Why was Kes written off the show?

[Lynx]

^^
1. I do hope that my recollections and observations will give the OP to gain some understanding as well.

2. Once again, I can't understand what Jennifer Lien's shyness at conventions has to do with her daily work on Voyager. I haven't encountered anything about her shyness ruining the daily work and it's definitely not visible in any episode in seasons 1-3.

3. I see those "false starts" as evidence for what an intersting character Kes was. It was possible to come up with different scenarios for the character which led to some very good episodes where Kes played an important role. Compare that to Harry Kim's development during the same time.

4. When it comes to the change of hairstyle, that was because Jennifer Lien had an allergic reaction to the glue which was used to attach the Ocampa ears to her head. By making her have long hair, they could simply omit the ears. As for the catsuit, well Braga seem to be obsessed with catuits so when it wasn't possible to have Janeway or Torres in one, Kes became the victim.

5. As for time-consuming things, it took a lot of time with Neelix's make-up and no one complained.

6. There were no hints or reports about Kes being hard to write for until the "hard to write for decease" suddenly struck the writers in the beginning of season 4.

 

[You_Will_Fail]

As I said before, Kes was only "difficult" to write for when compared to character who could be fed the usual Starfleet lines every episode like Tuvok, Chakotay and Harry. Kes was a unique character to Voyager and its a pretty damning indictment of their skills if they really did boot Kes for being a "difficult character to write for" and a testament to their laziness. You can't say you tried "everything" to make Kes work when that clearly was not the case whatsoever.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

You can't say you tried "everything" to make Kes work when that clearly was not the case whatsoever.

Not should it be. She's not a real person in an emergency room you have to save. Trying everything on tv would look terrible.

 

[Guy Gardener]

"captain Janeway. I don't want to be a nurse any more. I want to be a mime. I believe in the power of Mime. If I was an excellent enough mime, I'm certain that I could bring peace to the galaxy."

 

[You_Will_Fail]

You can't say you tried "everything" to make Kes work when that clearly was not the case whatsoever.

Not should it be. She's not a real person in an emergency room you have to save. Trying everything on tv would look terrible.

Uh right.

 

[exodus]

But it would at least explain why and prevent the speculation about what happened.

They gave us a reason.
If you choose to continue to speculate, then that isn't anybody elses problem but your own. They don't owe you anymore than what they've already done.

As for speculation, we also have those who are so blinded by their dislike of the character Kes and the actress that they have to speculate themselves and gives the character/actress all blame for everything which possible went wrong with the series.

This has absolutely nothing to do with the producers making a choice of writing Kes out.

I'm sure you think that saying it's a "conspiracy" makes those who doubt the official story look more ridiculous,

So you're aware of how bad you're position is being perceived, yet you still continue?

I just think it's spin cooked up after the fact, since as has been pointed out numerous times, Kes wasn't the original choice to go, and the "reason" they gave came out of nowhere only when it was time to fire Lien. If someone could point to comments from writers from earlier in the show's run about the difficulties of writing for Kes(like for example, there WERE such difficulties with Troi in TNG season 1) then I'll drop my skepticism.

The fact you've already admitted your standing is ridiculous, then no further examples are necessary.

 

[Lynx]

^^
They gave us a reason, yes. But the "reason" they gave us was not convincing at all.

 

[You_Will_Fail]

This really seems like a thing people should agree to disagree on. Personally I find my explanation to be the most plausible but if you wanna ignore it then fine. Let's just all get on with our lives...

 

[Guy Gardener]

So.

They needed a better lie?

Not something you couldn't see through, but at least a lie that didn't make you feel like an idiot when they lied to you. The opposite of FOX news.

I mean, I only just found out that Braga was creating a harmful workplace for Jolene Blacock... Now, logically I'm assuming half the reason she turned him down (numerous times?) is that she didn't want to be a do-over of his relationship with Jeri, (Jeri part II THE REVENGE!) I mean, it's so insulting to think that he only hired Jolene to sleep with her because if it worked once, why not again?

but think...

What if Jeri had turned him down first?

Lawsuited Braga into abandoning the set let like Titpole did?

Maybe Brannon had more hair, or he was sincere, to get away with this Madmen mentality once, but if he'd botched the job at his first time at bat, and Jeri Ryan had got litigious, the last four seasons of Voyager would have been Bragaless and they probably wouldn't have bothered inviting him on board for Enterprise...

And then Jolene wouldn't have been hired as Titpole.

Since, y'know... Different producers might not have hired her just for the opportunity to sleep with her? I'm not saying she isn't talented or didn't do a good job, but a letch hired her to letch her letcherously. Take that jenesequa away and she's just a talented actress like all the other talented actresses...

