Why Did Roddenberry Hate the "dreadnought" from the Starfleet Technical Manual?

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by Samuel, Dec 31, 2017.

  1. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Sorry, perhaps I overracted, but it gets tiresome to share information, not trying to be authoritative and even stating such, and have people argue every little point.
     
  2. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Hey, man, I'm not trying to be pedantic or nitpick. If I'm coming off as a jerk, it's not my intention.

    I realize you were just stating your opinion; I was just stating mine too. I thoroughly appreciate the research you and others do. It's been a revelation.
     
  3. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Remember, recall wasn't perfect, and they didn't have everything at their fingertips they way we do today, never mind hindsight of what was important and what wasn't. IIRC, in "The Trouble With Tribbles," Fred Phillips didn't remember which aliens from the previous year the Klingons were, and recreated their look based on a black-and-white polaroid, which is why they didn't have their skin darkened as much for that episode.
     
  4. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    It would've had to be "Friday's Child" where that happened first, since that was the first Klingon episode of season 2 and had the same "just a costume and beard" makeup approach as "Tribbles" later on. It wasn't until "A Private Little War" that Phillips finally recreated the "Errand of Mercy" look.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
  5. hbquikcomjamesl

    hbquikcomjamesl Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Uh, there weren't any Klingons in "The Apple"; just the Feeders of Vaal.
     
  6. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Sorry, I meant "A Private Little War" -- fixed. Maybe my mind glitched because the Klingon in APLW was colluding with a native named Apella -- or more likely because of the "serpents in the Garden of Eden" reference shared by the two episodes.
     
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  7. Shamrock Holmes

    Shamrock Holmes Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Mostly agree. However I think that Kirk was refering to Connie-(sub)class within the Starship class/type.

    I suggested a similar system up thread.

    Potentially known examples could decode to:

    NAR: Federation Auxiliary Research Vessel
    NBT: Federation ? Transport
    NCC: Federation Starship ("Multi-Role Cruiser")
    NSP: Federation Supply Vessel
    NX: Federation Experimental Vessel

    NCC could also be broken down by size into:
    NSC = Federation Starship Escort (Defiant, Saber)
    NFF = Federation Exploration Frigate (Voyager, Miranda?)
    NCC = Federation Exploration Cruiser (Connie (2200s only), Miranda (2200s only), Excelsior, Ambassador)
    NCA = Federation Attack Cruiser (Akira, Prometheus, Sovereign?)
    NDE = Federation Diplomatic & Exploration Vessel (Galaxy, Sovereign?)
     
  8. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Sure, it's not impossible. That's why I think it instead unlikely.

    There were indeed more starbase commodores and admirals than starbase women with speaking parts, which is a damn shame actually. Sign o' the times, I know. But besides positing that the women had been forgotten, I could just as easily posit that, given their sparsity, they'd be memorable. Areel Shaw had a unique costume in all of Trek, the only TOS-era female dress uniform ever seen. Unlike the costumes for the men, that had to be made specially. But, yeah, she and her costume could have been completely forgotten by Theiss et al by the next season. :shrug:
     
  9. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Captain Captain

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    I prefer NCC = Naval Construction Code.

    Especially given that all we ever see is StarFleet vessels.

    NCC is simple ID monikor for StarFleet vessels.

    Just like USS could potentially stand for:
    UFP
    StarFleet
    StarShip

    Which would make a lot more sense.

    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/NCIA-93_type

    My Speculation for NCIA-93:
    NCIA = Naval Construction Intelligence Agency
    Given how public Section 31 is in the DISCO-verse, it wouldn't surprise me if they get their own Multi-Letter Prefix.

    It's almost like a License Plate for your vessel that is part of the UFP.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
  10. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    The versions I've seen are "Naval Construction Contract" and "Navigational Contact Code." I tend to assume it means both.


    It was repeatedly stated in onscreen dialogue in TOS that it was short for "United Space Ship" or occasionally "United Star Ship." E.g. "I'm Captain James Kirk of the United Star Ship Enterprise" in "The Squire of Gothos" or "You're aboard the United Space Ship Enterprise" in "Space Seed." I tend to assume it's implicitly "United [Federation of Planets] Star Ship."
     
  11. matthunter

    matthunter Vice Admiral Admiral

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    As for the Delta becoming the Starfleet symbol, remember that Cochrane saw combadges on the E-E crew in the altered FC timeline. As his "ravings" about time travelers were re-examined post-TCW Archer period, perhaps some of his sketches/notes came into vogue?

    Could he even have seen the hull registry and name on the E-E during its fly-by of the Phoenix? Maybe Starfleet knows that to have an Enterprise NCC-1701-E you need to "honor" the first ship to bear the registry and name, regardless of whether it actually did anything exceptional (and I'm still in the "it did" camp)?
     
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  12. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    That's too convoluted. A lot of space-agency and aviation logos in history have had similar shapes -- it's sort of a cross between an arrowhead/airfoil shape and a star shape, so it's a pretty natural design for a space agency to come up with. Probably the reason Bill Theiss (or Matt Jefferies or Pato Guzman?) came up with it in the first place is because they were emulating similar designs from real-world aviation and NASA logos. So I don't see the origin of the logo as some kind of huge mystery that requires time travel to explain.
     
  13. matthunter

    matthunter Vice Admiral Admiral

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    OK, they saw the British sci-fi series Blake's Seven, which had an evil Federation and a side-slanted Delta and thought "we can redeem this!" a la the arguments about taking back the swastika.

    They should have kept the Servalan motif for the head of Starfleet though. Gorgeous dresses and vampish haircuts FTW.
     
  14. Mysterion

    Mysterion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    NCC = No Canon Connotation :)
     
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  15. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Captain Captain

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    About ten or so years off there... But, still loved both shows!