Where did Spock go?

[Luther Sloan]

I was speaking in a broad sense.

Sharr Khan:

I kind of figured. But I was erasing any doubts you might have had in my post, seeing you posted it right after my fanon defense.

However I used to obsess over this stuff - to a point where I created useless stress upon myself, and got really offended when others did not take it as umm serious.

Well, I realize it is just fiction. So I never get worked up or stressed over it ever. Then again, I hardly get stressed about anything. I am pretty laid back and cool most of the time.

In fact, I actually find it quite relaxing and fun when I come up with fanon in defense of Star Trek's canon. But everyone is different of course.

 

[Locutus]

I know that I'm not going to convince anyone who disagrees with me in my post, but whatever.

As far as Spock not knowing that Kirk was 30 - 35, well, we ARE talking about a man who had just been thrown back in time, captured, exiled to a frozen wasteland, witnessed the destruction of his home planet, and THEN encountered a vastly younger version of his best friend. After all that, I think I personally could excuse a couple of years! So I believe that Spock Prime IS TOS Spock, as is the intent of the creators, and is predominantly (aside from one or two things {seriously, you point out "Kirk's not Captain?", and not Scotty's Transwarp beaming, something that's never happened in any of Trek until 09?}) borne out.

As far as the destination universe is concerned, I personally feel that the Kelvin's universe is a Parallel Universe to the original. There are too many differences for it to be the same universe to me, such as the size of the Kelvin.

I can excuse a few continuity errors, as long as I enjoy the film. And I DID enjoy the film! I'm sorry you didn't!

 

[Ronald Held]

Another one who believes Nero and Spock arrived in a parallel universe before the tampering started!
Clearly Spock is not the same as he was in the two part Unification. how much of that is due to age, lack of maintaining the Disciplines, destruction of Vulcan, and exile to an icy misnamed body is up for discussion.

 

[Locutus]

My Grandfather wasn't the same man he was in the last few years of his life.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Although Spock had been though hell, he should have a few years left. He should be about 160 in STXI - but don't Vulcans live to be around 250?

Or would Spock's half-human heratige limit him to to the 150ish Trek human lifespan?

 

[Smiley]

In practice, he'll live as long as the writers need him around. He doesn't just have his Vulcan-human hybrid status, he also has a rejuvenated body from The Search for Spock and plenty of wacky things that have happened to him in his travels since then.

 

[Dukhat]

Well, it cuts both ways.

Spock Prime did not come from the TOS universe; the movie is not connected to the TOS universe and is a "clean reboot." The assertions otherwise here are not based on "on-screen evidence" but on narrow, subjective interpretations of details in the movie being wedged to fit into a preconceived, preferred conclusion.

No, it doesn't "cut both ways." Putting a couple "not's" in Dennis's quote doesn't make this "new" quote true in the slightest.

 

[Warped9]

Dennis likes his statements to seem like they're assertions of fact. Well, everyone has their dreams...

The idea of the altered timeline is to essentially wipe clean previous continuity. To wit: it never happened. Well, fine, in fairness as a reboot it can do that. And it doesn't matter who likes to assert and/or believe old Spock is TOS Spock because as far as I'm concerned ST09 didn't happen as far as TOS is concerned.

And when ST09 is a largely forgotten project from many summers past TOS will still be there as the one that still matters.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

No, it doesn't "cut both ways." Putting a couple "not's" in Dennis's quote doesn't make this "new" quote true in the slightest.

Of course not, but if facts and/or logic are given any weight at all the premise that Spock comes from some "other alternate universe" collapses immediately...so why not resort to nonsensical word games of this kind?

 

[xortex]

Nonsensicle word games are when they say they will respect canon and then trample all over it.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Oh, they respected canon - just not slavishly.

 

[Warped9]

Oh, they respected canon - just not slavishly.

 

[Captain Robert April]

They respected canon like a rapist respects his victim.

 

[T'Bonz]

Oh good grief!

 

[Joker]

And when ST09 is a largely forgotten project from many summers past TOS will still be there as the one that still matters.

"Matters"? To who?

I badly want to say "get a life" right now. Wait... I just did.

In what way is this 60's television show going to "matter" to anyone but incredibly bitter fanatics like you?

The original Star Trek show does not and will not "matter" to anyone other than those who follow it a little too obsessively. Ditto with the spin-offs, the movies that followed it, and the new Star Trek movie.

