J
Jetfire
Guest
Didn't hate Kes...but had problems with VOY until 'Seven'. 
Why was Kes written off the show?
- Thread starter Kooz
- Start date
Peter didn't view anyone as an equal.
He's an asshole.
He's an asshole.
So is Neelix Peter Pan? And who is Flotter?
Unfortunately, that's not irony and you don't know your Tinkerbell well enough to remember she was a Judas. She sold out Peter Pan, Wendy and all the Lost Boys to Capt Hook.^^
Tinkerbell shows up in a lot of different cartoons on TV now and then and has done so for many years. She has not aged a day either so I guess that means than Kes will live for almost an eternity too.
The irony is the fact that Kes looks like Tinkerbell, a character that never grows up and will never die but yet Kes will grow old and die over a short period of time. Kes looks like Tinkerbell but is mentally Wendy, Peter Pan's love that didn't want to be young forever and left Neverneverland to grow old and have the life she never could with Peter. Ocampa was Kes' Neverneverland. The fact that she was facing her death in "Fury", it's natural she'd want to return to the place of her youth.
Somehow I do get the impression that you really dislike Kes because you're always trying to find something negative about the character, even when there's nothing negative to be found.
When you mentioned Tinkerbell, I immediately thought of the Disney character who is always nice and friendly and looks the same today as she did when they started to make cartoons in the 1930:s or so.
Kes is no Judas. She was always loyal to the Voyager crew.
Kes is not Wendy either, the fact that she left Ocampa had nothing to do with aging or not.
And Kes is no insane monster either as those in charge tried to make it look in "Fury" with that pathetic creature which showed up there.
I don't know anything about Jennifer's alleged drug abuse. And until someone shows me a picture of her with a needle in her arm, I'm not buying.
Having said that, IMO Kes and Harry were the least interesting regular characters, with Chakotay nipping at their heels for third place. I figure the producers weren't about to decimate the cast so they tossed three names into a hat, and Jennifer lost.
Voyager was in Borg space. So having Seven of Nine join the crew worked so much better. Her history as a Borg and her journey to recovery of her humanity was far more interesting than watching Kes handing hypos to the The Doctor, and setting Tuvok on fire (tho' I have to admit, that was pretty cool).
Having said that, IMO Kes and Harry were the least interesting regular characters, with Chakotay nipping at their heels for third place. I figure the producers weren't about to decimate the cast so they tossed three names into a hat, and Jennifer lost.
Voyager was in Borg space. So having Seven of Nine join the crew worked so much better. Her history as a Borg and her journey to recovery of her humanity was far more interesting than watching Kes handing hypos to the The Doctor, and setting Tuvok on fire (tho' I have to admit, that was pretty cool).
7's story is my favorite Trek tale so I agree with you. I was also bored by the super powered ingenue.
The only difference between Data and Seven of Nine's Journey/story is that Data lost his virginity in the 2nd episode.
7 is only part toaster.
I never gave a fig about Data and his journey. It was nice for Geordie to have a friend though, even if it was a robot friend.
I never gave a fig about Data and his journey. It was nice for Geordie to have a friend though, even if it was a robot friend.
Data was dreaming the impossible dream.
Seven was just trying to get over her inner asshole.
Plenty of people have come out the other side of Mr Borgs Wild Ride as still reasonably normal polite and agreeable persons.
Sevens problem was that no one Voyager suggested that she might naturally be a grumpy, sour faced know it all, which was perfectly human behaviour and it was they too who was trying to modify her personality into something uncomfortable and perverse.
If you lost a bet, could you impersonate Geordi's personality for a day?
Seven was just trying to get over her inner asshole.
Plenty of people have come out the other side of Mr Borgs Wild Ride as still reasonably normal polite and agreeable persons.
Sevens problem was that no one Voyager suggested that she might naturally be a grumpy, sour faced know it all, which was perfectly human behaviour and it was they too who was trying to modify her personality into something uncomfortable and perverse.
If you lost a bet, could you impersonate Geordi's personality for a day?
She's surrounded by Starfleet cultists who want everyone to be well rounded. People who fail at that fail at life in their eyes. I went to a school ceremony a while ago and they were giving out awards for Best this and Best that.. but the kids that were best in math or best in science didn't get any awards because all the awards were based on well roundedness. If you didn't participate in school events and suck up to the sports teachers you got nada. Best Math and All Round Good Bloke Award. Never mind that the nerds in your class all got far better grades.
Anyway.
SEVEN: You made me into an individual. You encouraged me to stop thinking like a member of the Collective, to cultivate my independence and my humanity, but when I try to assert that independence I am punished.
JANEWAY: Individuality has its limits, especially on a Starship where there's a command structure.
SEVEN: I believe that you are punishing me because I do not think the way you do, because I am not becoming more like you. You claim to respect my individuality, but in fact you are frightened by it.
JANEWAY: As you were.
Seven should have replied with "No as YOU were, apparently."
Sure, I can always stand to get more sleep.
That Smee was such a creepy character.
The Queen as Hook YES!
The Queen as Hook YES!
Bob Hoskins played Smee at least twice.
WEIRD!
I see Annorax as Hook.
Of course his crocodile is his wife.
Hook didn't want to boff his crocodile, did he?
WEIRD!
I see Annorax as Hook.
Of course his crocodile is his wife.
Hook didn't want to boff his crocodile, did he?
Stroking anything with that hook is a terminal act.
I agree, but Kes was still good for show for it's few seasons.
I can see it. The androgynous look. As in, I no longer have my gender parts the Borg deemed them irrelevant. Though you'd never really know for sure.. he'd be like a very beautiful Vorta. Everyone thinking that they could be the one to awaken him.
Why? I mean Janeway-Female, B'Elanna-Female, Kes-Female Vs Chakotay-Male, Tuvok-Male, Paris-Male, Kim-Male, The Doctor-Male, Neelix-Male. 3 Females Vs 6 Males. Seems to me VOY could have used some more ovaries.
If Harry goes there is still plenty of sausage to go around. 
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