Why Didn't Harry Get Promoted?

[Farscape One]

Yes, Worf should have outranked Jadzia. Jadzia was just out of the Academy during DS9 season 1, when Worf was about four years into his service on the Enterprise.

I don't think Dax should have been promoted soon after "Blood Oath" and "Meridian", that promotion felt unearned, felt just so that she would not be outranked by newcomer Worf (and/but she would outrank Bashir), and don't think most people really take Nog becoming Ensign after two years as cadet seriously.

Jadzia wasn't just out of the Academy in DS9 season 1. She was a full Lt. and 28 years old in "EMISSARY"... assuming she graduated at around 22 years old, that's 6 years as an officer, which is enough time to get to that rank. (Especially when you consider Riker was a full Commander and XO of the Enterprise after about that amount of time in the service.)

Jadzia was made Lt. Cmdr. between season 3 and 4, so about 3 years at full Lt. Not unrealistic, since it took Worf 4 years to get to Lt. Cmdr. from full Lt. (Or Geordi's single year from full Lt. to Lt. Cmdr.)

So her promotion didn't feel unearned. Not to me, anyway.


Regarding Nog... he was also right in the center of wartime actions and missions for about 4 months before he got his field promotion to ensign. FAR more realistic than Kelvinverse Kirk getting from cadet to captain in one mission.

 

[kkt]

Yes, you're right, she was 28. Three years as a full Lt. and then getting Lt. Cmdr. is a little quick but not out of line. The crucial ensign-lt. promotion is fairly quick compared to the higher ranks. I don't see needing to be the same rank as Worf as a reason for promoting her, though. It's not like an Ensign-Captain relationship (Helen Noel).

Absolutely agree about Nog. Service in a ship on unrelenting war duty produces a lot more experience than the same number of years in peacetime. (The Kelvinverse is fan fiction.)

 

[Anwar]

The real reason? Because the writers and...darn near everyone involved at the Production level all disliked Garrett Wang and decided to make Harry a punching bag as a result. Including no promotions.

 

[Dee1891]

The only character who had a real promotion was Tuvok. What happened to Tom Paris was that he was demoted in early or mid-Season Five and regained his old rank at the end of Season Six. For me, that's not the same as a genuine promotion. Yet, many people are reacting as if Harry Kim was the only character on this show who did not get promoted.

 

[fireproof78]

FAR more realistic than Kelvinverse Kirk getting from cadet to captain in one mission.

Lieutenant to captain.

The crucial ensign-lt. promotion is fairly quick compared to the higher ranks

Which is why Harry's stands out so badly. Staying at the lowest commissioned rank for 7 years makes no sense, especially given he acts as a department head, shift watch officer, and has rather significant responsibilities.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

If they wanted an ensign throughout, they should have planned long-term and started him out as a cadet on his internship.

 

[DonIago]

^Or made a point of having him screw up in ways that would justify his not being promoted. If "30 Days" had been a Kim episode that happened earlier in the show's run, that would do it, at least for a good chunk of the run of the series.

 

[Oddish]

The only character who had a real promotion was Tuvok. What happened to Tom Paris was that he was demoted in early or mid-Season Five and regained his old rank at the end of Season Six. For me, that's not the same as a genuine promotion. Yet, many people are reacting as if Harry Kim was the only character on this show who did not get promoted.

Aside from Janeway, who couldn't go above captain for obvious reasons, every other ranked character got either a promotion or a commission.
Chakotay - Commission reactivated at previous rank of LCDR.
Tuvok - Promoted from LT to LCDR.
B'Elanna - Promoted to LTJG and chief engineer... for hitting a superior.
Tom - Commission reactivated at LTJG. Reduced to ENS, promoted back to LTJG.
Harry - Never promoted.
EMH, Neelix, Kes, Seven - No rank.

And even though Janeway wasn't promoted over the course of the show, she was seen promoted to Admiral within a year of Voyager's return. It took until 2024 to even feature Garrett Wang on ANY Trek, and

Spoiler

he wasn't "prime universe" Harry.

If they wanted an ensign throughout, they should have planned long-term and started him out as a cadet on his internship.

Or had him show up mid-"Thirty Days" wearing Tom's rank pip. They could still restore Tom at end of S6, one season without an ensign isn't going to break the bank.

 

[Farscape One]

Lieutenant to captain.


Which is why Harry's stands out so badly. Staying at the lowest commissioned rank for 7 years makes no sense, especially given he acts as a department head, shift watch officer, and has rather significant responsibilities.

Kirk was still under disciplinary review when he made his way to the Enterprise.

And even if he WAS a Lt. there, he went straight from cadet to lieutenant and then bumped to captain in the same mission.

Still stupid and ridiculous.

 

[fireproof78]

Kirk was still under disciplinary review when he made his way to the Enterprise.

And even if he WAS a Lt. there, he went straight from cadet to lieutenant and then bumped to captain in the same mission.

Still stupid and ridiculous.