But the real "funny as balls" point here is that we almost had a Frankenstein situation on our hands.

The monster almost by a narrow margin destroyed her creator.

And...

If Brannon got fired, outsourced fast enough, they might have had enough money to bring Jennifer back.

 

[The Castellan]

As for the catsuit, well Braga seem to be obsessed with catuits so when it wasn't possible to have Janeway or Torres in one, Kes became the victim.

Well, at least she looked nice in it. ~shrug~


now it would be funny if Braga hired a lesbian actress and did not know until later.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

So.

They needed a better lie?

Not something you couldn't see through, but at least a lie that didn't make you feel like an idiot when they lied to you. The opposite of FOX news.

I mean, I only just found out that Braga was creating a harmful workplace for Jolene Blacock... Now, logically I'm assuming half the reason she turned him down (numerous times?) is that she didn't want to be a do-over of his relationship with Jeri, (Jeri part II THE REVENGE!) I mean, it's so insulting to think that he only hired Jolene to sleep with her because if it worked once, why not again?

but think...

What if Jeri had turned him down first?

Lawsuited Braga into abandoning the set let like Titpole did?

Maybe Brannon had more hair, or he was sincere, to get away with this Madmen mentality once, but if he'd botched the job at his first time at bat, and Jeri Ryan had got litigious, the last four seasons of Voyager would have been Bragaless and they probably wouldn't have bothered inviting him on board for Enterprise...

And then Jolene wouldn't have been hired as Titpole.

Since, y'know... Different producers might not have hired her just for the opportunity to sleep with her? I'm not saying she isn't talented or didn't do a good job, but a letch hired her to letch her letcherously. Take that jenesequa away and she's just a talented actress like all the other talented actresses...

But the real "funny as balls" point here is that we almost had a Frankenstein situation on our hands.

The monster almost by a narrow margin destroyed her creator.

And...

If Brannon got fired, outsourced fast enough, they might have money to bring Jennifer back.

So once again it is all 7's fault.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Jeri not Seven.

They're different people.

Same jumblies, different drama.

 

[spot_loves_data]

Wait... so what the hell happened? Are you saying Ryan slept with Braga?!

Where did you hear that?

 

[Guy Gardener]

it wasn't a secret.

From her wikipedia page...

Ryan had at one point dated Star Trek: Voyager producer Brannon Braga. Between February and November 2000, they were stalked by Marlon Estacio Pagtakhan, who was convicted for harassment and threats in May 2001.[26][27][28] According to Crime Stories, aired on the UK Crime channel on 05/07/2009,[when?] the stalker had letters stating that he was going to sexually assault Ryan and torture Braga.

hmph.

Next you're going to be telling me that you didn't know that Roddenberry had a very meaningful and moist relationship with the Enterprise's First officer in the 60s?

 

[Therin of Andor]

Wait... so what the hell happened? Are you saying Ryan slept with Braga?!

Where did you hear that?

Old news. They were an item for several years during production, IIRC. Yep: 1999-2004.

http://www.famoushookups.com/site/celebrity_profile.php?name=Jeri-Ryan&celebid=617

 

[Therin of Andor]

and torture Braga.

Only Marlon Estacio Pagtakhan?

 

[Guy Gardener]

Everyone else was too afraid.

You see what happens on 24.

The bad Arabs (I don't write it! hell, they cast Bashir as a terrorist!) torture Jack Baur, then he escapes, and tortures the bad Arab back 10 times as hard.

It's just not worth the risk.

Remember.

Brannon liked America when he made Voyager and Enterprise.

Imagine the TV he would make if he hated America?

 

[spot_loves_data]

Ick. This is why I don't go out of my way to find out about the personal lives of actors.

I just heard on a podcast that Kira and Bashir had a child in real life. So, yeah, I'm not up to date on this stuff.

 

[sonak]

Ick. This is why I don't go out of my way to find out about the personal lives of actors.

I just heard on a podcast that Kira and Bashir had a child in real life. So, yeah, I'm not up to date on this stuff.

you don't have to be. The actors aren't the characters.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Ick. This is why I don't go out of my way to find out about the personal lives of actors.

I just heard on a podcast that Kira and Bashir had a child in real life. So, yeah, I'm not up to date on this stuff.

you don't have to be. The actors aren't the characters.

First of all, in that episode Fascination where Lwaxanna is broadcasting Lust at everyone and they all turn into sexahollics... Kira and Bashir were ALL OVER EACH OTHER... I mean sure they were acting, but if they didn't do that for fun after ahours anyway, the level of physicality they exherted on the set that day would make the worlds top pornstars blush and need to steady themselves against the furniture.

Second, O'Brien's baby inside Kira was really Sigid's baby inside Nana. I loved watching peopeles heads explode while explaining that one away...