Pretty cool recent article:
http://www.blastr.com/2016-9-21/why-deep-space-nine-will-always-be-my-favorite-star-trek
http://www.blastr.com/2016-9-21/why-deep-space-nine-will-always-be-my-favorite-star-trek
Why Deep Space Nine will always be my favorite Star Trek
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It will always be my favorite, though the other series will entertain me from time to time.
DS9 is my favorite, alongside TNG. They are so different that it's hard to put them in competition. TNG is refined and intellectually superior series to TOS (due to TOS's cultural biases), imo. TNG was the first time the human race and the Federation were able to represent the ideal, progressive civilization. That being said, TNG was still very true to TOS themes of space exploration. Whereas, DS9, being on a stationary space station, was able to delve into issues regarding warfare, fascism racism, religion, et al in a way that isn't seen in any of the other series. I also never imagined that anything could make me love the Ferengi, much less make them one of my favorite parts of the show. DS9 for life!
It's hard for me to agree, even though I sort of do.
For twenty years I was a diehard Trekkie of the adventures of a Kirk, Spock and McCoy. TNG was kind of boring, but DS9 quickly became my favourite of the modern take of Trek. I'm rewatching it now for the first time since the early 2000's and it is so darn good. Such a great cast of primary and secondary characters. I think it'll endure more than the other shows--besides the original, of course. And it paved the way for BSG.
For twenty years I was a diehard Trekkie of the adventures of a Kirk, Spock and McCoy. TNG was kind of boring, but DS9 quickly became my favourite of the modern take of Trek. I'm rewatching it now for the first time since the early 2000's and it is so darn good. Such a great cast of primary and secondary characters. I think it'll endure more than the other shows--besides the original, of course. And it paved the way for BSG.
Somehow DS9 seems like the more realistic, down to Earth of all the series. I like that. Of course the first season is shit, but I like it anyway.
Eh, There's a lot to like about DS9 and a lot that ruins it for me.
My opinions:
The Bad:
My best-of list, with *** being my favorite episodes.
01 "Emissary" ***
02 "Paradise"
02 "Blood Oath"
03 "Meridian"
04 "Explorers"
05 "The Visitor" ***
06 "Little Green Men"
07 "Homefront"
08 "Accession"
09 "Hard Time"
10 "Apocalypse Rising"
11 "Trials and Tribble-ations" ***
12 "Rapture"
13 "Children of Time"
14 "Call to Arms"
15 "In the Pale Moonlight" ***
16 "The Reckoning"
17 "Time's Orphan" ***
18 "Tears of the Prophets"
19 "Image in the Sand"
20 "What You Leave Behind" ***
My opinions:
The Bad:
- The first three years were terrible. The majority of the stories were sub-par.
- The Doctor is a perfect storm: BY FAR the most annoying, the worst written and most poorly acted character in any ST. The actor is hard to look at, he can't act and his constant whining "Kahmandah" in that accent makes me reach for the fast forward button every time he's on the screen for more than a few seconds. I i dislike this character so much, I skip episodes where he plays a prominent role. He's sour and he thinks he's far more moral and generally better than everyone else. I guess it explains why they eventually had to make him artificially "better" than everyone else.
- Odo is an unlikable one-dimensional character. At least 90% of the time. He seems to dislike everyone he comes in contact with. The only time I could stand him is early on, when he seemed to have a tiny affection for Quark. He thinks he's better than everyone else. He's self-serving, needy, and a traitor, even to his own kind.
- Kira is an unlikable one-dimensional character, a non-stop broken record of occupation this and occupation that. At least 60% of the time, to be fair. Another character who seems to be filled with hate for everyone she comes in contact with. Its no surprise that she and the sour Odo found each other.
- Vic Fontaine. I mean really? This whole nauseating plot line gets skipped on re-watch. The character is ridiculous, as are the other character's interests in the whole farce.
- Kassidy Yates: I loved Penny Johnson in The Larry Sanders Show. Here she does not play the part well, I think the part of Kassidy Yates was entirely miscast. Depending on my mood I may or may not fast forward when she's on screen for too long.
- The Bajorans: What a G-D whiny race of pathetic, inferior people. They were obviously intended to be portrayed as a deeply artistic, spiritual, and peaceful race, but those things were said but never shown. The spiritual leaders were greedy opportunists, the people whiny, self-serving and hostile with more than their fair share of all-about-me weirdos and fanatics.
