Why not just bring back Kirk before Star Trek XI?

[Kegek]

Samuel T. Cogley said:
Everyone here seems to have a Shatner agenda. They love him. They hate him. And their posts are all colored by that agenda.

Then count me as the lone apathetic, speaking reason to the tumultuous winds of madness... Shatner's involvement or noninvolvement doesn't bother me much either way. The film's entirely capable of being good (or bad) without Shatner. But if they could have Shatner, I'm fine with that too.

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

James Bond said:

Samuel T. Cogley said:

James Bond said:
Jesus. What are you people going to do when Shatner finally does kick the bucket??

Pretty much what I'm doing now. Not shit on him. You?

Accepting the fact that Shat's Kirk is dead; dead and buried, not obsessing about this "Shat must be in nuTrek08DeltaXI" stuff, and looking forward to what looks to be an awesome movie.

Oh, good, then we're both doing exactly the same thing. :thumbsup:

 

[PKTrekGirl]

Samuel T. Cogley said:
- STC -
* Bites his own tongue so he doesn't ruin PKTrekGirl's night by saying what he really thinks *

*thinks...*

Yeah....that about covers it!

 

[Thomas Riker]

Woulfe said:
IF the SHAT is so freaking great how come Star Trek V : The Ego Frontier sucks eggs to the point that fans want to decanonize it ?

Remember Shatner PRODUCED, DIRECTED, WROTE, and STARRED in this huge flop of a Star Trek film.

Explane THAT !

- W -
* Seroiously explane it, to everyone how that happened *

See now this is the kind of crap that gets to me. Ok so not one of the best star trek movies but it has some wonderful scenes with Kirk, Spock and Bones. This film played a major part in reinforcing the fact to all of us, that these three guys are more than friends, they were family.

 

[Thomas Riker]

Starship Polaris said:

Samuel T. Cogley said:
Is that what I've been doing? I thought I was just not flipping the bird to Shatner. I'll have to go double check every single thread, just to make sure you aren't exaggerating.

In any event, anytime you post more than two or three sentences, I know I've touched a nerve.

Is that what you're doing? Provoking people for the fun of it?

I really may have to sue for infringement.

In any event, your intuition plays you false in this case. There's no one in this forum these days who gives the appearance of taking L'affaire Shatner as seriously as you do (well, no one not currently banned). It's really uncharacteristic, and surprising...you're generally much more adroit at deconstructing idolatry than defending it.

This is verbal diarrhea!

 

[Superman]

Starship Polaris said:
It's really uncharacteristic, and surprising...you're generally much more adroit at deconstructing idolatry than defending it.

Man, I know it's gonna get me a warning, but Bailey, you are SUCH a prick!

Cogs isn't "defending" idolatry, he's defending a human being who far too often is insulted because of his age, weight, and success by small-minded fanboys who think they're hip and cool by being assholes.

Shatner is a person, a human being. I would've thought that even that shrivelled raisin that passes for your heart would have been in some way touched by Heath Ledger's passing.

These people are more than just actors, they have feelings and emotions and lives. Who the fuck are you (and the other "trendy" fans) to verbally insult this man?

Maybe you don't get Trek after all. It's about humanity, which is something I've seen sorely lacking from the Shatner bashers and haters here.

\S/

 

[archeryguy1701]

Superman and Cogley, I think you guys are taking your fight to the wrong people. I just went back through and re-read the thread. The closest thing to a Shatner-bash was when it was brought up that Trek V sucked. Any other anti-Shat comments have been along the vein of "Trek XI doesn't need him, we don't need him, why is everyone wetting themselves because Shat ain't involved?"

If you guys want to get off about the Shat-bashers, how about we do it where there is some actual Shat-bashing going on? I, for one, will reiterate my position that I couldn't care either way, but if there's no real reason to have an old Kirk, why go out of their way to develop some crazy plan to bring him back to life for what would likely be a fan-wank cameo (which, oh by the way, I seem to recall Shatner saying he doesn't do cameos!)

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Okay, archerguy's post inspired me to go back through this thread looking for the terrible abuse and disrespect and "burning in effigy" that's been going on here with regard to Shatner.

Took me about three minutes to collect a representative sampling of posts, so if someone wants to accuse me of obsessing, go ahead.

There are a couple of posts slamming "Star Trek V," as archeryguy said.

There's one post wondering aloud about the reaction when the Shat "kicks the bucket."

There's a post suggesting that Shatner would require plastic surgery in order to play Kirk.

All of those may be considered intemperate or unfair or in questionable taste. Terrible, terrible stuff...sort of.

Besides that, here's a representative sample of quotes from the rest of us Shatner Haters:

Therin of Andor said:
JJ Abrams' ST has no need of an Old Kirk in the script.

Space Janitor said:
I like Shatner as much as anyone and the Kirk he played was a cool character, but he's dead.

Starship Polaris said:
Yes, Abrams could have chosen to make a different "Star Trek" movie with a different emphasis on different characters. Orci and Kurzman could have written a movie featuring Shatner as Kirk, in a number of ways.

No one has yet advanced a proposal for that, though, that sounds better to me than the movie Abrams appears to be doing.

Woulfe said:
^ You do realize that there were 4 Star Trek TV shows that didn't have William Shatner in them !

- W -
* Just thought i'd point that out *

seigezunt said:
I'm a huge fan of the Shat, adore all he does, but I can't see them bringing him back without reducing the film to utter fankwankery.

