Yeah, I don't see 100% transparency being a thing. No matter how good it sounds on paper.
Why was the Mirror Universe classified?
- Thread starter F. King Daniel
- Start date
Yeah, Starfleet never struck me as a transparent organization.
The Federation is full of scientists doing things purely for the sake of it being science. I can see them wanting to keep the existence of the MU classified to prevent someone from punching a hole in the universe to go there or some other universe since travel there is a known possibility. They could find a universe worse than the MU and unleash something awful on the galaxy.
The ramifications of meddling with the multiverse are pretty significant. There's also a corollary of the question that puzzles advocates of the possibility of time travel (if we ever figure it out, where are the tourists from the future?), in that, if its possible, it follows that there are universes where it is being done. So there should be loads of cross universe travel going on. To a certain extent, we have to reverse the polarity of our disbelief compensators for parallel universe stories to work.
I took it as sort of trying to put the genie back in the bottle. Starfleet didn't want the knowledge of the existence of parallel universes getting into adversaries hands, or any batsh*t scientist who wanted to exploit this somehow. And they didn't want the public to think "hey, my loved one might be alive in one of these universes", a thought I have personally had now that we're really talking about this in today's Science.
It was classified on THEIR side too, probably for the same reasons. The CnC of Starfleet probably has a big black data tape in a wallsafe labeled "Twenty fucked up things that scare the hell out of us but we can do nothing about (Classified Top Secret)". This list probably includes the Borg, the planet killer, the Temporal Cold War, the Sphere Builders, the Husnok, the The DTI, the Dominion, and probably some ultra-long-range telescope images of V'ger on its inexorable course for Earth.
PR: At the core of the Federation is a belief that humans are racially/culturally neutral leaders with no agenda other than to explore and coexist. This is in spite of human history telling a tale of tribalism and militancy broken only by Vulcan contact with a near-dead species. The idea that humanity could be at the apex of technological advancement but with all the same tribalism and militancy pointed towards Federation member species (and that such a nation-state could rule the quadrant) is among the worst fears of every member species.
It was stated by Sarek:
"Our people have suffered terrible losses. What would you do if your dead wife, your lost child, your murdered parents might be alive on the other side and that a technology exists for you to see them again? This knowledge must be buried."
"Our people have suffered terrible losses. What would you do if your dead wife, your lost child, your murdered parents might be alive on the other side and that a technology exists for you to see them again? This knowledge must be buried."
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I think this is the first really persuasive rationale I've heard!
It's also basically the mirror image (ahem) of the reason the Mirror Universe keeps it secret, which is that they don't want people to think too much about a reality where humanity doesn't dominate everyone else.
Thematically, it would actually be kinda nice to see the Federation live up to its ideals (as more than just PR) and do the opposite of what the Mirror Universe does, i.e., be open about it. That's apparently what eventually happens. For the moment, unfortunately, the writers painted themselves into a corner with continuity.
(Which, as an aside, is one more reason I'm surprised they left Mirror Georgiou alive. The longer she's around and interacting with people, the less of a secret the MU becomes. Or if it does remain secret and people think she's the original, the worse Starfleet's reputation becomes thanks to her...)
I wonder if it would benefit Georgiou to let people know her identity?
"I'm the Empress of the Mirror Universe! You will bow before me!" Um, I'm not quaking in fear. I'm booking you on the next ship to Tantalus Colony.
Not only was it classified for the purposes of what Sarek and Lorca said, about trying to go and bring back lost loved ones, but I thought that major reason it was classified was pretty evident. The way Disco GOT to the Mirror Universe itself: The Spore Drive. It makes sense that the Mirror Universe would be declassified in later centuries when it was discovered you could reach the MU using conventional transporters and ion storms (technically, this is also known in Discovery as to how Mirror Lorca got to the Prime Universe, but I suspect only a couple of people are privy to that info). But it would create an awkward press conference if Starfleet brass had disclosed the existence of the MU but not the means to get there.
No, it's human nature.
Just as an aside, it occurred to me last night that not only did Lorca attempt to bring a PU person to the MU as a replacement for the MU person he'd lost, but Burnham does the same thing when she brings the Emporer back to the PU. Burnham's actions were based purely on emotion because she knew that, logically, Emporer Georgiou was not her Georgiou. As logical a being as Burnham was, being human, she still allowed her emotions to override that logic.
We see an emotional response to a duplicate on display again in the MU when the Emperer realizes Burnham is from the PU but can't bring herself to kill her when she has the opportunity, which is something that would otherwise have been quite logical in the MU. In the season finale, Georgiou again has a chance to kill Burnham and again cannot bring herself to do it.
