What's keeping me out of the theatre....

[ST-One]

Thinking this movie has a brain sounds like a pretty huge assumption.

Seen it yet?

No. But since people make evaluations of a movie in large part on the trailer ... (also you might want to look at the thread comments by one of the other regulars, who also says he can tell if a movie is shit by the trailer, so he certainly won't bother. Wasn't talking about trek, but he did know his own mind.)

Well, if the trailer for a movie doesn't convince me that that film is worth paying for it, I won't go watch it.
But I then do also not presume to be able to judge that particular film as good or bad, since the impression I got from the trailer can be completely wrong.

So, while I can perfectly accept that the trailer doesn't convince you to see Star Trek, I cannot accept that you go on and on badmouthing the film as a whole.

 

[trevanian]

Need to go back upthread,lady. This has been covered, probably 7
pages ago.

 

[trevanian]

Seen it yet?

No. But since people make evaluations of a movie in large part on the trailer ... (also you might want to look at the thread comments by one of the other regulars, who also says he can tell if a movie is shit by the trailer, so he certainly won't bother. Wasn't talking about trek, but he did know his own mind.)

Well, if the trailer for a movie doesn't convince me that that film is worth paying for it, I won't go watch it.
But I then do also not presume to be able to judge that particular film as good or bad, since the impression I got from the trailer can be completely wrong.

So, while I can perfectly accept that the trailer doesn't convince you to see Star Trek, I cannot accept that you go on and on badmouthing the film as a whole.

If everything I see looks wrong or bad, and I comment on those things (and things others bring up that I agree on), I don't see where the issue lies, except in your not wanting to hear another view.

From what little I know of the ending, it sounds like they did something immensely stupid scientifically, but that if their science consultant was worth a damn, she could have offered a viable alternative that might have looked better and been more credible. I'm not discussing that here because I haven't seen it, but I have discussed it on a non-trek board that is less impressed with the film. There IS judgement at work, y'know?

 

[Aike]

Set aside all the periphral elements I dislike. Look at the Kirk arc in this film since he's a central element of the story. This interpretation of Kirk has little to nothing but a smarmy, smartass attitude and no self-discipline. He later stows away aboard a ship where he has no standing and no position. After Pike acts outraged he then enlists the stowaway's help. Throughout the entire thing this Kirk never demonstrates any evidence of ability to command and lead and displays no substance to show why others should respect and follow him. And by the end of the story he gets command by an organization that apparently doesn't have very demanding standards.They give command to a hotshot neophyte who hasn't done anything of substance to show he's earned the prize of one of Starfleet's best ships within a very few span of years..

Well, Kirk saved the Earth and Captain Pike...

That's all up on the screen and none of it bears any resemblance to a believable scenario. The only reason this Kirk gets his captaincy is because that's where Abrams wanted the story to end up despite the fact that nothing in the preceeding two hours logically supports that conclusion.

Once again: Kirk saved the Earth and Captain Pike...

 

[ST-One]

No. But since people make evaluations of a movie in large part on the trailer ... (also you might want to look at the thread comments by one of the other regulars, who also says he can tell if a movie is shit by the trailer, so he certainly won't bother. Wasn't talking about trek, but he did know his own mind.)

Well, if the trailer for a movie doesn't convince me that that film is worth paying for it, I won't go watch it.
But I then do also not presume to be able to judge that particular film as good or bad, since the impression I got from the trailer can be completely wrong.

So, while I can perfectly accept that the trailer doesn't convince you to see Star Trek, I cannot accept that you go on and on badmouthing the film as a whole.

If everything I see looks wrong or bad, and I comment on those things (and things others bring up that I agree on), I don't see where the issue lies, except in your not wanting to hear another view.

I do want to hear them.
I'm talking to you, am I not?

Still, a movie-trailer and few scenes here and there don't give you any basis to judge the whole movie.

From what little I know of the ending, it sounds like they did something immensely stupid scientifically, but that if their science consultant was worth a damn, she could have offered a viable alternative that might have looked better and been more credible. I'm not discussing that here because I haven't seen it, but I have discussed it on a non-trek board that is less impressed with the film. There IS judgement at work, y'know?

Spoiler: Spoil yourself...

It doesn't have any mass, initially, that's why the Narada doesn't get sucked into that black hole.

 

[Forbin]

What's keeping me out of the theater? I was going to go see it today using some of the six AMC theater passes I got at work as a tahnk-you from a manager. Only when I looked up the movie times online, it said no passes are accpeted for ST!

Well, fuck 'em then.

 

[Warped9]

Set aside all the periphral elements I dislike. Look at the Kirk arc in this film since he's a central element of the story. This interpretation of Kirk has little to nothing but a smarmy, smartass attitude and no self-discipline. He later stows away aboard a ship where he has no standing and no position. After Pike acts outraged he then enlists the stowaway's help. Throughout the entire thing this Kirk never demonstrates any evidence of ability to command and lead and displays no substance to show why others should respect and follow him. And by the end of the story he gets command by an organization that apparently doesn't have very demanding standards.They give command to a hotshot neophyte who hasn't done anything of substance to show he's earned the prize of one of Starfleet's best ships within a very few span of years..

