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Why British actor for French-descened captain?

plynch

Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
I don't stray in this forum much. So if this has been threaded before, just point me there.

Is there ANY logic behind a British-inflected actor playing a French captain?

Sometimes in Trek people have English accents (Chekov, Scotty, Argyle, Bashir), but they seem to make sense relative to the character's background or apparent ethnicity.

If the answer is simply that the producers liked Stewart as an actor, that's fine. But it's kind of bugging me. Picard plays up his Frenchness. Why not a hire an equally good actor with a) no accent or b) a French accent?

Just asking.
 
If the answer is simply that the producers liked Stewart as an actor, that's fine. But it's kind of bugging me. Picard plays up his Frenchness. Why not a hire an equally good actor with a) no accent or b) a French accent?

There's no such thing, for the record.
 
During World War III, Britain conquered France, and completely assimilated its culture. That's why they hired a British actor.
 
Chekov? Scotty? English accents?

But anyway, I think know what you mean. From what I understand, TPTB originally wanted a French accent, but once they hired Stewart...well, come on. Nobody in his right mind would hire a guy with a FABULOUS voice like that and have him cover it up with a phony accent. That's what I think, anyway.

My own in-universe explanation goes something like this: There are in the world today many different English accents (different American accents, different U.K. accents, Australian accents, Canadian accents, etc., etc., etc.) So why wouldn't there be at least some different accents in the future, even if everybody speaks one language? For example, somebody taught English in India or Hong Kong speaks it with a strong or at least slight British accent (or what sounds like a British accent to my American ears). So why wouldn't somebody taught English in Europe speak it with a different accent than, say, Riker or Crusher? Makes sense to me.

Oh, and Canadave is of course absolutely right about there not being any such thing as "no accent." Everybody has an accent.
 
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Well, I think Gérard Depardieu would have been a good choice for Picard, but...
This is standard Star Trek practice really, isn't it? Apparently Uhura and Geordi were supposed to be from Africa, but they still had American accents. Hell, Kirk was supposed to be American, but he was played by a Canadian. I'd have liked for everyone to have different accents (especially the aliens), but this seems not to be the way it goes on Trek. And in other sci-fi for that matter. God only knows what was up with Deanna Troi's accent though...
 
We've been round this circuit before. Many many French people speak English with an English accent because that's where they learned it.
 
Pemmer Harge said:
God only knows what was up with Deanna Troi's accent though...

From what I understand, poor Marina (who was raised in the U.K.) was given the impression that she needed to come up with a Betazoid accent, so she used elements of her own parents' Greek accent to create Troi's accent. Then, of course, no other Betazoid, including Troi's own mother, had an accent anything like hers at all. I can't remember anything other than generic American, though I could be forgetting something.

So it was just one of those things that Trek dropped the ball on. Wish they'd just let her gradually drop the sorta Greek accent, but oh, well...
 
I would have loved it if Uhura had an English/South African accent. Then again, 40 years ago South Africa was a completely different entity altogether...

Ah well. These days, my big gripe is: why doesn't Riker sound like Sarah Palin? :)
 
For the record, I thought the Chekov and Scotty comment was funny too. It's even funnier when people say Scotty had a Scottish accent.
 
If the answer is simply that the producers liked Stewart as an actor, that's fine. But it's kind of bugging me. Picard plays up his Frenchness. Why not a hire an equally good actor with a) no accent or b) a French accent?

There's no such thing, for the record.
I find it funny that people don't understand that, too. :wtf:

I wonder what is the accent that the OP calls "no accent"? Standard American?

There's absolurely no reason why a person whose first language is not English but who has learned English perfectly would speak with a foreign accent. In fact, it would be quite insulting to suggest that no Frenchman could ever master English so well that no trace of French accent could be heard in his speech.

When a person is learning English as a second language, they will naturally adopt one existing accent or another, or a mix of them if they are exposed to more than one. If they have learned English by living among people who speak the language, they will emulate the accent of the environment. If they have learned it in school, they will most likely be taught to speak in one or two accents that are accepted in schools as "standard English". Until very recently, this was always only RP (Received Pronounciation/Queen's English/Oxford English), the 'standard' version of British English. Nowadays its status in schools and universities is shared by standard American English, called General American. Students are rarely taught to speak in any other accents, though they may be taught to be able to differentiate between them and to understand them. (It may be different if one of your teachers at the university is a native speaker with a specific regional accent, but I don't know how often this happens.) Finally, if you don't live in a country where English is the first language, but you are exposed to the English language all the time - via film, TV (in the countries that use subtitles instead of dubbing), music, cable and TV channels, etc., you might also end up speaking in a mix of different accents. I suspect that this is my case, my English accent is probably a mix of different American and British accents I've been exposed to, although mostly the 'standard' ones that I was taught at the university.

