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Why was the Mirror Universe classified?

F. King Daniel

Fleet Admiral
Admiral
The many-worlds theory exists today, which makes Sarek's comment regarding dead loved ones weak at best. Data had no issue with explaining it in "Parallels". Kelvin Spock spelled it out in ST'09. Why would 2256 DiscoStarfleet decide the knowledge of another universe has to be kept under lock and key (except to awkwardly keep continuity with TOS, of course)?
 
Because they don't want any Federation scientists opening a portal to the MU that might allow an evil galactic empire to infiltrate or invade our universe?

Because they don't want the Klingons or other hostile powers to travel to the MU to gain advanced weapons and other technology?

Because if they declassify the MU trip they might have to explain the details, like the fact that they brought back the Terran Emperor and almost used her to commit genocide against the Klingons.
 
Because they don't want any Federation scientists opening a portal to the MU that might allow an evil galactic empire to infiltrate or invade our universe?
Since they know about us, and were working on the technology to infiltrate our universe, wouldn't it make more sense to be prepared for the next attempt?
Because they don't want the Klingons or other hostile powers to travel to the MU to gain advanced weapons and other technology?
Fair enough, although Klingons and most other powers had been wiped out.
Because if they declassify the MU trip they might have to explain the details, like the fact that they brought back the Terran Emperor and almost used her to commit genocide against the Klingons.
Everyone knows about the Borg, but I doubt the Queen's personal infatuation with Picard is public. Genesis was a galactic controversy but I doubt everyone knew Khan was involved.

But that opens up the Pandora's Box of just what the public does and does not know about our heroes' adventures.

The events of "Mirror, Mirror" are taught at Starfleet Academy in DS9's time. Starfleet has even more numerous and powerful enemies by then, so why was it ever revealed?
 
Since they know about us, and were working on the technology to infiltrate our universe, wouldn't it make more sense to be prepared for the next attempt?
I'm sure Starfleet and Federation defense contractors will be preparing for it with classified projects.
Fair enough, although Klingons and most other powers had been wiped out.
Why would the Klingons have to get weapons and tech only from other Klingons?
They could make deal with the Terran Empire in exchange for data about the Federation, or purchase from the Orions or other powers.
Everyone knows about the Borg, but I doubt the Queen's personal infatuation with Picard is public. Genesis was a galactic controversy but I doubt everyone knew Khan was involved.
You just gave two examples of things that were classified for a long time. Genesis was highly classified (remember the bar scene with McCoy?). The Hansens were sent on a classified expedition (that not even the captain of the Federation flagship was aware of years later) to track the Borg prior to the Enterprise encountering them in Q-Who?, which Starfleet already clearly knew a great deal about, likely from the NX-01 encounter and the El-Aurian refugees in 2293 (in fact the classified Starfleet Borg database shown in Voyager had a stardate on it corresponding to the same stardate Sulu gave at the start of ST:VI in 2293, which could be when the El-Aurian's distress call from the Borg attack on their homeworld was first received by Starfleet).
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The events of "Mirror, Mirror" are taught at Starfleet Academy in DS9's time. Starfleet has even more numerous and powerful enemies by then, so why was it ever revealed?
Well, because it was a century later, and just because Starfleet officers are discussing it doesn't mean it was declassified to the public at large.
 
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Isn't this addressed specifically in the episode? Lorca says to Burnham, something to the effect of - think of it... if you knew there was another universe out there with a duplicate of a loved one who had died, who wouldn't want to go in and try to find them?

Evidently Starfleet Intelligence thought it was a legit concern, people would be building cross dimensional transporters to drag evil versions of their friends and family out of the grave en masse.
 
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Isn't this addressed specifically in the episode? Lorca says to Burnham, something to the effect of - think of it... if you knew there was another universe out there with a duplicate of a loved one who had died, who wouldn't want to go in and try to find them?