Well, Kirk saved the Earth and Captain Pike...

That's all up on the screen and none of it bears any resemblance to a believable scenario. The only reason this Kirk gets his captaincy is because that's where Abrams wanted the story to end up despite the fact that nothing in the preceeding two hours logically supports that conclusion.

Once again: Kirk saved the Earth and Captain Pike...

But that in itself and all by itself doesn't automatically grant you the necessary qualities of leadership and position of command. He could have just gotten lucky. It's a hollow argument except to the mindset of an adolescent. By this I don't mean you, Aike, but the film's writers.

 

[Mallory]

What's keeping me out of the theater? I was going to go see it today using some of the six AMC theater passes I got at work as a tahnk-you from a manager. Only when I looked up the movie times online, it said no passes are accpeted for ST!

Well, fuck 'em then.

I was kind of disappointed with that policy myself. I have some Regal passes I was hoping to use, but the same policy applies there too.

 

[Warped9]

Warped, forgive me for pointing this out, but the name of this thread, which was started by you, is "What's keeping me out of the theatre..." So you knew you didn't want to see this movie. But you went anyway.

Now, I have no problem with people not wanting to see the movie. I am going to see it, long-time (and I do mean "long") fan who enjoys continuity though I am, but I can understand why other people wouldn't.

So...why did you go? You just couldn't stand not seeing it for yourself? But you knew you were going to hate it, so why did you go? I'm not criticising you...I'd really like to know why.

The thread title only means that he wouldn't see it in the theater, not that he wouldn't see it at all.

But at this point, where else could he see it except in a theater? I know DVD sales move pretty fast these days, but not this fast, I'm thinking.

Ahem. It's something called download, as in file sharing, which we can still do in Canada.

 

[Vance]

Actually, Warped9, not legally. Not even in Canada.

 

[Warped9]

In the GTA area we've heard of the cops raiding stores where they're repackaging pirated films for sale. But we haven't heard of them going after individuals who download something occasionally.

I saw Iron Man on DL and liked it enough to buy the dvd for my collection. This weekend I'm sufficiently intrigued that I'll likely be seeing Terminator: Salvation at the theatre with some guys from work. I'm also awaiting seeing Pixar's Up and Public Enemies in July with Johnny Depp as John Dillinger. I'll probably see those in theatre.

 

[JustKate]

The thread title only means that he wouldn't see it in the theater, not that he wouldn't see it at all.

But at this point, where else could he see it except in a theater? I know DVD sales move pretty fast these days, but not this fast, I'm thinking.

Ahem. It's something called download, as in file sharing, which we can still do in Canada.

Yes, I've heard of them, of course. You use one of those computer thingies for that, right? I just, in my nerdish way, don't indulge, and I forget that other people do. And I personally wouldn't watch a big-screen extravaganza on a PC anyway, but then again...I'm hoping to enjoy myself at this movie, and you didn't really think you would.

As for what's keeping me out of the theater, so far it's simply...time and a dislike for crowds. I'm going on Sunday, though, so I just have to avoid spoilage until then.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

I saw Iron Man on DL and liked it enough to buy the dvd for my collection. This weekend I'm sufficiently intrigued that I'll likely be seeing Terminator: Salvation at the theatre with some guys from work. I'm also awaiting seeing Pixar's Up and Public Enemies in July with Johnny Depp as John Dillinger. I'll probably see those in theatre.

Excellent. Next time I take a morsel of bread and it tastes good, I might consider paying for the whole loaf.

 

[Warped9]

^^ They're are a lot of films that are visual spectacles that I've been anxious to see first on the big screen and I have. But a lot of films don't really need the big screen because they're not visual spectacles. In the case of Trek XI I was bummed already by the many things they've changed that I didn't agree with that I wasn't predisposed to support the project with my cash. But to make a more fair criticism I still had to see the film somehow so I asked a guy at work who does DL's occasionally if he could get a DL copy.

I saw Iron Man on DL and liked it enough to buy the dvd for my collection. This weekend I'm sufficiently intrigued that I'll likely be seeing Terminator: Salvation at the theatre with some guys from work. I'm also awaiting seeing Pixar's Up and Public Enemies in July with Johnny Depp as John Dillinger. I'll probably see those in theatre.

Excellent. Next time I take a morsel of bread and it tastes good, I might consider paying for the whole loaf.

I make no apologies. I'm strapped for cash so I'm going to be very picky about where I spend it.

 

[Smiley]

Here's a question: why do you need to "make a fair criticism?" When comment is required, you can just give an honest answer for why you didn't want to see it, and for rational people, that's the end of it. If you saw nothing in the preview that interested you, and Trek films have been trending downward consistently for you, then why see it at all? There's not a whole lot of people saying that the trailer is misleading.

 

[RAMA]

$144 million now and counting in 7 days, ahead of Wednesday grosses of: Wolverine, Iron Man, and Batman Begins.

Wow you guys are making a real impact by not seeing it...

