Why 9?

[at Quark's]

Come to think of it, what does the designation 'deep space' even mean exactly in this context?

It's most definitely not in deep space after all, it's in orbit of Bajor (at least, originally, but it's already been assigned the name DS9 by that time ). Does it mean something like 'remote outpost of the Federation'?

 

[Christopher]

Come to think of it, what does the designation 'deep space' even mean exactly in this context?

It's most definitely not in deep space after all, it's in orbit of Bajor (at least, originally, but it's already been assigned the name DS9 by that time ). Does it mean something like 'remote outpost of the Federation'?

Yes, like Deep Space Station K-7 in "Tribbles," which was on the Federation frontier with the Klingons (hence the K). The Deep Space stations are the ones significantly past the Federation borders.

Although now that I think about it, that doesn't make sense, because that's what starbases in general are -- frontier outposts well past the UFP borders, as support for explorer ships and colonies out on the frontier. In that context, I suppose Deep Space stations would be the ones on the outer fringes of the exploration zone, maybe, but then that designation would change over time as the frontier expanded.

Ultimately it doesn't really make sense, since it's just something Berman (or someone) tossed out on a whim, that nobody really liked, but that nobody ever thought of a replacement for.


EDIT: Come to think of it, though, K-7 was a civilian station, wasn't it? It was run by Mr. Lurry, not by a Starfleet commodore or admiral like a starbase would be. So maybe "Deep Space Station" is a designation for civilian-run Federation outposts well past the UFP borders. DS9 had a Starfleet commander, but it was officially a Bajoran-owned station, so technically it wasn't a Starfleet base, and maybe that's why it got the DS designation.

 

[Michael]

But that contradicts what Making of said about Rick Berman coming up with the name.

Possibly, but not necessarily. I guess both could be accurate accounts: Berman could have come up with it, inspired by Piller‘s baseball obsession. But yes, I agree, the baselball anecdote feels like something that could have developed as a seemingly plausible myth after the fact.

(Also, "on a baseball pitch?" Whoever wrote that must have been British, since we don't call it that in America.)

Yes, that seems very likely. Ben Robinson, the main editor of this, is from the UK, as is Eaglemoss, the now defunct publisher that released this book.

 

[hbquikcomjamesl]

Yeah, IIRC it was in Making of that they said it was just a placeholder title someone threw out, expecting it to be temporary until they came up with something better, but they just got into the habit of using it and it stuck.

Some others here might have a working familiarity with the San Diego Zoo, and with its back-country facility, the San Diego Zoo Safari Park (originally the San Diego Wild Animal Park).

For the first 35 years, the Park operated a nearly-silent electric tramway (powered and guided by a rail, but running on the roadway) around the field enclosures, called the WGASA Bush Line. The story goes that in a meeting about this system, while they were trying to come up with a catchy name, the chief designer wrote WGASA, as an acronym for "Who Gives A Shit Anyway," and passed it around. It looked and sounded enough like an actual Swahili word (although it was never misrepresented as such) that the name stuck, and was eventually backronymed as "World’s Greatest Animal Show Anywhere."

Be careful what you choose as working titles. They sometimes stick.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

Hey, if you can redeem it, though...

I wonder if Empok Nor ever becomes Deep Space ____, once all the bugs are worked out?

Speaking of working titles:

Working title

This is a list of all Star Trek productions that had working titles prior to the names that were ultimately chosen. Star Trek: Phase II (Star Trek II) Star Trek: The Next Generation (Star Trek: A New Beginning, Star Trek: The Next Adventure, Star Trek: The New Generation, Star Trek: The Second...

memory-alpha.fandom.com

 

[Tosk]

Which was originally spelled Terek Nor, but Marc Alaimo mispronounced it, so they officially changed it to Terok Nor to match how he said it.

Where does that anecdote come from?

I ask because I don't see how it can be true.

1. The pronunciation guide in the script for Cardassians says 'TAIR-awk nor' and spells the name Terok Nor.
2. Dukat is not the first person to say Terok Nor in the episode.
3. Dukat is not even the first person to say Terok Nor in the scene where he says it.

Obviously, I understand that episodes are shot out of order but it seems hard to imagine that Dukat's single use of the name was shot before everything else, especially as Bashir says it in both the line before Dukat's and the line after.

 

[Christopher]

Where does that anecdote come from?

It's my own firsthand experience. I saw it spelled that way in more than one early publication, though I don't recall which ones offhand. Quite possibly in the Malibu DS9 comics or the early novels. Though I think I saw the spelling in print before it was uttered onscreen, probably in some magazine article or reference book, which is why I figured the actor mispronounced it.

I ask because I don't see how it can be true.

1. The pronunciation guide in the script for Cardassians says 'TAIR-awk nor' and spells the name Terok Nor.

All right, maybe I drew the wrong conclusion. Perhaps it was misspelled in the style guide used by licensees.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

By the 32nd century, they had gotten up to 253.

Deep Space 253

Deep Space 253 was a Federation space station located in a remote region of space. Following the Burn in the late 31st century, DS253 was functionally cut off from the remnants of the Federation and had not received a visit from Federation Headquarters since 3102. However, it had been trading...

memory-alpha.fandom.com

 

[Tosk]

Though I think I saw the spelling in print before it was uttered onscreen, probably in some magazine article or reference book, which is why I figured the actor mispronounced it.