- Worf. The show started to gain momentum when he joined. A testament to how dull and one-dimensional the original characters are.
- The Dominion War: The show had no direction, this gave it one. Although the Cardassians "joining" the Dominion made little sense to me from what I know of the Cardassians.
- The whole "Emissary of the Prophets" plot thread throughout the series. I enjoyed all the episodes that explored this. One thing that bothered me though: Sisko was obviously the Emissary, he was obviously in contact with the Prophets, he obviously had multiple visions, and there were the orbs given to Bajor by the prophets... So when one of the characters said that they "didn't believe in the Prophets" it seemed forced and stupid. The existence of beings living in the wormhole that became part of Bajoran life and culture through prophecies and visions was an obvious fact. Disbelief was irrelevant and an obvious writer's device.
- How the 'Emissary' plot thread was ultimately resolved.
My best-of list, with *** being my favorite episodes.
01 "Emissary" ***
02 "Paradise"
02 "Blood Oath"
03 "Meridian"
04 "Explorers"
05 "The Visitor" ***
06 "Little Green Men"
07 "Homefront"
08 "Accession"
09 "Hard Time"
10 "Apocalypse Rising"
11 "Trials and Tribble-ations" ***
12 "Rapture"
13 "Children of Time"
14 "Call to Arms"
15 "In the Pale Moonlight" ***
16 "The Reckoning"
17 "Time's Orphan" ***
18 "Tears of the Prophets"
19 "Image in the Sand"
20 "What You Leave Behind" ***
M
marlboro
Guest
Yeah, it's my favorite series too. Great stories, and well developed characters.
It's my favorite after TOS. I think the stationary setting gave them so much more to work with and gave some ideas that worked less well in TNG a chance to shine. Like the Sisko family (vs Wesley Crusher), and most interaction between Starfleet and non-Starfleet characters.
And I love the Bajorans. It's good to see religion explored in sci fi in a complex way. Though I do have to wonder how the Bajorans got to be so culturally and religiously uniform, but then you could probably ask that about most aliens in all sci fi ever not even just Star Trek.
And I love the Bajorans. It's good to see religion explored in sci fi in a complex way. Though I do have to wonder how the Bajorans got to be so culturally and religiously uniform, but then you could probably ask that about most aliens in all sci fi ever not even just Star Trek.
DS9 is Star Trek at its best for me, but Voyager isn't far behind. It also doesn't hurt that both shows are just great Sci-Fi in general and can be easily enjoyed by people who don't like Star Trek... especially if you're not watching Voyager episodically, but in its proper and intended order.
Character-wise, the show has the best ensemble in the Star Trek franchise (narrowly beating out Voyager), and also built up the best recurring character gallery not just in the Star Trek franchise, but in Sci-Fi in general (it even narrowly beats out Babylon 5 in that regard [which is saying something because Babylon 5 has an incredibly rich recurring character gallery]).
I have to disagree with the comment that the show's "first season is shit", though. The character development makes every episode in Season 1 important, entertaining, and interesting in some way, even the silly stuff like Move Along Home and Q-Less (which is great because it foreshadows the direction that Q's character will be taken in during his appearances on Voyager).
Character-wise, the show has the best ensemble in the Star Trek franchise (narrowly beating out Voyager), and also built up the best recurring character gallery not just in the Star Trek franchise, but in Sci-Fi in general (it even narrowly beats out Babylon 5 in that regard [which is saying something because Babylon 5 has an incredibly rich recurring character gallery]).
I have to disagree with the comment that the show's "first season is shit", though. The character development makes every episode in Season 1 important, entertaining, and interesting in some way, even the silly stuff like Move Along Home and Q-Less (which is great because it foreshadows the direction that Q's character will be taken in during his appearances on Voyager).
I still love DS9 the most of all of trek.
However, I had an experience this year that made me doubt whether this is really because it agrees with me most, or perhaps also because I happened to be watching it in the 'right' phase of my life.
