Which Star Trek movie has got the most plot holes? And the least?
- Thread starter Lance
- Start date
In TMP it should have been either Voyager 1 or Voyager 2 and not a fictional Voyager number.
When TMP was made, they expected the Voyager program to continue.
In TMP it should have been either Voyager 1 or Voyager 2 and not a fictional Voyager number.
When TMP was made, they expected the Voyager program to continue.
Thanks.
That explains that.However, to play it safe they still should have used 1 or 2.
Ah, but the "different Vulcan procedure" existed, so Kirk simply took Sarek's information--and based on his belief that Spock might be revived (strngly implied in his TWOK log), it was no great leap to assume Spock's living soul could have its physical home again.
There's nothing in that final scene suggesting sentimentality or anything else--other than a belief that Genesis might restore spock--particulalry since a conscious choice was made to send Spock's tube there, instead of space. Further, Kirk just witnessed the effect of Genesis literally creating life from a lifeless world, so his log entry reads as acknowledging the technology's potential--that Spock might benefit from the Genesis effect.
He simply assumed that Spock (or rather Spock's body's matter) would be a seed for new life. As they discussed before they were attacked by the Reliant, Genesis would erase existing life and reorganize it (that was Spock's own comment that got McCoy pretty upset).
Had Nimoy never returned to the franchise, Kirk's log entry would still be the same, but Spock would have stayed dead.
That's not true. They initially were supposed to be part of the Mariner program, and then there were supposed to be 4 probes but that ended in 1972, way before TMP was penned.
In STIII, Kirk had one other source informing his seemingly illogical decisions--Spock's own katra, in McCoy's body. "You left me on Genesis...why did you do that?"
Not only that -- as bad as it is -- but the entire set up at the beginning of the movie doesn't match the pay off. Kirk is set up as being unhappy in a quiet retirement. We're practically beaten over the head with the idea that Kirk needs to be right in the middle of the action. So what, according to the Nexus, is his greatest wish? A quiet retirement. WTF?
Picard, on thje other hand, has been thinking about the family life he sacrificed. But he's the one trying to convince Kirk to leave the Nexus. Logically, the way the movie was set up, it should be Kirk convincing Picard to go back. I understand this is a TNG movie and the writers wanted the hero, Picard, to take the active role. But, in that case, they needed an entirely different story setup for both characters. Just criminal writing, throughout the film.
It's a pity "Generations" is such an irredeemable mess, as I thought it had the most potential of all the TNG films. I only saw "Nemesis" once, so I don't remember the plot holes, but that movie would have had to work hard to have as many holes as "Generations."
Wow, I never caught that. Good post.
Lots of the movies suffer from "the Enterprise is the only ship in range".
Back in the 1980s I remember reading a review of III that made some very good points about the plot. For example why wouldn't the Federation authorise a ship to go and get Spock's body. And why,if Genesis is so sensitive, would they not send more ships to guard it. But looking past that, why do they even need his body? McCoy has his katra so why not just take McCoy to Vulcan? They don't know that Spock's body is alive at that point.
There's a line in IV that goes something like "the president said the transmissions were directed at the oceans" and then they deduce they were directed at humpback whales. But as far as I remember the president doesn't actually say the transmissions were directed at the oceans! (I guess a line was cut.)
Generations is just a mess, but I will sum up my thoughts with "Why doesn't Soran just fly a ship into the nexus?" It worked for him before. And i remember the Nitpickers guide made a very good point that even if the star blows up the MASS of the star is still centered on the same place it was in, therefore the nexus wouldn't change course.
Back in the 1980s I remember reading a review of III that made some very good points about the plot. For example why wouldn't the Federation authorise a ship to go and get Spock's body. And why,if Genesis is so sensitive, would they not send more ships to guard it. But looking past that, why do they even need his body? McCoy has his katra so why not just take McCoy to Vulcan? They don't know that Spock's body is alive at that point.
There's a line in IV that goes something like "the president said the transmissions were directed at the oceans" and then they deduce they were directed at humpback whales. But as far as I remember the president doesn't actually say the transmissions were directed at the oceans! (I guess a line was cut.)
Generations is just a mess, but I will sum up my thoughts with "Why doesn't Soran just fly a ship into the nexus?" It worked for him before. And i remember the Nitpickers guide made a very good point that even if the star blows up the MASS of the star is still centered on the same place it was in, therefore the nexus wouldn't change course.
Wel nemesis was really really bad
Chekov said that Khan put the eels into their bodies. McCoy had no way of knowing that he meant their ears. He also had no surgical equipment with which to remove the eels, which had integrated themselves into the central nervous system.
NightJim said:
Grissom may have been destroyed on the far side of the planet. Also, Kirk asked Chekov to perform a short-range scan of the area, so Enterprise may not have cast a wide enough net to pull in any information about Grissom's demise.
NightJim said:
Several novels mention different types of auto-destruct sequences used to destroy a ship. Warp-core breaches are used in deep space. Ringed explosions are used near a planetary body to avoid taking out the planet when the ship explodes.
--Sran
Yes, that I do recall.
Ah, yes. I remember noticing that.
Anything powerful enough to disrupt an entire planet's ocean system will probably disrupt other environmental phenomena, too.
--Sran
Indeed...I don't think of Nemesis as having "plot holes" so much as just being stupid.
Well Nemesis had a good premise, and good ideas, really. Finally getting the Romulans into the movies, the Reman uprising, the clone infiltrator (not B4, Shinzon), the implications of self...
...unfortunately it was poorly executed on almost every level. It feels like an overly-long TNG episode. The battle at the end is pretty cool, but even it has problems.
...unfortunately it was poorly executed on almost every level. It feels like an overly-long TNG episode. The battle at the end is pretty cool, but even it has problems.