Evidently Starfleet Intelligence thought it was a legit concern, people would be building cross dimensional transporters to drag evil versions of their friends and family out of the grave en masse.
Yeah, but that's frankly a dumb rationalization. All you've got over there is someone who looks like your loved one, but has completely different life experiences. Even if they're not EEEvil, it would still be as pointless as, say, becoming obsessed with your lost loved one's identical twin. (Which is not something people do in real life, even though twins are a lot more common and accessible than routes to a parallel universe, because people understand the distinction.)

There really is no good in-story rationale for keeping it classified in the 2250s any more than later on, when it was clearly not kept classified... especially considering the knowledge that one of the ways to get there is through a simple transporter accident, a risk it would presumably behoove starship commanders to be aware of. If the writers had thought about this, they would have realized the MU story was simply a bad idea, or at least invested enough time and effort in it to come up with a more plausible reason for it remaining unknown.
 
Starfleet probably didn't want word getting out that they turned command of their most important asset in the war against the Klingons over to the evil twin of one of their captains, despite numerous red flags that something was wrong with him. So it becomes easier to classify the whole thing and not reveal the existence of an alternate universe where evil doppelgangers can replace people from our universe to the general public. Kirk's trip to the MU didn't embarrass Starfleet or its screening process for command personnel, so it can be released to the public.
 
The many-worlds theory exists today, which makes Sarek's comment regarding dead loved ones weak at best. Data had no issue with explaining it in "Parallels". Kelvin Spock spelled it out in ST'09. Why would 2256 DiscoStarfleet decide the knowledge of another universe has to be kept under lock and key (except to awkwardly keep continuity with TOS, of course)?
There's a massive difference between the theoretical, or even mathematically demonstrable existence of parallel worlds and the information that they are real tangible places and you can actually travel between them by at least two means at Starfleet's disposal. That information is a huge deal, imagine what it would do today. There are potentially multiverse spanning consequences. I thought the episode spelled out the reasons very clearly and logically. It actually makes one wonder why, in universe, they allowed it to be public knowledge later on (except to awkwardly keep continuity with DS9 where Sisko has to know without access to a computer about the previous crossover).
 
I'm sure Starfleet and Federation defense contractors will be preparing for it with classified projects.
Not that we ever saw in the following century.
Why would the Klingons have to get weapons and tech only from other Klingons?
They could make deal with the Terran Empire in exchange for data about the Federation, or purchase from the Orions or other powers.
Looks like in the Mirrorverse, it's Terran Empire or a ragtag band of dissident survivors of conquered worlds. And since the Terrans are intensely xenophobic, I don't see them sharing advanced technology with aliens.
You just gave two examples of things that were classified for a long time. Genesis was highly classified (remember the bar scene with McCoy?). The Hansens were sent on a classified expedition (that not even the captain of the Federation flagship was aware of years later) to track the Borg prior to the Enterprise encountering them in Q-Who?, which Starfleet already clearly knew a great deal about, likely from the NX-01 encounter and the El-Aurian refugees in 2293 (in fact the classified Starfleet Borg database shown in Voyager had a stardate on it corresponding to the same stardate Sulu gave at the start of ST:VI in 2293, which could be when the El-Aurian's distress call from the Borg attack on their homeworld was first received by Starfleet).
ETI33Gm.jpg
The details of Genesis were classified, but the public at large were aware of some of what happened. Hence "Genesis has become a galactic controversy". Everyone knew the Federation had developed a "doomsday weapon" which could create planets.

As for the Borg, there have been so many retcons it's hard to make sense of their first meeting with the Federation ("Q Who", "Dark Frontier" and "Regeneration" were all Borg first contact episodes!)
Well, because it was a century later, and just because Starfleet officers are discussing it doesn't mean it was declassified to the public at large.
I doubt they'd tech anything classified at Starfleet Academy. O'Brein was surprised Bajoran military officer Kira didn't know of the incident.
There's a massive difference between the theoretical, or even mathematically demonstrable existence of parallel worlds and the information that they are Debussy real tangible places and you can actually travel between them by at least two means at Starfleet's disposal. That information is a huge deal, imagine what it would do today. There are potentially multiverse spanning consequences. I thought the episode spelled out the reasons very clearly and logically. It actually makes one wonder why, in universe, they allowed it to be public knowledge later on (except to awkwardly keep continuity with DS9 where Sisko has to know without access to a computer about the previous crossover).
It took the Mirror Universe people 100 or 200 years (depending on if you count "In a Mirror, Darkly" or "Mirror, Mirror" as when they'd have started) to develop a transporter mod to intentionally beam between worlds. The Spore Drive is out of the public's reach. I'm not sure anyone could have crossed over even if it was known to the galaxy at large.
 
