Why were they always in their Uniforms?

[jackoverfull]

Someone must have forgotten to mention that to Carey.

Carey sure had hostility towards her, but once a decision was reached he accepted it and never questioned her rank after early season 1.

Did you miss the argument between Janeway and Chakotay over who would take over as Chief Engineer? Janeway was prejudiced against B'Elanna due to her Maquis affiliation, her temper, and her unwillingness to look past any of that to understand just how good an engineer B'Elanna actually was.

i referred to that argument several times in this very topic...

Oh, FFS. She was "in command" maybe twice in four seasons. The one time was in the episode about the Omega molecule, a highly top-secret thing that only Captains and above are allowed to know about, but which Seven knew due to the Borg having assimilated a number of captains and above.

Seven was put in charge of situations where her knowledge was greater than B'Elanna's or Carey's or Vorik's, and when it was that important that there really wasn't time to go through a chain of command thing where the Starfleet officers would decide whether to take the word of a civilian who knew what the hell she was talking about over an officer who didn't have a clue.

If they'd gone the latter route, they would never have survived to reach the Alpha Quadrant

Probably quite a few times more than twice. Still, the chain in command is pretty clear: after B’Elanna the second should be Carey, after him someone else, definitely not a civilian.

We were talking about civilians. Neelix was a civilian who tried to make himself useful in a number of ways, including studying to become a security officer.

Without stepping on other officers’ shoes.
And nothing wrong about him trying to become security: he didn’t act as second in command of security with no rank anytime Tuvok wasn’t available.

Similarly, I don’t see a problem with seven running astrometics, a lab she herself built, and helping out on the bridge as a civilian mission expert.

Janeway's irregular appointments were provisional and could have been countermanded at any time once they regained contact with Starfleet.

But they weren’t.

Tom was drafted as a medic-in-training, and don't tell me he never took shifts in Sickbay when the Doctor wasn't there.

my point was that he did...and that was absurd.

Tom was never a nurse.

he filled that role in several late seasons episodes.

Did you even watch the early episodes?

Several times, the last of which around 2012. Next times will be around 2023, probably.

People cross-trained in a variety of ways. They would have to, since there was no way to take on new Starfleet crew. The more skills people learned, the better the odds of survival.

Absolutely. Yet, 7 years in, the only medical personnel available are the Holodoctor and the head of navigation...How does that makes sense?!

There was an episode in which Tom was teaching Kes to fly a shuttle. Why aren't you citing that as "ludicrous"?

Because it makes sense. As does her training in medicine. My point was that it was ludicrous to relying only on paris’s lone year of medical training: janeway should have transferred 4 people to infirmary immediately and have them train to be able to replace the at the moment unproven doctor as soon as possible

 

[Farscape One]

Torres got her rank at the end of "PARALLAX", the first episode after the pilot. The very beginning of that episode, Carey is being treated for the broken nose. She didn't get a rank at that point when she broke his nose.

Tom was ordered by Janeway to be the new nurse in the same episode, in the first briefing scene. We see him in that role only in "PHAGE", until season 4's "REVULSION" when the Doctor tells him he'll be the new nurse again since Kes is gone. He does this multiple times throughout the rest of the series.

Neelix was actually appointed Ambassador by Janeway in "MACROCOSM" at the beginning because he had a knack with the Tak Tak, something she failed completely at. She said he had a genuine flair for diplomacy. We see him in this role several times during the rest of the series.

 

[Tracy Trek]

The discussion about Seven working in engineering made me think of how in the episode Lineage, when Janeway comes to congratulate Torres about her pregnancy, she says something like Seven could fill in. Why would that even be a thing? Carey WAS the second in command in engineering and he was still alive at this point. Besides Carey, you also had Vorik, Nicoletti, and many others.

 

[Mark_Nguyen]

That could be implying that Seven could be on a team of people filling in overall. Carey had all but disappeared from the show at this point, and I do wonder if there was something behind this (beyond the producers just not wanting an actor of his pay grade to say "aye captain" in the background over the years), like his accepting a different role in the Engineering staff that doesn't require him to be IN Engineering all the time. Head of something-something maintenance on Deck 14 for five years, or whatever, until he happened to rotate up to the big room in time to get unceremoniously removed from the show right before the series finale. In any case, in any given later episode of Voyager, when they needed someone else for Torres to talk to about Engineering stuff and Vorik wasn't around, Seven was generally there, and she often filled in as a leader for projects that would be an engineer's purview. Seven tended to be indispensible to ship's operations in many yellow and blue-shouldered roles though, so unless they wanted to make a TNG S1 Wesley Crusher sweater for her I think her noncommittal outfits were reasonable.