They're all equal in this regard: They do not matter, people do not care. 99% of people do not care about the new Star Trek film anymore than they care about The Dark Knight at this point. Which, I would imagine, is probably still more than they care for 60's Star Trek.

Why? It's a television show, therefore not worth the effort.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

"Matters"? To who?...

...The original Star Trek show does not and will not "matter" to anyone other than those who follow it a little too obsessively. Ditto with the spin-offs, the movies that followed it, and the new Star Trek movie.

Exactly. These things matter to those of us who like them. Investing any negative feelings toward versions of them or people who disagree about them is...perhaps the purview of intense fandom, but a waste of time and life nonetheless.

That the current movie is a success and that the overwhelming majority of Star Trek fans like and accept it has required continual moving of the goal posts for "success" on the part of those who disdain it. When we've reached the point of "in the long run you'll be proven wrong and we'll be proven right, just you wait and see" it's pretty clear that the attacks on the thing have just run completely out of ammunition.

 

[Warped9]

And when ST09 is a largely forgotten project from many summers past TOS will still be there as the one that still matters.

"Matters"? To who?

I badly want to say "get a life" right now. Wait... I just did.

In what way is this 60's television show going to "matter" to anyone but incredibly bitter fanatics like you?

The original Star Trek show does not and will not "matter" to anyone other than those who follow it a little too obsessively. Ditto with the spin-offs, the movies that followed it, and the new Star Trek movie.

They're all equal in this regard: They do not matter, people do not care. 99% of people do not care about the new Star Trek film anymore than they care about The Dark Knight at this point. Which, I would imagine, is probably still more than they care for 60's Star Trek.

Why? It's a television show, therefore not worth the effort.

TOS inspired a lot of viewers and was assimilated into the broader collective consciousness. It is a visual document and a glimpse into another time. It shows how some ideas and concepts are timeless and universal. And it is immediately recognizable in many respects. Future generations will see that just as successive generations of viewers have. Yes, it's a television show, but if it didn't matter on some level we wouldn't be here debating it after forty years.

ST09 will be just another barely remembered summer flick with no depth or redeeming value other than a waste of two hours you'll never get back.

I always marvel at those who profess to like something yet never miss a chance to demean it. It is a very recognizable behaviour of what's known as a self loathing fan.

 

[Twain]

And when ST09 is a largely forgotten project from many summers past TOS will still be there as the one that still matters.

"Matters"? To who?

I badly want to say "get a life" right now. Wait... I just did.

In what way is this 60's television show going to "matter" to anyone but incredibly bitter fanatics like you?

The original Star Trek show does not and will not "matter" to anyone other than those who follow it a little too obsessively. Ditto with the spin-offs, the movies that followed it, and the new Star Trek movie.

They're all equal in this regard: They do not matter, people do not care. 99% of people do not care about the new Star Trek film anymore than they care about The Dark Knight at this point. Which, I would imagine, is probably still more than they care for 60's Star Trek.

Why? It's a television show, therefore not worth the effort.

*Applauds*

 

[Joker]

TOS inspired a lot of viewers and was assimilated into the broader collective consciousness. It is a visual document and a glimpse into another time. It shows how some ideas and concepts are timeless and universal.

Well, to you, it is those things.

To lots more people, it's a 60's television show, and does not and will never "matter" in the manner you describe.

ST09 will be just another barely remembered summer flick with no depth or redeeming value other than a waste of two hours you'll never get back.

Again, to you.

To lots more people, it was an enjoyable movie and they were happy with the result, moreso than had they sat and watched episodes of that old series that they "barely remember".

I always marvel at those who profess to like something yet never miss a chance to demean it. It is a very recognizable behaviour of what's known as a self loathing fan.

Refusing to obsess over it to the level that you do does not demean it. It's a good television show. However, even good television shows do not matter. Star Trek 09 also does not matter. It's a movie.

Star Trek 09 matters to most people as much as TOS did. That is to say... not at all.

This much is clear though: You are that outcast fan who wanted to know the combination to Kirk's safe, 20 years older and a hell of a lot more bitter for it.

 

[xortex]

'barely remember' ? May you be remembered as well as other cultural icons as Shirley Temple and the Beatles. Talk about what doesn't matter.