Why did people dislike the "TNG aesthetic"?

[Tarek71]

I've always been fascinated as to why so many Trek fans seemed to dislike the visual aesthetic that was developed for early TNG. I'm not talking about clothes but more the appearance of shipboard life that seemed to emphasize comfort and luxury at a very human level over omnipresent mechanization.

In some ways the look and feel of TNG is just a carry over from what was attempted in the The Motion Picture. We were shown an Enterprise that was much less focused on operations and maintenance and more on leisurely exploration. The Bridge of the Enterprise D had fewer (and smaller) stations than any ship we'd seen before or since. The idea was in someways that the Bridge was just a glorified lounge for the senior staff since most of the ship's operations were meant to be automated. Engineering was largely incorporated into the corridors instead of being isolated as in prior ships. There were planters and wood paneling with computers largely invisible unless needed.

Despite creating a vision of exploration that was comfortable and relaxed...fans seemed to reject the look everytime it was tried. Both the TMP and TNG Enterprises were negatively compared to hotels.

I'm just curious as to why this did not seem to resonate with fans?

The Generations bridge added back in some stations. Utilizing those largely empty walls. It was not a great setup. The Counselor, of all people, gets a set position next to the captain, but many other stations are missing or minimized.

Sure it was the carpeting, wood finishes and big comfy chairs, but the cruise ship look wasnt the only problem. ENT-D had easily the worst bridge layout, space utilization and priorities.

Some character choices affected it. Troi can read emotions, so she was helpful on the bridge in a way that a normal counselor or social worker would NOT be. LOL. And Data was the defacto science officer, and over operations. So the science position was minimized.

 

[Lance]

The Generations bridge added back in some stations. Utilizing those largely empty walls. It was not a great setup. The Counselor, of all people, gets a set position next to the captain, but many other stations are missing or minimized.

Sure it was the carpeting, wood finishes and big comfy chairs, but the cruise ship look wasnt the only problem. ENT-D had easily the worst bridge layout, space utilization and priorities.

I don't know. There's something to be said for the uncluttered look of 1701-D, as opposed to the over abundance of stations we've seen on some other bridges (I hate to keep railing on 1701-E in this thread, but for me that bridge just had *way* too much stuff going on in it). But I would agree with you that the layout of the Ent-D bridge wasn't ideal. Especially with Tactical and all those rows of information stations being behind the captain, so he needs to stand up and move around the bridge in order to take in what's going on around him.

I used to be quite in favor of the extra stations from Generations, but as time has gone on I've come to wonder if they truly enhanced the bridge, or if instead they just made it feel more cramped than it should be.

 

[vulcan redshirt]

My only real complaint with the decor on the ED was just how bland it is.

OTOH, I do really like the bridge set. Although I do wonder how many filming/onset accidents there were with someone tripping over the end of the horseshoe console.

 

[C.E. Evans]

There might be some romanticized notion that a starship should be as utilitarian and no frills as possible, but after a few years of that, and it starts feeling like a prison. I think having as much comfort as possible on long-term deep-space missions is crucial for keeping up crew morale (and ultimately, crew performance) and is something that Starfleet is aware of. I think it's a different story for ships that aren't meant for lengthy deployments.

I've seen the case made by actual psychologists that bright primary colors and soft warm decorations would be essential to long term space deployments to stop people going crazy. I believe Gene Roddenberry himself said one of his favorite things about the 1701-D was the wooden railing on the bridge, as it gave the crew a connection to nature.

A stark, utilitarian starship design, while it arguably looks "cooler" on a movie screen, would actually accentuate the crew's inner anxieties. I think the 1701-D aesthetic is soothing and would generally be a very pleasant place to both live & work.

Agreed on all points.

Having lots of leisure ability makes for better television because it enables more exploration of the characters having fun.

It's not really a case of the characters having fun as much as allowing the characters to live on a ship as if it's their home.

If we're considering believability against entertainment value, it's more a cost benefit question. Will this extra bulk and energy use be a problem in combat situations?

Doesn't appear to be so, otherwise all starships would be very small (smaller than the Defiant-class, IMO) with correspondingly small crews.

Can we produce two utilitarian ships for the same effort expenditure as we can produce one luxury ship.

Despite claims that the Enterprise-D was a luxury ship, she really wasn't (unless luxury ship is any vessel that isn't little more a sardine can). She was always depicted as being a large multipurpose vessel with a crew that included a civilian contingent. The Enterprise-D seemed to be built on a philosophy of a single big ship being able to do the jobs of several smaller starships. I think a lot of the extra space aboard the ship was reserved for potential missions in which she might have to temporarily carry thousands of extra personnel or evacuees. I don't think the Enterprise-D or any of her sister Galaxy-class ships were really intended to serve as dedicated combat ships, although they could perform as interdiction/combat ships if necessary.