Yeah, I've definitely noticed it misspelt on official merch at least once, on the DS9 cutaway poster.

But I still wonder why you chose Alaimo for your assumption when he wasn't the first to say it.

 

[NCC-73515]

Production people and actors refer to it as just "Deep Space", no number, as well

 

[C.E. Evans]

Come to think of it, what does the designation 'deep space' even mean exactly in this context?

It's most definitely not in deep space after all, it's in orbit of Bajor (at least, originally, but it's already been assigned the name DS9 by that time ). Does it mean something like 'remote outpost of the Federation'?

I like to think that "Deep Space" stations are Starfleet-run facilities that are initially established outside of Federation territory and/or in conjunction with a non-Federation government. Over time, some or even most of these stations may eventually end up in Federation territory due to expansion, but they keep the Deep Space designations afterward.

 

[Paul Weaver]

This article suggests Starbase 362 was originally used, presumably from the mentioned book The Making of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine by Reeves/Stevens. I haven't read that book.

Producers didn’t like the title of Deep Space Nine

Producers didn't like the title of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, and it was originally known as Star Trek: Starbase 362 in producftion

redshirtsalwaysdie.com

 

[Christopher]

But I still wonder why you chose Alaimo for your assumption when he wasn't the first to say it.

I guess I just misremembered.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

I suppose giving them numbers makes sense when there's so many of them, but you'd think significantly located ones would get a name.

An alternate naming convention for Deep Space Stations, would be naming them after remote islands.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Although now that I think about it, that doesn't make sense, because that's what starbases in general are -- frontier outposts well past the UFP borders, as support for explorer ships and colonies out on the frontier.

I never got the impression that starbases in general were "frontier outposts well past the UFP borders." I thought that, being operated by Starfleet, starbases were generally inside Federation borders; how else could supply lines and the bases themselves be defended otherwise?

In contrast, the outpost on Cestus III was called simply a colony or an outpost, in space that Spock admitted in "Arena" that the Federation knew very little about.

What examples are there of starbases that are not inside Federation borders?

 

[Bad Thoughts]

It stuck because Herb Rossoff thought it was an intriguing title.

(This answer is canon.)

 

[mithril]

I wonder if Empok Nor ever becomes Deep Space ____, once all the bugs are worked out?

probably not.. it's in a system with no real importance, and no worlds to support it.
in the novel continuity though, Nog (as chief of engineering on DS9) has Empok Nor towed into the bajoran system and parked in orbit of one of the gas giant's moons, to use as a spare parts depot for DS9. though that only happens after DS9 loses its entire fusion power module due to plot reasons in another story, and they had to run off yet another group of squatters that had taken over Empok Nor while going there to salvage Empok Nor's power module to replace DS9's.

 

[Christopher]

Come to think of it, does the existence of a Terok Nor imply the existence of a Terok Neither?

 

[Space Socialist]

Hear me out, but I actually think that the title “Deep Space Nine” hobbled the series and restricted its audience appeal. It just sounds offputtingly dorky. “Deep Space” and a number, I mean seriously; it sounds like a 1950s B-movie. And Deep Space, seriously, what a snoozer. Needed something like, I don’t know “Star Trek: New Frontier”, which is admittedly not amazing either, but at least isn’t as nerdy. Words suggesting a narrative, not cosmology and integers, basically.

Yes, I’m serious. As someone whose favourite Trek series is DS9, I genuinely believe it’d have been successful with a better, snappier title.

(I also think “Starbase 362” is at least as bad a title, FWIW.)

 

[Christopher]

Hear me out, but I actually think that the title “Deep Space Nine” hobbled the series and restricted its audience appeal. It just sounds offputtingly dorky.

And "Star Trek" doesn't? We don't think about it because we hear it so often that it just becomes a sound, but Star Trek is a very awkward and strange title. "Trek" isn't a word people use much, except when talking about South African history or mountain bikes.

I've often thought that Galaxy Quest would've been a better, more elegant title for the serious space exploration show and Star Trek would've been a better title for the goofy parody movie.

And Deep Space, seriously, what a snoozer.

I feel the opposite. To me, "deep space" implies a sense of wonder and peril -- not just wading in the shallows of space, but plunging into the deep, dark unknown, immersing yourself in the mystery.

Needed something like, I don’t know “Star Trek: New Frontier”, which is admittedly not amazing either, but at least isn’t as nerdy. Words suggesting a narrative, not cosmology and integers, basically.

I don't see why you think Star is any less suggestive of cosmology than Space -- and if you find the thought of cosmology dull, then we exist in very different conceptual realms. Who is Star Trek meant for if not those of us who are excited by space?

For that matter, who is Star Trek for if not those of us who see nerdiness as a positive? Spock and Data are the ultimate science nerds. Scotty and Geordi are engineering nerds. Picard is an archaeology nerd, Sisko is a baseball nerd, O'Brien and Bashir are gamer nerds, etc. Boimler and Mariner are Star Trek nerds inside the Star Trek universe.

And if you find space so dull, why is it in your username?