I'd finally gotten around to watching Babylon 5, because I'd read in so many instances that this was a show comparable to or some say, even better than DS9. And I find that after watching the first 4 seasons and most of season 5, I kind of like it, but it never engrosses me quite the way DS9 did. I keep thinking stuff like 'nice, but a tad too melodramatic', 'it's just not probable that in such a setting, characters would really act like this', the high minded idealism and "deep" quotes from the main players that make me wonder whether, and if so, how exactly such characters could actually make these "deep truths" and ideals work in their own lifes despite what we're shown on the screen, and such.
Strange thing is though that I think I would have totally gone for this show, had I seen it at the supposedly more impressionable age at which I first saw DS9 (which was in my early twenties, in my forties now), because I can see a lot of similarities with DS9. I suppose I have become a bit more cynical (my cynical side would call it 'realistic') over the decades.
So this makes me wonder: suppose I would only now have gotten around to seeing DS9, would I have liked it as much as I do now, or is part of my liking DS9 so much a matter of habit ?
However, I had an experience this year that made me doubt whether this is really because it agrees with me most, or perhaps also because I happened to be watching it in the 'right' phase of my life.
I'd finally gotten around to watching Babylon 5, because I'd read in so many instances that this was a show comparable to or some say, even better than DS9. And I find that after watching the first 4 seasons and most of season 5, I kind of like it, but it never engrosses me quite the way DS9 did. I keep thinking stuff like 'nice, but a tad too melodramatic', 'it's just not probable that in such a setting, characters would really act like this', the high minded idealism and "deep" quotes from the main players that make me wonder whether, and if so, how exactly such characters could actually make these "deep truths" and ideals work in their own lifes despite what we're shown on the screen, and such.
Strange thing is though that I think I would have totally gone for this show, had I seen it at the supposedly more impressionable age at which I first saw DS9 (which was in my early twenties, in my forties now), because I can see a lot of similarities with DS9. I suppose I have become a bit more cynical (my cynical side would call it 'realistic') over the decades.
So this makes me wonder: suppose I would only now have gotten around to seeing DS9, would I have liked it as much as I do now, or is part of my liking DS9 so much a matter of habit ?
Yep.
I think DS9 is the best and it is the one I watch/rewatch the most (though TNG was the series that first really caught me, so I still hold it as my favorite).
jmidnight, I was wondering how our views could differ so much, then I read the following entries on your list:
This just reinforces to me that you can always find a person holding any given opinion about anything. IDIC and all.
jmidnight, I was wondering how our views could differ so much, then I read the following entries on your list:
This just reinforces to me that you can always find a person holding any given opinion about anything. IDIC and all.
TNG is nearest/dearest to me, but DS9 was the best IMHO and easily wins the most improved award from its rocky start in comparison to TNG's and Voyager's, thanks in no small part to Ira Behr. It is a testament to what a production team and actors can accomplish without management oversight.
Anyone thinking that Rick Berman wasn't involved in the decision making process on DS9 is kidding themselves. And I don't know why? Berman proved to be a more than capable producer.
In the shows favor, I would recommend that "Homefront"/"Paradise Lost" be shown to school kids about the dangers of overreacting to threats.
Looking at various interviews done over the years, it's clear that while Berman was involved in many decisions, he did not have the kind of control he wanted, and that Behr and the writers either kept Berman and the studio in the dark or made it impossible to deny their requests.
I don't buy that for a minute. If Behr was presenting that kind of problem, the studio would've came in and fired him. They don't hand out millions of dollars per episode with zero control of the situation. That simply isn't how business works.
No, DS9 slipped slightly below the studio's radar. They were happy that there was a (somewhat) stable audience for DS9, but concentrated on Voyager, as it was the network's priority. They did care about things that might affect second-run syndication, but generally were happy if the ship stayed afloat. We know from Berman himself that the studio wanted no Dominion War, Berman himself wanted four episodes, but Behr ended up with six that did not even end the war. We know Berman wanted six episode to end the series, Behr won eight, but finagled ten. We know that Berman supported Behr in allowing Sisko's look to change. We know Berman supported the studio in introducing Worf to the series. These were the big decisions. Get into the mundane--especially those things the guardian of Roddenberry's legacy should care about--and Behr often got his war. In terms of story it was achieved by introducing minor elements into scripts that could be exploited down the road, but that did not appear like serialization up front.
Now, you keep trying to make it seem that we who make these observations are trying to describe the series as being in revolt against the studio and Berman. You are grossly exaggerating.
