience, but changing circumstances that contradict an earlier statement don't mean that the statement in question was dishonest.

Since then I’ve learned my lesson, and while it’s interesting to read posts from Pocket Book representatives, at the end of the day, I just don’t trust you guys. So, yes, I do not believe what you say on this or any other subject; it’s as simple as that.

Then I ask again, why would anyone who feels as you do come here seeking answers?

 

[golakers]

Re: Will Pocket EVER Attempt Another Technical Man

Posted by Dayton3:

Posted by William Leisner:

Posted by Dayton3:
I assume you have considered INCREASING the audience?

Unfortunately, the plan to force bookstore patrons at gunpoint to purchase the tech manuals proved to be non-cost-effective, and not especially good for Pocket's image.

Be serious. There are ways to appeal to a broader audience.

Im still waiting for Dayton3 to back up his claim.