Which was Kes' actual timeline?
- Thread starter bbjeg
- Start date
Deadlock had nothing to do with Timetravel.
You forgot about the timeline where she's on Voyager when it explodes into the 29th century.
You forgot about the timeline where she's on Voyager when it explodes into the 29th century.
The last time we see her, she had at least two lifetimes. In the timeline where she has a kid with Tom (IIRC) doesn't she grow old and die, in which that condition she had sent her back in time, where she never got the condition at all? I imagine that was her original timeline. Everything after that episode would be an alternate reality.
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I think the timeline where she wakes in a distant future time and is recently an old lady was dismissed. Essentially, Voyager died when Capt Janeway rammed it into Annorax's timeship.
'Fury' did happen, however, and that is Kes in her shuttle returning to her home. When Ocampa engineers witness her mileage gauge some questions will be in order.
'Fury' did happen, however, and that is Kes in her shuttle returning to her home. When Ocampa engineers witness her mileage gauge some questions will be in order.
Kes left Voyager because 8472 supercharged her powers making her toxic to Voyager, Because the Borg were more advanced than they should be that they can suddenly open rifts into fluidic space.
Sure you can attest that Annorax did or did not remove the Borg form the Delta Quadrant, but that would have radically changed the make up of Voyager considering Zeven of Nine was or was not along for the ride in season 4.
The most llikely reason that the Borg are stronger than they used to be is that the Queen in 2063, or a hundred years later those drones from ENT Regeneration, got word to, or back to Borg space and supercharged the Collective.
Um.
If the old Kes' corpse was in the cargo bay during Futures End... Wouldn't that have stumped and confused Captain Braxton, since it would prove that Voyager has at least more than one future open to it?
Sure you can attest that Annorax did or did not remove the Borg form the Delta Quadrant, but that would have radically changed the make up of Voyager considering Zeven of Nine was or was not along for the ride in season 4.
The most llikely reason that the Borg are stronger than they used to be is that the Queen in 2063, or a hundred years later those drones from ENT Regeneration, got word to, or back to Borg space and supercharged the Collective.
Um.
If the old Kes' corpse was in the cargo bay during Futures End... Wouldn't that have stumped and confused Captain Braxton, since it would prove that Voyager has at least more than one future open to it?
And that depended on her being on the ship during Year of Hell - something which never happened. So that timeline no longer exists.
You're forgetting the nature of Annorax's technology.
Multiple timelines do not exist.
There is only one timeline, and he has the technology to escape it, to exist outside of time, and from there sculpt time externally without effecting the physical matter or the memories of anything or anyone on his ship despite their own personal histories changing inextricably off in the distance inside time.
What I am saying is that Annorax's science was shitty and flawed ad wrong, because multiple timelines do exist, but all he could discover was proof that they did not.
Dumbass.
So while Kes in Before and After may have "created" many divergent timelines, as she oozed her way from one to the other toward her own conception, because the Ocampan's method of time travel was different to Annoraxs, Annorax did not.
We are not sure that every time line, that Kes visited, or we the viewer experienced, has an Annorax molesting it, since the bugger we met was only patrolling one timeline, and the Year of Hell that occurred with the Indigenous Krenim is multiversal and not certainly codependent with Annorax.
Multiple timelines do not exist.
There is only one timeline, and he has the technology to escape it, to exist outside of time, and from there sculpt time externally without effecting the physical matter or the memories of anything or anyone on his ship despite their own personal histories changing inextricably off in the distance inside time.
What I am saying is that Annorax's science was shitty and flawed ad wrong, because multiple timelines do exist, but all he could discover was proof that they did not.
Dumbass.
So while Kes in Before and After may have "created" many divergent timelines, as she oozed her way from one to the other toward her own conception, because the Ocampan's method of time travel was different to Annoraxs, Annorax did not.
We are not sure that every time line, that Kes visited, or we the viewer experienced, has an Annorax molesting it, since the bugger we met was only patrolling one timeline, and the Year of Hell that occurred with the Indigenous Krenim is multiversal and not certainly codependent with Annorax.