 

[RandyS]

It could have been comfier: Picard could have been sitting in a hot tub with Riker and Troi while ordering Worf to fire phasers.

If Picard was going to sit in a hot tub, I'm pretty sure Riker and Troi wouldn't be around. He'd want Crusher in there with him.

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

Oh I agree! The Enterprise-D had character and looked like a place people would actually be able to work and live in for an extended amount.

In general I don't understand the distaste for the D's "comfortable" design. Why is it so difficult to believe that in 70+ years technology would advance to make things more comfortable? Or that people might not like their quarters painted in traffic light red?

It's not difficult to understand, I suppose. I just don't much care for the "character" involved is all.

The only time that ship ever looked beautiful to me was in Generations, and, well, by then it was too late...

 

[Nebusj]

Having lots of leisure ability makes for better television because it enables more exploration of the characters having fun. If we're considering believability against entertainment value, it's more a cost benefit question. Will this extra bulk and energy use be a problem in combat situations? Can we produce two utilitarian ships for the same effort expenditure as we can produce one luxury ship?

Will two ships of stressed, anxious crew desperate to get out of their plastisteel working jails be of more use than one ship with a crew of high morale and top physical and emotional fitness?

I note (since it's just what happens to be at the front of my mind) the Skylab 4/3 crew was worked to the point of mutiny by people who reasoned they were only going to be on orbit, at great expense, for a very short while and so had to make the most productive use of every single moment of every single day. After the rebellion, and the decision to set working rules in accord with making the crew comfortable, they got to be enormously more productive too. I grant there are several steps to go between this point and the Enterprise D aesthetic, but I do not believe that people are worse off for living and working in pleasant places.

 

[fireproof78]

I personally feel that the absolute best-looking Enterprise interiors were those featured in The Undiscovered Country.

Fun fact: the dinner scene with Gorkon and his contingent, is actually a redressed conference room from TNG.

I prefer the 1701-D aesthetic to the 1701-E aesthetic. The former has warmth and character; the latter feels stark and unfriendly. I know that was kind of the point, 1701-E is a battleship after all. But from a gut feeling I know which one I'd rather serve on.

Oh I agree! The Enterprise-D had character and looked like a place people would actually be able to work and live in for an extended amount.

In general I don't understand the distaste for the D's "comfortable" design. Why is it so difficult to believe that in 70+ years technology would advance to make things more comfortable? Or that people might not like their quarters painted in traffic light red?

The quarters never bothered me, at least from what we saw. I really would have liked seeing more of the junior officers and crewmember quarters, rather than just the senior officers.

I just didn't like the color. Beige is not a comforting color to me, and makes the Bridge feel too big for its purpose.

For me, VOY (of all things) struck the right balance between some comfort, with some utilitarian feeling.

Quarters is one thing, and decorate those how ever it pleases the person. The bridge, and other work rooms, should have a feeling of functionality as well as comfort.

I don't know how to describe it. TNG never felt comfortable to me. The uniforms looked too confining, the bridge felt too big, nothing felt comfortable to me.

 

[T'Girl]

There might be some romanticized notion that a starship should be as utilitarian and no frills as possible, but after a few years of that, and it starts feeling like a prison.

But wouldn't the blandness and uniformity of the ship's decor also be a problem over a protracted time period?

Despite creating a vision of exploration that was comfortable and relaxed...fans seemed to reject the look everytime it was tried.

Comfortable, relaxed, lesurely suggest that what's going on isn't all that important, that there's no emphasis on the (supposedly) significant mission they're undertaking.

The bridge and engineering especially should be serious places, and not the ball pool at Chuck E Cheese.

If Picard was going to sit in a hot tub, I'm pretty sure Riker and Troi wouldn't be around. He'd want Crusher in there with him

Beverly or Wesley?

")

 

[Lance]

I personally feel that the absolute best-looking Enterprise interiors were those featured in The Undiscovered Country.

Fun fact: the dinner scene with Gorkon and his contingent, is actually a redressed conference room from TNG.

All the sets, with the exception of the bridge, are redressed TNG ones (which were, of course, in turn redressed versions of the sets used in the movies). The Undiscovered Country team did an amazing job of disguising the corridors a bit better this time around, after Shatner basically just left the TNG colour scheme in place in The Final Frontier. But the floorplans are still recognisably the same.