Stupid? Maybe. Ridiculous? I disagree.

Regardless, he was inserted in to the chain of command by the senior officer and eligible to move up or down that chain. The only person answerable for that is the senior officer.

 

[Farscape One]

The only character who had a real promotion was Tuvok. What happened to Tom Paris was that he was demoted in early or mid-Season Five and regained his old rank at the end of Season Six. For me, that's not the same as a genuine promotion. Yet, many people are reacting as if Harry Kim was the only character on this show who did not get promoted.

Harry Kim was pretty static the entire 7 years. Except for night watch command on occasion, he had no change in his rank or duties.

Even Neelix got to do more than his initial cook and guide role. He became ambassador for the ship and he was training and putting in time in other departments (like security and engineering) to broaden himself.

Kes started off with just running airponics and helping Neelix, but also ended up as Nurse.

Seven... well, she was an expert in pretty much all subjects, so she was working everywhere.

Only The Doctor was static in rank (he had none) and duties (CMO), but he had a MUCH wider array of interests than Kim.



The lack of promotion is bad enough, but couple that with lack of movement of anything with his character makes it stand out so badly.

 

[Farscape One]

Stupid? Maybe. Ridiculous? I disagree.

Regardless, he was inserted in to the chain of command by the senior officer and eligible to move up or down that chain. The only person answerable for that is the senior officer.

It was stupid and ridiculous because there already were a number of experienced officers, lieutenants and up, that were already there.

 

[Oddish]

Seven... well, she was an expert in pretty much all subjects, so she was working everywhere.

Agreed. That's why the latter part of VOY is sometimes called "The Janeway, Doctor, and Seven" show.

Only The Doctor was static in rank (he had none) and duties (CMO), but he had a MUCH wider array of interests than Kim.

And don't forget the ECH.

The lack of promotion is bad enough, but couple that with lack of movement of anything with his character makes it stand out so badly.

That and the Kurtzman era's showrunners' subsequent refusal to do justice to the character.

Spoiler

His appearance on "Lower Decks" really doubled down on the whole "poor dumb forever ensign Kim" trope.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

It was stupid and ridiculous because there already were a number of experienced officers, lieutenants and up, that were already there.

Except there weren't?

I mean, Doctor Puri probably wasn't a Bridge Officer, McKenna was sick... and given that most of the main cast were referred to by commissioned rank while onboard we can't IMO assume that Operations Officer Hannity and Comms Officer Hawkins were experienced and qualified to command either.

 

[fireproof78]

It was stupid and ridiculous because there already were a number of experienced officers, lieutenants and up, that were already there.

Command or line officers?

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

Command or line officers?

Command and line officer are kinda the same thing... I think you mean command/line or staff officers.

Of the available potential candidates only Doctor Puri is likely to be the latter.

 

[Farscape One]

But it makes sense to promote a cadet with no prior missions under their belt straight to captain, jumping over 4 other ranks?

I can buy heroism and quick thinking can get you a bump to a rank upward, maybe two, and command of a department.

But to captain of a brand new, top of the line starship? Starfleet's flagship?

No. Absolutely does not make sense, defies belief, and was just plain stupid.

 

[fireproof78]

Command and line officer are kinda the same thing... I think you mean command/line or staff officers.

Of the available potential candidates only Doctor Puri is likely to be the latter.

Yes, quite correct.

While I do not completely agree with @Frostscape One that it was stupid, I don't entirely agree with Pike either. But, he had limited options, and placed Kirk in to the chain of command as First Officer at the rank of lieutenant. Kirk was eligible to move up in the ranks from that point.

Two, the fleet had just lost 6 other ships, including experienced line officers to Nero's attack, plus whatever other casualties from the attack on Earth and Vulcan. The pool of line officers has now become smaller.

But it makes sense to promote a cadet with no prior missions under their belt straight to captain, jumping over 4 other ranks?

With limited information I can only say "Maybe," since I don't know if Kirk had any other missions in the 3 years at the Academy, nor what his command school training fully entailed.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

But it makes sense to promote a cadet with no prior missions under their belt straight to captain, jumping over 4 other ranks?

Well, part of the issue is Starfleet's "everyone who commands a starship is a Captain" thing.

But to captain of a brand new, top of the line starship? Starfleet's flagship?

Not really, no.

Though IRL a hard charger like Kirk being assigned as the "skipper" of a small support ship or a senior officer on a "mid-size" vessel (corvette/cutter to destroyer/light cruiser) wouldn't be out of the ordinary.

Honestly, I could just about get my head around him being the de facto Second Officer (particularly after Olsen's death) for Enterprise, but any more than that should have been delayed to Beyond if at all.

 

[Oddish]

The idea that Kirk goes from academy cadet to captain overnight is pretty much nuts. And one reason why I only watched the first of the Kelvin timeline movies.

In a way, it's too bad... we could have seen scenes from Kirk's progression from academy grad to starship captain. You know, like SNW is actually giving us?