We don't know what the standard accents will be in 24th century, but as someone who speaks English as a second language exceptionally well, it is not aty all surprising, and actually quite likely he would speak in one of the standard accents of the English language. So why not the standard British accent? Would you be complaining if he had an American accent?
 
North American bland standard.

Maybe it's a case of cultural relativism, but I always thought of the North-American variety of English as being rather exotic, compared to some of our British offerings!
 
I find it funny that people don't understand that, too. :wtf:

I wonder what is the accent that the OP calls "no accent"? Standard American?

There's absolurely no reason why a person whose first language is not English but who has learned English perfectly would speak with a foreign accent. In fact, it would be quite insulting to suggest that no Frenchman could ever master English so well that no trace of French accent could be heard in his speech.

Sorry not to multiquote you; I didn't see your response in time.

A. I didn't think I was complaining. But if Picard spoke in North American dull standard, we North Americans would accept that since that is so common. And has precedence in the Trek universe. Sulu, Uhura, McCoy when not drinking, many aliens, etc.

B. Of course someone could learn British English perfectly. I know business people now try to eradicate their accents and sound American so as not to stand out vocally to us world-domineers. (However, all foreign-born speakers of English I've ever heard personally still retained a distinctive "foreign" accent to their English. I've had foreign exchange students even ask me how their accent was, in fact, since they can't really hear it.)

It just seems odd that they play up his French-ness and he has a very British accent. (Esp. since some of his relatives have French accents IIRC.) Not complaining. Just saying. No offense intended.
 
Plynch said:
It just seems odd that they play up his French-ness and he has a very British accent. (Esp. since some of his relatives have French accents IIRC.) Not complaining. Just saying. No offense intended.

His grandmother does - his brother and his brother's family, however, does not. They have British accents, in fact.

I've usually assumed that that's supposed to be an age thing rather than a French thing. I mean, maybe English was Picard's grandmother's second language, and that's why she has an accent, but by the time the Picard boys were growing up, English had truly become a universal language. Either that or they grew up speaking both interchangeably.

I think you're missing something - or maybe I'm assuming ahead of the data. I don't think so, but let's see: I don't think English was Picard's second language, i.e., I don't think he learned French and then English. I think there is one main language that everybody on Earth speaks (and that for convenience's sake we and TPTB refer to as "English"), and then maybe some of them know other languages as well. So there's no reason for Picard to speak with a "French" accent since he would have learned English as he grew up (and presumably French as well), just as those of us whose first language is English did. He would therefore have whatever accent those who taught him to speak would have, and why wouldn't that be people who speak British-style English instead of American- or Australian- or whatever-style English?

And BTW, I have known people who learned to speak English as their second language with no discernable accent. Not many, but some.

And I've known many completely bi-lingual people - that is people who grew up speaking two languages - who have no discernable "foreign" accent. If you learn it as a little kid, this is in fact the way it usually is, in my experience.
 
^ Reminds me of that quote from the simpsons

Moe: British eh? Well we saved your asses in world war 2
British Guy: Yes but we saved your arses in world war 3
Moe: That's very true
 
I think there is one main language that everybody on Earth speaks (and that for convenience's sake we and TPTB refer to as "English"), and then maybe some of them know other languages as well. So there's no reason for Picard to speak with a "French" accent since he would have learned English as he grew up (and presumably French as well).

I would assume one common tongue by 23rd c. Yet we have Chekov, Scotty, Chief O'Brian who somehow learned that common tongue with an accent. Maybe I just want things in a commercial tv show to be consistent. A fool's errand.

And BTW, I have known people who learned to speak English as their second language with no discernable accent. Not many, but some.

I believe you (both) that they're out there, as I have read in other sources, but I simply have never met such non-accented English speaking folks. IDIC is more interesting than everyone sounding like a network news anchor anyway.

Time for bed. Be well, all.
 
That always bugged me as a kid as well. All the aforementioned reasons are plausible, for sure. I would have to assume that he was raised speaking English as well as French. That would account for the lack of a French accent, but not accounting for the presence of the British one. Perhaps one of his parents learned English in the UK and so taught him that brand of the language?

I speak French fairly well, and I was taught it by a Cantonese speaking teacher, so I probably speak French with a Chinese/Canadian English accent.

Accents are funny things. I would have liked to have Patrick Stewart perform in a French accent, but whatever.
 
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