 

[Cyke101]

While it's true that bright colors are important for sanity and aesthetic pleasure (Ikea and CB2 being two prime examples), beige is not vibrant

I prefer the 1701-D aesthetic to the 1701-E aesthetic. The former has warmth and character; the latter feels stark and unfriendly. I know that was kind of the point, 1701-E is a battleship after all. But from a gut feeling I know which one I'd rather serve on.

Very much agreed here. The E-E's bridge looks almost non-Starfleet to me sometimes, with the sharp edges, black highlights, and darker gray colors. Throw in some circles and ovals here and there and you just might get a Cardassian bridge.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Compared to the E-D's, the E-E's was an akshun bridge.

 

[Mk_Sn]

I was unaware people ever felt this way about TNG? You said early TNG, did the opinion change about the later seasons? Maybe it's just nostalgia (I'm 25 and one of the first shows I watched was TNG) but I always liked the TNG look. One of the only things I like about Generations is its a big budget movie with the look of TNG. I honestly didn't know people had a problem with the look. To me it still looks properly futuristic. And think of it this way, ENT is very functional and cramped, TOS gets less so and by TNG it's much more luxurious and refined. Seems like advancement over the centuries.

 

[SpocksOddSocks]

^I haven't really heard any complaints about TNG aesthetics either, and I personally loved it. If I had the means, I would probably have a living room kitted out to look similar to the Enterprise D bridge. As things stand, I have to make so with LCARS styled themes on my phone (called tricorder on my router and blutooth settings) and tablet PC (obviously my PADD...wouldn't have bought a Tablet personally, but mine was low spec free from my internet provider).

P.S. my router is Starbase 47, which I'm guessing might be an obvious choice amongst Star Trek fans.

 

[Mk_Sn]

Yeah the Enterprise D is the best Enterprise by far, inside and out. I'm partial to the Enterprise E as well.

 

[C.E. Evans]

There might be some romanticized notion that a starship should be as utilitarian and no frills as possible, but after a few years of that, and it starts feeling like a prison.

But wouldn't the blandness and uniformity of the ship's decor also be a problem over a protracted time period?

That's part of the prison feeling I mentioned above...

 

[BillJ]

I liked the aesthetic just fine. I disliked them going out into the cosmos to tell everyone how great humanity was.

 

[Gotham Central]

I was unaware people ever felt this way about TNG? You said early TNG, did the opinion change about the later seasons? Maybe it's just nostalgia (I'm 25 and one of the first shows I watched was TNG) but I always liked the TNG look. One of the only things I like about Generations is its a big budget movie with the look of TNG. I honestly didn't know people had a problem with the look. To me it still looks properly futuristic. And think of it this way, ENT is very functional and cramped, TOS gets less so and by TNG it's much more luxurious and refined. Seems like advancement over the centuries.

Early TNG had a very specific visual philosophy at work. You saw more plants, wood paneling, earth tones carpeting etc. later seasons of TNG moved away from that. Planters became light boxes and with the exception of the horseshoe rail most of the wood vanished as well. You started getting a lot more grey in the color scheme and more utilitarian look.

 

[USS Triumphant]

Put people crammed together (Archer's Enterprise, maybe), and they're uncomfortable and getting in each other's way - inefficient. Spread them out just a bit (Kirk's Enterprise), and now you've got something going. Spread them out MORE (Ent-D), and now you're back to inefficient, because it takes longer than necessary to get anywhere or do anything.

The extra space in crew quarters and rec areas like Ten Foreward, fine - that makes sense. But the Bridge? No need.

Plus, the whole thing was colored like a hotel. A hotel is *supposed* to be *restful* - it is primarily to sleep in. Places where you're standing an 8 hour watch everyday are not places where you want those restful soothing colors.

And Troi. Those outfits. Captain Jellico - THANK YOU. And her job. I'd have liked it better if she had been more of the political officer kind of "counselor" that she was supposed to be originally.

And then the Galaxy-Class was just UG-lee. Ungainly and top heavy. Bleh. She's grown on me a little since I first saw her, but I don't really think much about how my friends *look*, either - that doesn't mean they got better looking.

I wouldn't call any of this a "TNG aesthetic", though, since I don't remember seeing any of these problems on non-Galaxy-Class ships - every other ship they came across seemed fine. Except the Romulans' haircuts. But that's another issue.

 

[Dukhat]

I never had a problem with the TNG sets. What I did have a problem with initially was the new Starfleet uniforms. It made no sense to me that Starfleet would return to the divisional colors after 100 years of not having them, never mind the uniforms being made out of "futuristic" '80's spandex. Of course, this was all about Roddenberry wanting to distance TNG from the feature films and return to the TOS aesthetic. I just never found it all that believable.