All 3 of the aforementioned knew that the duplicates weren't the real thing but still could not prevent human emotion from overruling logic. Although the myriad of unknown factors alone would justify keeping knowledge of the MU classified, when you throw in the evidence of people making irrational decisions about MU duplicates, Starfleet's decision makes perfect sense.
I think the writers covered themselves quite nicely with respect to presenting a logical reason for Kirk and company not knowing about the MU.
This was silly, and begs the question of why the Mirror Universe was not classified a few years from now when Kirk and friends cross over....?
Kirk's mirror adventures were made public. Even Bashir knew about it, and he was someone who said he didn't know much about Kirk's era.
Yes, she did. But that's not an example of actual human nature; it's just another character being (badly) written by the same writers. That was a stupid and implausible element of the plot, and it annoyed me quite a bit when I saw it.
Yet another unconvincing plot development. Sensing a pattern here? The characters don't act out of anything resembling recognizable human motivations, they just do whatever's necessary for the writers to get the story wherever they're trying to force it.
Something I've seen throughout science fiction...lot of stupid and implausible plot elements used by a lot of writers.
Those saying "MU versions aren't the same as PU versions" are ignoring one very salient point - if the MU exists along the spectrum of parallel universes, then LESS divergent realities exist. We saw some in TNG's "Parallels" and an even less-diverged scenario in VOY's "Deadlock". If people realise you can access the MU, then they realise you can access a reality where the only difference is your loved one didn't get on the business end of a phaser rifle or angry tardigrade. And then it's a goddamn free-for-all.
I see your point, but I still can't agree. First of all, getting to the MU is obviously very hard — the only known means so far are (A) an interphase that drives you insane and moves you through time, (B) a transporter accident during an ion storm, and (C) extremely risky, experimental tech that requires a highly modified starship. There's no reason to expect getting to some other alternate universe to be any easier, and it might well be even harder. This isn't the sort of thing some grief-driven backyard scientist is going to pull off on his own.
Second, even if you could get there, take a minute to consider the implications of the scenario you posit. Your loved one's counterpart is going to be in one of three basic situations: (A) he or she knows and loves your counterpart over there, so that position is already taken, and you're superfluous; (B) he or she knew and loved your counterpart, but that person is dead, so your existence is going to come as quite a shock, possibly an unwelcome one; or (C) he or she never knew your counterpart (or at least had a different relationship with that person, either neutral or negative), so there's nothing for you to build on. Any way you slice it, it's not as if you can just seamlessly restore the life you had, because you're still talking about a completely different person.
I'm not saying there aren't interesting stories that can be told about this kind of dynamic. Indeed, the new show Counterpart is doing a great job of telling exactly those kinds of stories. I'm just saying the treatment of the situation in DSC seems superficial, driven by plot convenience rather than actual logic.
I'm glad you think it's "silly," but that's irrelevant. And how do you know it wasn't? On-screen, it was never visited past TOS until DS9, and by then, it could have been de-classified later on for any number of reasons.
Personally, I think that reason makes perfect sense.
Join us or die... and if you join us you might just die anyway.
Enterprise, especially in the first couple of seasons, often dealt with the heavy-handedness of Vulcan influence over Starfleet operations. They Vulcans were assuming the role of the elder mentor, easing humans into the larger galactic community. IIRC, by the end of the series, some high ranking Vulcan concedes that humans "are ready," or at least, more ready than they were since the events of Broken Bow.
Do the other Federation members really regard Earth as that nation-state that rules the quadrant? It's out of the same playbook as the Klingons, the Borg, all the major enemies etc: Capitulate and you will have peace. This is a theme also explored in Star Trek VI.
"The Federation is nothing more than a homo sapiens only club."
"Present company excepted, of course."
(Azetbur and Chang – The Undiscovered Country)
"Present company excepted, of course."
(Azetbur and Chang – The Undiscovered Country)
Maybe that's been the Mirror Universe angle all along: preaching and practicing tribal militancy instead of dressing it up as a galactic democracy, Weekend At Bernie's style as it could be interpreted in the Prime Universe of Trek.
Bear in mind that's a super cynical take on things...
happy Monday!The writers may have to keep her alive throughout the entire series if the core of the overall Discovery story is all about Mike Burns dealing with her mistake(s). Her first mistake was to mutiny in The Vulcan Hello but she made an even bigger mistake bringing the MU Emperor back with them. Story wise, I think there's lots to unpack and explore there.
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