Which version of TOS is canon??

[Lord Garth]

"Which version of TOS is canon?" The one that's sanctioned.

Which one do I personally prefer? The un-remastered version.

There are some parts of the remastered version I like but, overall, the so-so mid-'00s CGI doesn't do anything for me. It's neither retro nor cutting-edge. Plus some of it looks too cartoonish. Then there are some liberties they took with the new mattes and effects shots that I liked and some that I didn't. Overall, my impression of it was very mixed. And when looking at that type of situation overall, I prefer to just stick with the original version.

 

[johnnybear]

The original version all the way!
JB

 

[Mytran]

"Which version of TOS is canon?" The one that's sanctioned

I think they're both official canon, aren't they? Both have been broadcast, both are on officially released Blu-Rays. And while the CGI versions are what is commonly broadcast today, the original FX were chosen for the DSC episode If Memory Serves...

Which one do I personally prefer? The un-remastered version.

There are some parts of the remastered version I like but, overall, the so-so mid-'00s CGI doesn't do anything for me. It's neither retro nor cutting-edge. Plus some of it looks too cartoonish. Then there are some liberties they took with the new mattes and effects shots that I liked and some that I didn't. Overall, my impression of it was very mixed. And when looking at that type of situation overall, I prefer to just stick with the original version.

 

[yotsuya]

I think Discovery has really splintered the Star Trek canon. I personally think it is a fine series, just not in line with anything that came before. So for me there are three parallel universes. TOS (ENT, Movies, TNG, DS9, & Voyager), JJ Movies, and Discovery. The technology just doesn't line up for mid 23rd century technology for any of them. It is three different visions and we can easily take them that way rather than try to cram things together that just don't fit. It is hard enough to get the old canon to fit with all the errors and issues (any canon has that problem), but trying to reconcile Franklin, Kelvin, Shenzhou, and Discovery into the TOS world is full of problems. At some point more people are going to recognize that they are truly different and stop trying to force them together.

 

[fireproof78]

At some point more people are going to recognize that they are truly different and stop trying to force them together.

Why is that a problem if they do try? That's what I have been doing for years with various aspects of Trek canon. TOS is one way of representing the story and Discovery another. If visuals matter that much then sure multiple timelines work. I treat TMP that way for a lot of reasons. But, taken as a whole is fine for me too.

I don't think people have to recognize it one way or the other. The canon isn't splintered in any way. It's just adding on more and people will take it and interpret it in different ways. Sounds like every single Star Trek discussion I've had since I was in 6th grade.

 

[johnnybear]

The thing is I count ENT as a splintering as well as it also contradicts the timeline of TOS! I never understood why they wanted to make a show set before the original series while knowing that the special effects of today would make their series look so much scientifically better and perhaps alienate new viewers of TOS! Plus the Fonz was in da house!!!
JB

 

[mb22]

Why is that a problem if they do try? That's what I have been doing for years with various aspects of Trek canon. TOS is one way of representing the story and Discovery another. If visuals matter that much then sure multiple timelines work. I treat TMP that way for a lot of reasons. But, taken as a whole is fine for me too.

I don't think people have to recognize it one way or the other. The canon isn't splintered in any way. It's just adding on more and people will take it and interpret it in different ways. Sounds like every single Star Trek discussion I've had since I was in 6th grade.

If so, better chuck the Okuda reference books and rewrite Memory Alpha.

 

[fireproof78]

If so, better chuck the Okuda reference books and rewrite Memory Alpha.

Why? Because they are not 100% accurate? I still have and love my Franz Joseph Technical Manual. Still my favorite book. 100% accuracy is not mandated for my enjoyment.

And Memory Alpha can do whatever it wants so …

 

[mb22]

Everyone can do whatever they want. I am certainly in no position to 'order' anyone about anything, even if I wished to.

However, books like the Concordance, the two Okuda titles, and the 'in-universe' parts of Memory Alpha purport to being an 'in-universe' record of what happened in an internal Star Trek 'history'. If there are multiple realties (in the same universe), then such works should be altered to indicate this, in the interest of making things clear for the reader.

 

[fireproof78]

Everyone can do whatever they want. I am certainly in no position to 'order' anyone about anything, even if I wished to.

However, books like the Concordance, the two Okuda titles, and the 'in-universe' parts of Memory Alpha purport to being an 'in-universe' record of what happened in an internal Star Trek 'history'. If there are multiple realties (in the same universe), then such works should be altered to indicate this, in the interest of making things clear for the reader.

