Why is Janeway worse than Sisko when it comes to ...
- Thread starter DarthTom
- Start date
People (on this board) like Sisko better than Janeway for one reason and one reason alone.
Because they hate Rick Berman.
Voyager, unlike DS9, TNG and TOS, was entirely a B&B run production.
I'm sure there are some here who will say that Voyager is the reason they hate B&B, but the truth is that a lot of "Trekies" disliked Voyager before the first episode ever aired because they were disgruntled about DS9 not getting it's primetime network shot.
Ultimately, I agree with those who say DS9 was a better written show than Voyager. But, Janeway was a much deeper character than Sisko.
The only real internal conflict that Sisko had to deal with over the course of the show was balancing the needs of the Federation with the demands of the Prophets. That conflict grew larger as the series went on.
The comment above that Janeway fought with her decisions in Caretaker through the entire series is correct. And, the guilt from that decision and how it effected her popped up repeatedly through the series. It was, of course, the basis of the episode Night, but it manifested itself in different ways through out the course of the series.
With respect to Endgame, given the above I'm not really surprised at how different Admiral Janeway was than Captain Janeway. 70 plus hears of having to deal with that guilt and missed opportunities was probably more than even she cold handle. I mean, it's not as though Janeway wasn't prone to go off the deep end from time to time.
As to whether the finales of Endgame or WYLB was better. I think they were both very good at times, and both left me feeling flat at the end.
Endgame seemed like there should have been something beyond them just getting there. But, it was understandable why they did it that way. As Harry said in that episode, it was the journey, not the destination.
What You Leave Behind, ultimately, left behind a lot of questions unanswered. Questions, that were never really resolved beyond Worf's "I am not a diplomat" comment in Insurrection.
Because they hate Rick Berman.
Voyager, unlike DS9, TNG and TOS, was entirely a B&B run production.
I'm sure there are some here who will say that Voyager is the reason they hate B&B, but the truth is that a lot of "Trekies" disliked Voyager before the first episode ever aired because they were disgruntled about DS9 not getting it's primetime network shot.
Ultimately, I agree with those who say DS9 was a better written show than Voyager. But, Janeway was a much deeper character than Sisko.
The only real internal conflict that Sisko had to deal with over the course of the show was balancing the needs of the Federation with the demands of the Prophets. That conflict grew larger as the series went on.
The comment above that Janeway fought with her decisions in Caretaker through the entire series is correct. And, the guilt from that decision and how it effected her popped up repeatedly through the series. It was, of course, the basis of the episode Night, but it manifested itself in different ways through out the course of the series.
With respect to Endgame, given the above I'm not really surprised at how different Admiral Janeway was than Captain Janeway. 70 plus hears of having to deal with that guilt and missed opportunities was probably more than even she cold handle. I mean, it's not as though Janeway wasn't prone to go off the deep end from time to time.
As to whether the finales of Endgame or WYLB was better. I think they were both very good at times, and both left me feeling flat at the end.
Endgame seemed like there should have been something beyond them just getting there. But, it was understandable why they did it that way. As Harry said in that episode, it was the journey, not the destination.
What You Leave Behind, ultimately, left behind a lot of questions unanswered. Questions, that were never really resolved beyond Worf's "I am not a diplomat" comment in Insurrection.
Sisko also had internal conflict when dealing with the officers vs. friends like with Dax, Bernie Casey's character & Eddington.
He had internal conflict when dealing with Kasady Yates, was she his lover or traitor?
It was an internal conflict every time he had to ask Quark or Garak for a favor.
He had internal conflict when dealing with Kasady Yates, was she his lover or traitor?
It was an internal conflict every time he had to ask Quark or Garak for a favor.
I'm not sure I'd consider the situation with Kasidy a good example or not. No, he wasn't happy about it, but he knew his duty and ultimately did it.
I think probably a better example was the way they conned the Romulans into helping the Federation during the Dominion War.
Michael Piller, Jerri Taylor, and Kennith Biller.
number6
Vice Admiral
Berman was as active on DS9 as he was on TNG, VOY, and ENT, although he did do more writing on ENT. Braga was a writer on VOY and became the head of the writing staff a few years into VOY, then stepped back somewhere late in season 6 to develop ENT. By that time Biller was more or less in charge.
Berman didn't become as involved with VOY as he was with the other Trek shows until the S4, before then Michael Piller and Jeri Taylor were in charge. I'd place most of the blame for bad stuff in those first three seasons on Taylor.
Anyways, Braga was the one mostly in from S4-S6, and Ken Biller in charge from S6-S7.
Taylor was also in charge during TNG's poor final season.
Most people don't know shit.
They've never spent a day on the set learning what it takes to write & produce a TV show. They believe the internet & being an arm chair warrior gives them more knowledge of those like B&B that have a degree and actual time spent in the field.They still believe B&B ran Trek as if they never had to answer to Paramount, as if B&B have no bosses but themselves. B&B paid their dues and earned the right to write & produce Trek, regardless of what people think of Voy.. They also don't bitch about the fans the way ungratfull fans bitch about them.
Agreed. Worthy of it's own thread sometime but some Trek fans act as though they own the franchise by rule of Democracy. TV programming don't work that way and neither are multi-billion $$ corporations like Viacom.
'Star Trek' is owned by the shareholders of Viacom - so I suggest instead of bitching about why it sucks so much one of them go by several million shares of Viacom and they can tell the happy asses at Paramount how to re-design the show.
exodus said:
Most people don't know shit.
They still believe B&B ran Trek as if they never had to answer to Paramount, as if B&B have no bosses but themselves. B&B paid their dues and earned the right to write & produce Trek, regardless of what people think of Voy.. They also don't bitch about the fans the way ungratfull fans bitch about them.
You speak the truth. Preach on, brother! -- RR
Maybe in the original timeline, "Nemesis" never happened. :thumbsup:
