Where are the Captain's Quarters?

[Nerys Myk]

Oh I agree with your observation on importance but as all this got kicked off by having t0o many crew of Lt Cmd + the Captain to fit in Senior Rank Cabins one had to be less than Lt Cmd and Quartermaster just seems to make the most sence and fit in with most of what we have seen - Either that or as the role of Operations seems to be in chage of Helm and Navigation you might argue that role doesn't exist - we have never seen a Operations officer on 1701 or 1701-A but then again Helm and Navigator where usually higher ranking than Comms..... Is Security the one to get dropped down? The problem is QM is the only Officer listed on the Plans who is 2 levels above the next highest ranking in his department - so is the only one you could lower without having to move any body else......

We didn't really see in higher ranks at Helm and Navigation until the films. They seemed to top off at lieutenant. Sulu, Chekov and Uhura working in their TOS postions in the film is an anomaly not standard practice. Of course Chekov was Security chief in TMP and XO of the Reliant in TWOK before seemingly going back to navigation on the E. An odd career path.

Helm and Navigation are combined as Con officer in TNG. Operations was created for Data, but its more or less the Science Officer job ( exposition ), not helm or navigation. Data is also Second officer. which might account for his Lt Commander rank. Others on the bridge, Laforge, Worf and Yar, were lieutenants. So again, not very many Lt. Commanders at the start. The eight "slots" for Lt. Commanders might not normally include various bridge officers.

 

[Elder Knight]

I remember that in Captain Horatio Hornblower R.N. (1951), the Captain. Gregory Peck has to escort some fine ladies somewhere. He bumps his first officer to bunk with the common sailors, and takes over that man's quarters for himself, so that the ladies can have the best suite on the ship.

 

[Timo]

Sulu, Chekov and Uhura working in their TOS postions in the film is an anomaly not standard practice.

True enough - there's very little "standard" about the missions of the TOS movies, it usually being the case that Kirk has personally assembled a posse of his liking.

However, the people at the steering pulpit of the Excelsior are high-ranking as well - Commanders or Lieutenant Commanders both, it seems:

http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=52623&fullsize=1

Timo Saloniemi

 

[J.T.B.]

I remember that in Captain Horatio Hornblower R.N. (1951), the Captain. Gregory Peck has to escort some fine ladies somewhere. He bumps his first officer to bunk with the common sailors, and takes over that man's quarters for himself, so that the ladies can have the best suite on the ship.

Would never happen. The first lieutenant would bump the next ranking officer (which was the master in those days) out of his room, who would bump the next ranking officer, and so on down. The two most junior wardroom officers would probably end up sharing a stateroom. But no officer would ever end up berthing in hammocks on the gundeck with the sailors, that would be unthinkable.

Before air travel when naval ships were commonly used to transport diplomats and government officials it was common for officers to be bumped out of their quarters by VIPs. One of the most extreme examples would be in 1944 when President Roosevelt, whose doctors forbade him to fly, traveled in the battleship Iowa to the Tehran war conference. The four-star Joint Chiefs were also aboard, so the president took the captain's cabin, Admiral Leahy the flag cabin, General Marshall the chief of staff's and so on down. The captain also had an at-sea cabin, which he offered to Admiral King, but King declined and took a standard officer's stateroom.

 

[Rivet counter]

Would never happen. The first lieutenant would bump the next ranking officer (which was the master in those days) out of his room, who would bump the next ranking officer, and so on down. The two most junior wardroom officers would probably end up sharing a stateroom. But no officer would ever end up berthing in hammocks on the gundeck with the sailors, that would be unthinkable.

Before air travel when naval ships were commonly used to transport diplomats and government officials it was common for officers to be bumped out of their quarters by VIPs. One of the most extreme examples would be in 1944 when President Roosevelt, whose doctors forbade him to fly, traveled in the battleship Iowa to the Tehran war conference. The four-star Joint Chiefs were also aboard, so the president took the captain's cabin, Admiral Leahy the flag cabin, General Marshall the chief of staff's and so on down. The captain also had an at-sea cabin, which he offered to Admiral King, but King declined and took a standard officer's stateroom.

Closer to home in Elann of Trois Lt Uhura gave up her quarters to Elann....

 

[Longinus]

By Command Staff I'm including thetop ranking Officers as detailed in the 25th annivasary Ncc1701-A Deckplans:
Namely:-
Captain
Executive Officer (1st Officer) - Lt Cmd
Operations Officer (2nd Officer and in change of Helm and Navigation) - Lt Cmd
Science Officer - Lt Cmd
Medial Officer - Lt Cmd
Engineering Officer - Lt Cmd
Comunications Officer - Lt Cmd
Secuity - Lt Cmd
(The officer I dropped in Rank to fit the D-Deck Problem was Quartermaster) - was listed as Lt Cmd but I have dropped to Lt.

