I accidentally a word. I meant their minds, meaning bigots.
'White genocide in space': Racist "fans" seething at racial diversity in Discovery...
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So many posts to “like” in this thread! Thanks to all the level headed and eloquent Star Trek fans. I'm so glad you guys make up the majority around here.
This very topic has bothered me for a few days, too, since I saw a few disheartening posts on a German Star Trek site. I just can't get behind racist/supremacist/sexist people who claim they are Star Trek fans. To be perfectly frank, I'm at a loss how to deal with them.
This very topic has bothered me for a few days, too, since I saw a few disheartening posts on a German Star Trek site. I just can't get behind racist/supremacist/sexist people who claim they are Star Trek fans. To be perfectly frank, I'm at a loss how to deal with them.
But that would be an easy answer, wouldn't it? I think the truth is that they are actually Star Trek fans.
Yes, that's my experience, too. People enjoy the show for many different reasons. Some even for rather questionable ones.
But... How what I said could apply for both sides ?
You may correct me if I'm wrong, I may not be understanding what you just said, but these two sides that you refer to are Marginalized Folks vs Racist People, right ?
I mean, yeah... Racists can be coerced. Maybe by the establishment, maybe through social action. Either way, why they are being coerced and what stops happening when they are coerced have totally different dimensions of what happens when marginalized groups are coerced instead.
When you coerce a Racist to not be Racist you are preventing them from harming people. When you coerce someone from an Ethnic group for them to not have the same privileges as everyone, the person doing the harm is you...
Again, you might have to expand into that... Because you probably meant something else.
My point was simply that once a person's opinion expand into the realm of physical influence they are not longer just opinions but actions. It is impossible to have a violent opinion, becasue opinions cannot cause physical harm.
Of course, people vote based on their opinions, and the people put into power by those opinions can indeed carry out violence based on them. And that's just one example.
The line between opinion and action isn't as clearly-defined as you think it is.
But opinions can't be artificially separated like that, they are part of an organic process from ideological violence, to rhetorical violence, to physical violence. One year you're hating in your head, the next you're making speeches about it and the next you're building gas chambers.
Discerning peoples thoughts is quite Orwellian - but of course the ends justifies the means.
As is the case with any bodies of fiction that are the result of thousands of creative inputs over decades of time, there is a way to tease out support in Star Trek for almost any political viewpoint.
Not remotely, on either point. I'm not making any point about law or state action, only about the connections between human thought, speech and action.
I never said opinions weren't more complex. I just said that having an opinion doesn't necessarily result in gas chamber construction. I don't know about you but if I dislike someone, I'm still capable of keeping my personal feelings aside and working professionally with them.
What I fear is that you are advocating that we outlaw all but Approved Opinions. Because first, just how do you plan on enforcing such laws? And second who gets to decide what the Approved Opinions are?
Yes, I figure we've all meandered pretty far at this point. I'm going to step out for a while.
Peace!
There's no one right way for everyone. Divorce isn't necessarily a bad thing. If two people can mutually agree to get married, then they should also be free to grow and mutually agree to become un-married if they wish. Divorce is only a problem because of the conservative stigma (is that a redundancy?) associated with it.
And how ironic that is...
DS9 has so many episodes that would anger a lot of the folks who believe in BS like "white genocide". The one where Nog forms a Union and strikes with the workers of Quark's bar, the several ones where Kira's actions in the Bajoran War were justified, that one where Sisko says he hates 60s Vegas because of the racism that dominated the period... Not to mention Ferengis like Quark and the Grand Nagus that act like a parody of people who hate the Welfare State.
If aired today, DS9 would receive a lot of hate from the reactionary crowd. God, I hope Discovery manages to bother these people even more.
Yeah, this is really sad that Star Trek fans would behave in this manner
Please feel free to leave them a dislike.
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And Abrams is sexist.
These videos make me sad, ill, and angry. Star Trek fans or not, it's just sad that there are pathetic human beings like these. There's no room in my life for these sorts of people.
Star Trek has always pushed buttons in its audience. I don't quite understand why this any different, other than we have such instant access to the fallout. I remember when Janeway was made Captain. If you see the auditions the producers did allow men to audition without ever really wanting a man in the role. Tough luck. However when Voyager was screened it was complete nonsense that Kate Mulgrew was going to be walking around as Janeway doing anything other than being the.. Captain. She wasn't walking around wearing a placard for women's rights she WAS that, with her rights not replacing a males or bringing him down, she just had the same ones. I know this might be controversial but I actually felt her femaleness made for the right Captain for the struggle Voyager had. I do think we should be equal but I think there are still differences in us. Janeway was enhanced by being all things she was. Her skills, her experiences, her crew and her gender. Yes a male Captain is no lesser but the journey and story would have been different.
Star Trek does its best work when it shows its effort for equality as being an accepted part of the system. So if these new characters in Discovery just get on with their jobs that is all that should matter. It's going to come down to grabbing the audience's imagination, that's what I'd be more worried about. And the integrity of the Klingons.. lol.
Star Trek does its best work when it shows its effort for equality as being an accepted part of the system. So if these new characters in Discovery just get on with their jobs that is all that should matter. It's going to come down to grabbing the audience's imagination, that's what I'd be more worried about. And the integrity of the Klingons.. lol.
You mean to say you never have had your mind or opinion changed when presented with facts or appealed to on the basis of compassion or emotion? You have never engaged in a discussion or series of discussions and come away with a different point of view than before the discussion?
Are you saying it is impossible to win hearts and influence minds?
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