There are good reasons you’re just ignoring them.
Okay, what are they?

Starfleet probably didn't want word getting out that they turned command of their most important asset in the war against the Klingons over to the evil twin of one of their captains, despite numerous red flags that something was wrong with him...
Yeah, that part I can see keeping on the DL. But even so it would be simpler merely to record that Lorca was killed in the MU (or just went MIA, if they want to hedge their bets, since for all they know the original may still be alive) and just fudge the details of which Lorca they're talking about.

(And, of course, one might also think that having dodged that bullet with Lorca, they wouldn't double down and repeat the mistake deliberately with Georgiou. But go figure...)

And honestly, in light of that, how practical is it to say the MU could be "classified" at this point, anyway? The Georgiou decision indicates that the Starfleet admiralty (at least Cornwell, and probably others above her head), the Federation Council (and that's a lot of politicians, and politicians gossip, and also look for things to investigate), and Ambassador Sarek... plus of course the entire crew of the Discovery from Saru down to the lowliest cadet... know about the existence of the MU. No matter what label you stamp on it, that is not a good starting point from which to try to keep a secret.

Hell, where is Starfleet going to say the ship disappeared to for nine months, if they can't mention the MU? I assume investigative reporters still exist in the 23rd century...

...It actually makes one wonder why, in universe, they allowed it to be public knowledge later on...
That was kinda my point. If we actually buy the rationale offered in DSC, then it shouldn't have been public knowledge later on... but we know that it was. Basically the writers painted themselves into an impossible corner: they had to keep it secret to be consistent with the continuity of "Mirror Mirror," but the very act of doing was inconsistent with continuity after "Mirror Mirror."
 
I'm still not seeing the issue.

They were classified in the 23rd century. Then they were declassified in the 24th. Hell, there's a lot of stuff in our own history we civies don't learn until declassified many decades later.

This seems like a total non-issue, but I get it. Some haters just want to find more to hate.
 
Yeah, but that's frankly a dumb rationalization. All you've got over there is someone who looks like your loved one, but has completely different life experiences. Even if they're not EEEvil, it would still be as pointless as, say, becoming obsessed with your lost loved one's identical twin. (Which is not something people do in real life, even though twins are a lot more common and accessible than routes to a parallel universe, because people understand the distinction.)
Yet that is exactly what Lorca did. When he found himself trapped in the PU and realized he had the opportunity, plotted to "acquire" PU Burnham and take her back to the MU with him. He then hoped that after he got her there he could persuade her to stay. Lorca probably knew the odds were against him but he went through with his plan anyway. This is human nature.

Humans are irrational, especially when love is involved. There are many many people who would feel the same way Lorca did and would try to do what he did, even though the odds against your loved one's doppleganger being an adequate replacement are astronomical. But, just like Lorca, for most people, that knowledge woudn't matter.

Random access to the MU would likey eventually have a destabilizing affect on the Federation.
 
Yet that is exactly what Lorca did. ... This is human nature.
Well, yes, apparently. Which is just one of the (many, many) reasons why I think "What's Past Is Prologue" was by far the worst episode of the season, a real shark-jumping episode with a ragingly implausible idiot plot. It's not human nature, it's something the writers retroactively invented for him to paper over the lack of credible motivations in their plot and try to drive home the depths of his heel turn.

There are many many people who would feel the same way Lorca did and would try to do what he did, even though the odds against your loved one's doppleganger being an adequate replacement are astronomical. But, just like Lorca, for most people, that knowledge woudn't matter.
I simply do not believe this. My evidence (as mentioned): the fact that despite the existence of identical twins in the real world, this does not happen.
 