But this is obviously wrong. While it might be standard setup for a Constitution class ship (though first officers almost always seem to be Commanders, not Lt. Commanders) this certainly is not how it was on NCC-1701-A. Executive officer is Spock (who also might have been a Science Officer) with a rank of Captain. Second Officer was Scotty, who was a Chief Engineer, again with a rank of Captain. CMO was McCoy, Commander. Operations officer seems to me to be wrong description to helm officer anyway but that would have been Sulu, also a full Commander.

 

[J.T.B.]

USS Exeter also had a full commander as chief medical officer in TOS, so there seems to be room for some variation in the senior positions.

 

[Timewalker]

Hmm. During combat, all the top officers would be packed in the same room anyway. Why worry about noncombat distribution of assets?

Timo Saloniemi

The Bridge, Engineering, and Sickbay are not all in the same room. There were plenty of episodes where the top officers were scattered throughout the ship, often where they usually worked.


Okay, I can't resist saying this: It's irrelevant where the Captain's quarters are. They don't use physical money, so he doesn't have any.

 

[Elder Knight]

The Bridge, Engineering, and Sickbay are not all in the same room. There were plenty of episodes where the top officers were scattered ...


Okay, I can't resist saying this: It's irrelevant where the Captain's quarters are. They don't use physical money, so he doesn't have any.

I had a vision of the senile old Captain, gloating "Ha ha hah! Just you wait, when money comes back, I'll have all the quarters! Now, where was I? That's $1,554,392.25! $1,554,392.50! $1,554,392.75! Here it comes ... 1,554,393 dollars! Then $1,554,393.25! ... Heh, heh, heh, and they call me crazy!"

 

[Rivet counter]

Looking at the Strategic Design 25th Anniversary plans - the numbers just don't add up....
The plans state 500 crew - 72 officers and the rest enlisted.
It also states officers are in single berth cabins but Jnr Officers and Enlisted are in twin cabins....
But...
If you add up all the cabins detailed they only have 498 births - 2 short - and no extra capacity for visiting personnel (and of those 498 they have cabins for 92 officers - 20 more than stated).
If enlisted quarters held 3 berths instead of 2 then the available births would jump to 701 - 201 spare births....I need to check ST6 for the scenes where they search the ship and see how crew quarters are shown there...

 

[Timewalker]

They might be using the room in shifts. After all, when a person is on duty, they're not using their quarters.

 

[Rivet counter]

Timewalker - you are talking about the idea of "hot bunking" as used in Submarines certainly in the UK and probably in most other navies - but that concept has been phased out over the last 20 years and I can't see it ever coming back...

 

[Rivet counter]

Rewatched Star Trek VI and the sequence when searching for the assassins uniforms throws up an image that completely busts the 25th anniversary plans take on accomodation.
There is one scene where, what I presume, are enlisted quarters are being searched.
The plans lists enlisted quarters as a Cabin with a double bunk sharing a fresher with another cabin.
The scene in Startrek VI clearly shows a compartment with multiple bunks on racks in it - you clearly see at least 6 bunks but the geometry suggests more. Freeze framing the image the lowest bunk is about shin high off the deck - the next bunk is about as high as the hip on a crewman - that would suggest, (although not visible on screen), that there is a 3rd bunk that would be about shoulder height. this now means we have at least 9 crew in one room - an unusual No, but if we assume that it is in fact 4 sets of 3 bunks in a enlarged cabin this would make sence. This would be commensulate with enlisted crew on existing navy vessels but be a lot more than are shown on the plans.
Therefore if we increase the size of each cabin, (at least double if not triple) and then increase the bunks to triples, then my original thoughts on this still bear out. You would have enough space for the entire crew, plus a fair No of spare cabins and rooms for visiting crew - or passengers.
It's either that or keep the same No of rooms but increase bunks to 3 per cabin, with two cabins sharing a fresher... But it till amounts to the same increase in bunks.....

 

[Leto_II]

Timewalker - you are talking about the idea of "hot bunking" as used in Submarines certainly in the UK and probably in most other navies - but that concept has been phased out over the last 20 years and I can't see it ever coming back...

Not necessarily, and particularly not when you're talking about the passage of so many centuries, the advent of long-term deep-space missions, and the influence of multiple alien governments upon a starship's physical design and mission profiles.

For all we know, in the 23rd Century, the concept of hot-bunking suddenly made new sense for whatever reason(s), and could've been re-implemented in certain starship classes of that era (and actually was, since we see it onscreen in the movie).

Also, to be sure, the U.K. and U.S. governments and militaries as we know them today don't exist in Star Trek's future, and decisions made way back in the 1980s or 1990s by them certainly wouldn't have any bearing at all on Starfleet policy in the 2290s.