I've been re-watching Voyager with my now-eleven year-old daughter (it's easily the most accessible of all the Treks, IMO) and have noted that in S2 they started loosening up a bit with regards to civvy duds when off duty. Tom was in a housecoat for "Threshold" (really?) and Janeway had nightwear going more than once. Then when they swapped Sandrine's for the Talaxian resort, more crew showed up there in swimwear on their off hours, though episodes just as often showed crew relaxing there in their uniforms.

Mark

 

[jackoverfull]

unless they wanted to make a TNG S1 Wesley Crusher sweater for her I think her noncommittal outfits were reasonable.

her outfit was easily the only reason the writers never had janeway just hand her a rank and a uniform.

Ironically, a few years later they gave a rank to t’pol but never bothered with the uniform!

 

[Discofan]

Their uniforms double as pajamas?

Yeah, Data was mistaken for a bellhop in that awful time-traveling two-parter with the worst Mark Twain impression ever!

 

[Discofan]

her outfit was easily the only reason the writers never had janeway just hand her a rank and a uniform.

Ironically, a few years later they gave a rank to t’pol but never bothered with the uniform!

Seven had no rank and ... a catsuit...

 

[jackoverfull]

Seven had no rank and ... a catsuit...

And Patrick Stewart didn't know!

 

[WarpTenLizard]

Their uniforms double as pajamas?

Perhaps because of replicator resource scarcity, the Captain ordered them to sleep nude, nightwear being a luxury reserved for the Captain only ?

Actually, I think it's canon that Starfleet uniforms are "designed for maximum comfort" (I forget which character said that and when). It's entirely possibly that, given Voyager's energy shortage, and having to ration replicator, uh, rations, why not just stay your uniform, until it needs cleaning, or your activity specifically calls for some other kind of clothing?

Now, as for TNG, DS9, etc, I have no answer for those. But "Voyager" has an actual in-universe reason for its cheap costuming.

 

[Lynx]

One of my biggest gripes about Voyager (among many) was the fact that they were always no matter what they were doing in their uniforms. When they were called to the Bridge at 2 am or whatever all of them show up hair in place and in their uniforms or in the heat of a battle or when the ship is getting it's ass handed to it (Year of Hell) all of them are still in their uniforms except for Janeway. Even if it wasn't a battle and they were just going about their daily routines. They should at least only have their undershirts or shirt less (males only it's not that kind of show keep it PG). I mean what is Janeway going to do fire them?

Sometimes some character would show up in some holodeck-costume in an emergency situation while having to leave the holodeck in a hurry.

As for no civilian clothes, they were basically on duty all the time during their long voyage home, maybe that's the reason why they always did wear uniforms.

 

[Ragitsu]

 

[jackoverfull]

Actually, I think it's canon that Starfleet uniforms are "designed for maximum comfort" (I forget which character said that and when

Worf in Let He Who is Without Sin

 

[Kor]

Judging by some of the 24th-century off-duty civvies we were subjected to in TNG, perhaps it's better for everyone that we almost always saw the VOY crew in uniform.

Kor

 

[jackoverfull]

Judging by some of the 24th-century off-duty civvies we were subjected to in TNG, perhaps it's better for everyone that we almost always saw the VOY crew in uniform.

Kor

agreed! The idea of future garbs they had in the 80s was kinda goofy.

 

[Timo]

All garb is goofy.

And all clothing is difficult to don in a hurry, save for those nightgowns we see. Quite possibly, slipping into a Trek 24th century uniform is the fastest and most comfortable way imaginable for transitioning from "bed" to "corridor". And even if replication troubles were the original reason for people being forced to this, it's a pattern they might well stick to after two years of saturation.

The heroes never admit to a downside in wearing the uniform. I don't see an issue in them preferring to do so, then. If anything, all the more power to them if they feel free and relaxed without changing to a Hawaii shirt and Bermudas. (And many of them have learned to do that changing on or for a holodeck session anyway: doing it in other contexts would detract from that piece of indulgence!)

Timo Saloniemi