The Vulcans are my favorite alien species in Star Trek, but the Bajorans aren't far behind. I think they're a fascinating culture and their social and political turmoil created some profound stories.
Why do people hate the Bajorians?
- Thread starter Jayson1
- Start date
I didn't have a problem with them at all.
If a lot of people dont like them it may be that they often played the villain, and also stirred up trouble many times. Like when they protest against Odo, or when they protest against the Federation, or when they protest against the "3 Vipers that return to the nest."
If a lot of people dont like them it may be that they often played the villain, and also stirred up trouble many times. Like when they protest against Odo, or when they protest against the Federation, or when they protest against the "3 Vipers that return to the nest."
I like the Bajorans!
I don't see them only as metaphor for the Jews but for almost all opressed people who have had their freedom back after years of brutal occupation, like the Estonians, Latvians, Lithuanians, Poles, Czechs etc.
I also think that the writers of DS9 did put the hammer on the head of the nail by coming up with the scenario of what happened after the occupation ended. Not all liberated countries find their way back, in some of them there will be confusion and internal struggle as well.
I don't see them only as metaphor for the Jews but for almost all opressed people who have had their freedom back after years of brutal occupation, like the Estonians, Latvians, Lithuanians, Poles, Czechs etc.
I also think that the writers of DS9 did put the hammer on the head of the nail by coming up with the scenario of what happened after the occupation ended. Not all liberated countries find their way back, in some of them there will be confusion and internal struggle as well.
I never hated the Bajorans, and quite liked Kira and Ro, who were both fascinating characters, but I found Bajoran culture a bit boring at times. A little metaphysical soul-searching about the "Prophets" and such goes a long way. And they weren't very visually interesting either. Lots of muted colors and robes and vaguely agrarian settings was my general impression.
That being said, some of the episodes that seriously explored the effects of the Cardassian Occupation and its aftermath, like "Duet" or "Necessary Evil," are among my favorite DS9 eps.
But those were arguably more about a character, Kira, than her culture.
That being said, some of the episodes that seriously explored the effects of the Cardassian Occupation and its aftermath, like "Duet" or "Necessary Evil," are among my favorite DS9 eps.
But those were arguably more about a character, Kira, than her culture.
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But Vedek Bareil was dull as dirt.
Although I probably shouldn't hold him against the entire Bajoran people . . . .
He died well.But Vedek Bareil was dull as dirt.
Because their bloody annoying, hard headed, stubborn pointy nosed backwater primitives who only prospered because somehow a group of a extradimensional aliens saw fit to pity them. Without that they'd be a backwater joke.
I swear Dukat makes more and more sense.
I swear Dukat makes more and more sense.
I thought the Bajorans were really interesting, and those we got to know well were great characters. Kira and Ro I thought were really good examples of a personality type Star Trek doesn't do much, and they made their respective casts stronger for it. Kai Winn was wonderfully played as a the creeping power grabber, albeit she became a moustache twirling cliché in the finale. I thought the Bajoran culture, faith and backstory was fascinating and I only wish the budget had allowed us to see more of the planet and experience more of the aspects of the culture, a bit like the parallel world set up in Caprica. I disagree that they are as simple as 'Israel in space' although that analogy is often drawn, and they cleverly layered aspects of all sorts of conflicts from Earth history. I particularly liked the aspect of them being suspicious of the 'benevolent Federation' moving in to help out, seeing them as a potential new master, the British Empire come to show the poor dears how to be civilised while helping themselves to the fruits of their labour. Shades of colonialism which the show didn't shy away from. Picard (in a cut glass British accent, no less) even explicitly tells Sisko his job is to prepare Bajor for Federation entry, and ultimately of course it is him who prevents exactly this because it is better for Bajor to be independent.
My only gripe about the Bajorans is that we didn't see more of the clean-up effort. Over the course of the series, Bajor turns from occupied, resource-stripped wasteland into a virtual paradise, but frustratingly this happens almost exclusively off camera. I'm sure there was story potential in this which went untapped.
My only gripe about the Bajorans is that we didn't see more of the clean-up effort. Over the course of the series, Bajor turns from occupied, resource-stripped wasteland into a virtual paradise, but frustratingly this happens almost exclusively off camera. I'm sure there was story potential in this which went untapped.
Its interesting that without the Cardassian occupation the Bajora would have been a planet of theocractic, extremely strict caste based, probably xenophobic, religious fanatics. And I bet they would have started a war with the Federation.
They sound like Saudi without the oil.
They sound like Saudi without the oil.
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^Perhaps a Tibet analogy would be suitable as well. Because of a 50 year long occupation by a foreign power and a fascinating spiritual culture, both in- and outsiders tend to loose sight of the downsides of their pre-occupation culture (e.g. an extremely rigid caste system, and that religion seems to determine a lot), as well as their inherent strengths, and paint them as a 'pitiable' people that should receive all the support the Federation can give them.
It is easy to forget the previous oppressor who had his foot on your neck looked just like you when its an alien with his foot on your neck.
It took the Cardassians to unite them as a people. Dukat made this point, and as reprehensible as he was, he had a point. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
We see this in history, when a conquered nation has a common enemy people pull together. Once the oppressor is gone all hell breaks loose and old scores want to be settled. E.g Middle East, Africa, parts of Asia and back in the day the USA.
Yeah my guess is Bajora before the occupation was not exactly a mini Federation state in the making. Far from it.
Except that they suppressed those institutions and organizations that worked for Bajoran unity, like the freedom fighters and the office of the kai.
See also parts of Eastern Europe after the USSR fell apart: civil wars, ethnic cleansing, old feuds and scores bubbling over again . . ..
That's what I dislike sometimes: visually impressive aliens just for the sake of having interesting aliens. But it were the DS9 novels rather than the show that made me becoming more interested in the Bajoran culture. Truth to be told: the Bajoran characters are more interesting than some obscure prophecies. And I think the Bajoran past, which is explored mainly in the novels, is really boring. I'm more interested in contemporary Bajoran customs.
The Friends of Bareil group will be after you Mr. Cox! Look them up.But Vedek Bareil was dull as dirt.
Although I probably shouldn't hold him against the entire Bajoran people . . . .
I must confess it as a Vorta: at least I liked the mirror Bareil.
For me the look of the Bajorians were great because if you put to much gunk on there face you can create race were you have actors trying to give a performance only to be ruined because you can't see there facial reactions. That to me was a huge problem with the Jem haddar. they look cool but we never really got a great reacuring character out of them and frankly I had a hard time telling them part. Whenever I watch "One little Ship" I don't know which one is talking half of the time.
Jason
Jason
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