Aren't all the timelines supposed to be equally real, and it's just our point-of-view which makes one appear more proper than the others?
That said, trying to make sense of Voyager's time travels is virtually impossible.
That said, trying to make sense of Voyager's time travels is virtually impossible.
Really? I thought after the ISS Voyager razed the the Kazon Kamp, that Kes led the Imperial Deaths Head brigade down into the Ocampan city to drawn and quarter he people hiding out underground?
No?
My bad.
No?
My bad.
Aren't all the timelines supposed to be equally real, and it's just our point-of-view which makes one appear more proper than the others?
That said, trying to make sense of Voyager's time travels is virtually impossible.
And don't forget that "A leads to B leads to C leads to A,", as Captain Braxton said.
It is easy enough to verify, but I think that only Kim and Naomi are Memorex versions owing to the Deadlock shenanigans, so no, Actual Kes did not die then. As to B & A, Kes' singular voyage began in the future, owing not only to the Doctor's machinations but the fact that his tinkering only mattered because Kes had already been infected with chroniton radiation. A valid timeline to be sure (as all are) but not one that we can say is a direct progression from the character's history as we have witnessed it up to the time she made her Giftly swansong. It came into being somehow (I think I read a reasonable exegesis of this at Ex Astris Scientia or some such site) and intersected with the prime Voyager timeline as presented. But I still think it is outside or independent of Kes' prime existence, if one wants to even bother with such definitions.
To the extent that Fury Kes does not require integration of alternate timeline events to explain her presence (the character manifestation is of course another issue, to be avoided here), I think that, for ill or good, one can say that this fits as an extension of the "actual" timeline, at which point we are able to thankfully say farewell to Kes, save the welcoming and soothing balms with which she has been graced during her insertions into Trek fiction.
Alright, I'm unlearned in basic scientific processes, am no logician, and have probably bungled the accurate rendering of events that don't require much more than a spellchecker to confirm. So, temporal mechanics mavens or just sensible thinking people, I'm ready to have my integrity torn asunder!!
To the extent that Fury Kes does not require integration of alternate timeline events to explain her presence (the character manifestation is of course another issue, to be avoided here), I think that, for ill or good, one can say that this fits as an extension of the "actual" timeline, at which point we are able to thankfully say farewell to Kes, save the welcoming and soothing balms with which she has been graced during her insertions into Trek fiction.
Alright, I'm unlearned in basic scientific processes, am no logician, and have probably bungled the accurate rendering of events that don't require much more than a spellchecker to confirm. So, temporal mechanics mavens or just sensible thinking people, I'm ready to have my integrity torn asunder!!
The fact that Kes experienced herself in some distant time in the future when she was undergoing morologium(accelerated aging) belonged to the the ship as well as Kes. She also required Chronoton radiation therapy to sync her to present Voyager time this was based on the design of the ship but not Kes.
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In Deadlock it was before 'Before and After' and Kes was not exchanged with a different Kes.
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Annorax's timeship did not affect everybody and everything, but if did effect Voyager's sensitive instruments and sent the Warp Drive inoperable. If something was in Annorax's sphere of influence and if it was being logged by his peering eyes then something would happen to it during incursion. Annorax had to be swatted away or exterminated because he was creating havoc with the space-time continuum. But if you say he was doing what he and his crew were convinced they were doing - well this is virtually impossible.
----------------
In Deadlock it was before 'Before and After' and Kes was not exchanged with a different Kes.
----------------
Annorax's timeship did not affect everybody and everything, but if did effect Voyager's sensitive instruments and sent the Warp Drive inoperable. If something was in Annorax's sphere of influence and if it was being logged by his peering eyes then something would happen to it during incursion. Annorax had to be swatted away or exterminated because he was creating havoc with the space-time continuum. But if you say he was doing what he and his crew were convinced they were doing - well this is virtually impossible.
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