Doomsday said:
As others have said, I am as big a fan of Shatner as any. But Trek is bigger than just him, and it will do fine without him, if the story is strong enough.

archeryguy1701 said:I probably would have no issue if Shatner were in the movie. BUT HE'S NOT.

Noname Given said:
Hey - TOS is my FAVORITE series, period; so, just because I'm not chomping at the bit to see William Shatner reprise the role of 'James T. Kirk'; it doesn't follow that there is any disrespect intended towards William Shatner himself.

Kegek said:
Then count me as the lone apathetic, speaking reason to the tumultuous winds of madness... Shatner's involvement or noninvolvement doesn't bother me much either way.

How could we be so unreasonable and unkind and ungrateful?

 

[Superman]

Of course, Bailey will spin it to look like he's innocent. Leftist nutsos like his ilk usually do.

Archerguy, the fact is that a lot of the folks who have been moderate in their comments towards Shatner are only being moderate IN THIS THREAD.

Hence Bailey was only able to find moderate comments HERE.

Perusing other Shatner-related threads will yield different results.

The point is, there remains a lot of UNNECESSARY hostility and outright hatred for William Shatner. You don't have to think he's a great actor, writer, or anything. But I do think he should be accorded the same respect any of us here would like to receive.

And please, don't put Cogs in my category. He's much more subtle and temperate than I am, a fact I readily acknowledge. If anyone's guilty of "fighting" here, it's surely me, and not him.

\S/

 

[Thomas Riker]

^ Superman I'm not being funny but I'm starting to think the hatred is with the character and not the actor. There has been similar bashing of James Cawley in another thread for his participation in Trek XI, I simply cannot understand this behavior.

 

[PKTrekGirl]

Thomas Riker said:

Starship Polaris said:

Samuel T. Cogley said:
Is that what I've been doing? I thought I was just not flipping the bird to Shatner. I'll have to go double check every single thread, just to make sure you aren't exaggerating.

In any event, anytime you post more than two or three sentences, I know I've touched a nerve.

Is that what you're doing? Provoking people for the fun of it?

I really may have to sue for infringement.

In any event, your intuition plays you false in this case. There's no one in this forum these days who gives the appearance of taking L'affaire Shatner as seriously as you do (well, no one not currently banned). It's really uncharacteristic, and surprising...you're generally much more adroit at deconstructing idolatry than defending it.

This is verbal diarrhea!

I think we could do without comments like this. If you want to disagree, then post your argument - not a comment like this.

Thanks.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Thomas Riker said:
^ Superman I'm not being funny but I'm starting to think the hatred is with the character and not the actor. There has been similar bashing of James Cawley...

Except that the character is in this movie - no less than he is in Jim Cawley's shows - and most people seem quite happy about that.

Personally, I'm really happy for Jim that he's getting to be in the new movie. I think I'm more envious that he's seen the production and knows what's going on with it than I am of his role, but then I'm not an actor.

 

[PKTrekGirl]

Superman said:

Starship Polaris said:
It's really uncharacteristic, and surprising...you're generally much more adroit at deconstructing idolatry than defending it.

Man, I know it's gonna get me a warning, but Bailey, you are SUCH a prick!

Cogs isn't "defending" idolatry, he's defending a human being who far too often is insulted because of his age, weight, and success by small-minded fanboys who think they're hip and cool by being assholes.

Shatner is a person, a human being. I would've thought that even that shrivelled raisin that passes for your heart would have been in some way touched by Heath Ledger's passing.

These people are more than just actors, they have feelings and emotions and lives. Who the fuck are you (and the other "trendy" fans) to verbally insult this man?

Maybe you don't get Trek after all. It's about humanity, which is something I've seen sorely lacking from the Shatner bashers and haters here.

\S/

and...

Superman said:
Of course, Bailey will spin it to look like he's innocent. Leftist nutsos like his ilk usually do.

Needless to say, you have a warning for flaming.

Comments to PM.

 

[Superman]

^^^Just as I figured.

Sometimes, you just have to say what needs to be said, and believe me, I've been bottling that up for a while.

I'll be better from here on out...

\S/

 

[PKTrekGirl]

^ Thanks. That would be much appreciated!

 

[Therin of Andor]

Thomas Riker said:
I'm starting to think the hatred is with the character and not the actor.

What "hatred"?

Because we don't feel that JJ Abrams' movie should be weighed down by an attempt to shoehorn an Old Kirk (and William Shatner) into his script?

The last thing we want is people walking out of ST XI saying, "That was good, except they really shouldn't have tried to undo Kirk's death in 'Generations' just to get people to come to this movie."

And Shatner has said, "I don't do cameos", so Old Kirk's part would have to have been significant to the whole story. Suddenly the script the studio was so happy with becomes a laundry list of "things that should be included", which was the major complaint about "Generations" in the first place.

 

[martin]

This is Spock's movie, not Shatner/Kirk's

 

[cooleddie74]

The only James Kirk in this movie will be Chris Pine. End of story.

 

[Gepard]

Holy crap, this thread is entertaining.

*sits down with bucket of popcorn*

 

[martin]

Therin of Andor said:

martin said:
The way I would have brought him back, would have been to include a scene between old Spock and old Kirk, set just before Kirk set off to the Enterprise B's launch. Perhaps they could of had an argument which led to Spock's non attendance

Which Hollywood plastic surgeon do you recommend to get Shatner looking even a little bit like he did in "Generations"?

The same guys who de-aged Anthony Hopkins in Red Dragon, and Patrick Stewart with Ian McKellen from Xmen 3