I think readers can figure it out for themselves. Even my tiny 8 year old brain could figure out the Concordance and Encyclopedia. Any inconsistencies would simply be that the records are incomplete, or classified, like what Josephs' did with his manual. The older I get the more I learn that historical records are not always perfectly accurate. Fiction will be no different.

Again, it doesn't have to bee 100% accurate to be enjoyable.

 

[mb22]

OK - But future editions should indicate that. They haven't until now. I will check Memory Alpha at some point and see if there is anything like that on it's home page.

 

[fireproof78]

OK - But future editions should indicate that. They haven't until now. I will check Memory Alpha at some point and see if there is anything like that on it's home page.

Again, I think readers and fans can figure it out. I don't think it has to be highlighted. Fans are a pretty smart bunch and I think spelling things out is shortchanging them.

 

[yotsuya]

Why is that a problem if they do try? That's what I have been doing for years with various aspects of Trek canon. TOS is one way of representing the story and Discovery another. If visuals matter that much then sure multiple timelines work. I treat TMP that way for a lot of reasons. But, taken as a whole is fine for me too.

I don't think people have to recognize it one way or the other. The canon isn't splintered in any way. It's just adding on more and people will take it and interpret it in different ways. Sounds like every single Star Trek discussion I've had since I was in 6th grade.

I consider the quirks of Ent through Picard to be like trying to fit together a difficult plastic model. It requires some trims and adjustments to make it look good (and the older Star Trek models are some of the worst). I consider trying to fit Discovery in between Ent and TOS to be like trying to shove a Chevy V8 with supercharger into a Volkswagen. It can be done, but not only will it never truly fit, but it will eventually destroy the VW chassis (and before you ask, I know someone who did that).

 

[fireproof78]

I consider the quirks of Ent through Picard to be like trying to fit together a difficult plastic model. It requires some trims and adjustments to make it look good (and the older Star Trek models are some of the worst). I consider trying to fit Discovery in between Ent and TOS to be like trying to shove a Chevy V8 with supercharger into a Volkswagen. It can be done, but not only will it never truly fit, but it will eventually destroy the VW chassis (and before you ask, I know someone who did that).

Yeah, I've known someone similar. I don't hold the same view but it's a nice mental image all the same

But, yeah, if the visuals are that important then Discovery won't fit with TOS. For me, it's less of a perfect fit and more working with Play-Dough.

 

[FormerLurker]

For me, the TOS bridge (for instance) became painfully dated and simplistic as of TMP. At the same time, I don't like the DIS bridge, not because it's too modern, but because it's too big. If they would/could fit the DIS bridge into the TOS dimensions, I'd like it a lot better, as that, once again to me, would better represent a proper updating of the look of the set/setting.

 

[fireproof78]

I think some would prefer this:

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[Shawnster]

I think some would prefer this:

I can easily get behind that. Never get tired of watching that clip and only disappointed with how short it is.

 

[yotsuya]

For me, the TOS bridge (for instance) became painfully dated and simplistic as of TMP. At the same time, I don't like the DIS bridge, not because it's too modern, but because it's too big. If they would/could fit the DIS bridge into the TOS dimensions, I'd like it a lot better, as that, once again to me, would better represent a proper updating of the look of the set/setting.

90% of that is the lighting and the screen displays. Updated those to what we can do today and it changes things. In the first three TOS era movies, the technology level of the sets is almost identical. Instead of multiple colors of buttons at every stations, they are mostly clear, but the same type of raised, lit buttons. the sceens actually show things that move, though most of them are on a loop, including lots of Franz Joseph work. Ever seen In A Mirror Darkly or Star Trek Continues? They made use of the screens to good effect and neither feel as dated as TOS, even though the design wasn't updated.

 

[fireproof78]

Still feels dated. I think it needs a little more detailing and it would do better. But, as much as I love TOS (my first Trek and Pike is the best captain!) taking it seriously as future humanity strains my suspension of disbelief quite a bit.

I think In a Mirror Darkly made it more apparent the disparity just looking at the NX vs. the Constitution.

 

[Commishsleer]

I can easily get behind that. Never get tired of watching that clip and only disappointed with how short it is.

People would still complain because it wasn't the original effects (and thats a perfectly valid opinion)
I'd love to see a whole episode like that though. The whole series in fact. It might be too weird though. Youd have to see over 30 seconds worth.