I simply do not believe this. My evidence (as mentioned): the fact that despite the existence of identical twins in the real world, this does not happen.
An identical twin is not the same thing, either physically or emotionally, as another literal version of your loved one. If my wife died, would I want her twin sister? No. Would I be sorely tempted by a universe where she survived? You bet. There will be one out there, QM tells me, where she is all but identical, save for some specific differences. And even if she isn't, that level of rationality is not going to play heavily on my mind when it's up against the possibility of resurrecting the dead.

Are you really telling me that you believe that, if Hawking's final experiment design, to mathematically prove the existence of parallel worlds, actually does so, we'll all just shrug and say "oh well, we've already got twins here"? That's nonsense. It would be a major mindfuck to know there is another you, another one of your loved ones out there. Now Star Trek posits that you can actually go and visit them. I'm sorry, but that is not the same thing as having a twin. That's a completely ridiculous comparison.

they had to keep it secret to be consistent with the continuity of "Mirror Mirror," but the very act of doing was inconsistent with continuity after "Mirror Mirror."
For whatever reason, it became generally known after Mirror Mirror. Not sure why that's hard to imagine. I'm just interested, in universe, as to why that was. That's not Discovery's problem, it's DS9s. My point is that the DS9 writers never thought about the issues.
 
An identical twin is not the same thing, either physically or emotionally, as another literal version of your loved one. If my wife died, would I want her twin sister? No. Would I be sorely tempted by a universe where she survived? You bet. There will be one out there, QM tells me, where she is all but identical, save for some specific differences. And even if she isn't, that level of rationality is not going to play heavily on my mind when it's up against the possibility of resurrecting the dead.
Well, okay. I guess we see this very differently. To me, the odds of finding that kind of similarity would be vanishingly miniscule (indeed that's inherent in the MW theory of QM); certainly the MU doesn't offer it. A MU counterpart is to my mind functionally indistinguishable from an identical twin, except that the person (A) will have the same name, and (B)—a factor that also works against the motivation you're claiming—will have grown up in a society where almost everyone is a duplicitous sonuvabitch.

It's the same reason I was completely unconvinced by Burnham's trust and sympathy for Mirror Georgiou. Notwithstanding her ongoing guilt about the fate of the original, this was simply a completely different person. That should have been evident to everyone, much less someone trained in Vulcan logic. Ferchrissake, she just killed a roomful of her own officers in cold blood, then forced you to eat a Kelpien, then held a knife to your throat... why would you trust this person even a little bit? Literally everything the show set up about Mirror Georgiou in Episode 12 left me expecting Burnham to side with Lorca against her in Episode 13... which was just one more reason that episode left me completely cold.

Are you really telling me that you believe that, if Hawking's final experiment design, to mathematically prove the existence of parallel worlds, actually does so, we'll all just shrug and say "oh well, we've already got twins here"? That's nonsense. It would be a major mindfuck to know there is another you...
This, I don't disagree with. It would indeed be a major mindfuck, not unlike discovering sentient extraterrrestrial life. But this is Star Trek's reality we're talking about; the public learns about some new discovery that should qualify as a major mindfuck pretty much every other week. There's nothing in particular to distinguish the MU from any number of the others.
 
Well, yes, apparently. Which is just one of the (many, many) reasons why I think "What's Past Is Prologue" was by far the worst episode of the season, a real shark-jumping episode with a ragingly implausible idiot plot. It's not human nature, it's something the writers retroactively invented for him to paper over the lack of credible motivations in their plot and try to drive home the depths of his heel turn.
Well, we seem to have shifted to a slightly different subject here now, haven't we? :lol:
 
The many-worlds theory exists today, which makes Sarek's comment regarding dead loved ones weak at best. Data had no issue with explaining it in "Parallels". Kelvin Spock spelled it out in ST'09. Why would 2256 DiscoStarfleet decide the knowledge of another universe has to be kept under lock and key (except to awkwardly keep continuity with TOS, of course)?
Sound like a good idea to me. Why would they advertise it?
 
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