RAMA

 

[Warped9]

Here's a question: why do you need to "make a fair criticism?" When comment is required, you can just give an honest answer for why you didn't want to see it, and for rational people, that's the end of it. If you saw nothing in the preview that interested you, and Trek films have been trending downward consistently for you, then why see it at all? There's not a whole lot of people saying that the trailer is misleading.

Because it's Trek and the curiosity factor comes into play. I wanted to satisfy my curiosity, but I still had enough self-discipline to not pay for something that I suspected I wouldn't like.

I could have been wrong about the film. Sadly in a way, I wasn't. It was worse than I suspected.

 

[Brutal Strudel]

From what little I know of the ending, it sounds like they did something immensely stupid scientifically, but that if their science consultant was worth a damn, she could have offered a viable alternative that might have looked better and been more credible. I'm not discussing that here because I haven't seen it, but I have discussed it on a non-trek board that is less impressed with the film. There IS judgement at work, y'know?

Judging SF on its science is a mug's game, you ask me. Trek is scientifically ludicrous from the get-go: from warp drive to matter-to-energy transport to human/alien and alien/alien hybrids to (yes, alright, fine) energy barriers at the galaxy's edge, Trek's science has always been just plain wrong or so speculative that it is 99.999% certain to be proven wrong eventually. Yet even the hardest of SF often employs scientific implausibities and impossibilities and hard is not necessarily the same as intelligent. There is virtually no science in the works of Philip K. Dick and yet he has two volumes dedicated to him from the uber-prestigious Library of America, alongside Henry James and Edith Wharton. Those of you accusing me of elitism will note: I never once impugn the science of this new movie. (Though I find it funny that one of the few nods to scientific rigor GR hammered again and again--that the Enterprise was a creature of space built in space and designed never to enter a planet's atmosphere--has been gleefully cast aside amid a legion of fans doing backflips to justify it.) A supernova that threatens the galaxy? That's gotta be one motherlovin' huge supernova (and faster than Warp 10 to boot--can X-Rays evolve into salamanders?) but okay. Black holes that ships can waltz through w/o becoming temporally locked wires of gravitically stretched duranium with trace amounts of liquefied crew? Good enough for Vejur, good enough for me.

What I impugn instead is the incestuous writing that has everybody knowing everybody right from the start, even to the point that Spock--who never even took the Kobayashi Maru--is its programmer. I impugn the idea that an academy graduate would be given command of the fleet's flagship based on a single successful mission. I impugn the sloppy mining of TOS for meaningless Easter Eggs like the one that puts the remote Delta Vega (much, much, much) closer to Vulcan than Earth is to Mars. I impugn the "Dawson's Kirk" (from The Village Voice's favorable review of the film) makeover of the serious character shown and alluded to in TOS, I impugn the need to re-make Kirk's life story into weak and warmed-over Campbell via Lucas and I impugn the need to re-make Kirk and Spock's friendship into the tired buddy movie/rom-com cliche of "first they hate each other but you just wait."

But in the end, I still enjoyed this movie. I just have the eyes to see it for what it is and what it isn't and what it isn't is the Star Trek I fell in love with, the Star Trek that GR, for all his faults, insisted hew as closely to the rules of intelligent drama for grown-ups as a mass media space opera possibly could, the Star Trek that boasted some of the best writer if LitSF among its screenwriters as well as among its earliest novelists (Vonda McIntyre and Joe Haldeman spring to mind--Nebula-winners both, Hugo-winner too in the case of Haldeman) rather than the guys who gave us Optimus and now Spocktimus Prime. If saying so makes me an elitist then I consider elitist a compliment. And I consider it amusing that this movie's fans see the need to be so snide to anyone with a differing opinion or so much as a serious critique. Methinks we are not the ones in need of getting over ourselves.

 

[RAMA]

Here's a question: why do you need to "make a fair criticism?" When comment is required, you can just give an honest answer for why you didn't want to see it, and for rational people, that's the end of it. If you saw nothing in the preview that interested you, and Trek films have been trending downward consistently for you, then why see it at all? There's not a whole lot of people saying that the trailer is misleading.

Because it's Trek and the curiosity factor comes into play. I wanted to satisfy my curiosity, but I still had enough self-discipline to not pay for something that I suspected I wouldn't like.

I could have been wrong about the film. Sadly in a way, I wasn't. It was worse than I suspected.

In other words, you knew it would be more successful than expected, and that's a bad thing for you.

RAMA

 

[BillJ]

Here's a question: why do you need to "make a fair criticism?" When comment is required, you can just give an honest answer for why you didn't want to see it, and for rational people, that's the end of it. If you saw nothing in the preview that interested you, and Trek films have been trending downward consistently for you, then why see it at all? There's not a whole lot of people saying that the trailer is misleading.

Because it's Trek and the curiosity factor comes into play. I wanted to satisfy my curiosity, but I still had enough self-discipline to not pay for something that I suspected I wouldn't like.

I could have been wrong about the film. Sadly in a way, I wasn't. It was worse than I suspected.

In other words, you knew it would be more successful than expected, and that's a bad thing for you.

RAMA

I personally liked the film. But why do some posters feel the need to belittle those who didn't? Do you feel smarter somehow by liking this film? Were you disliked in high-school and now feel like one of the cool kids?

Warped 9 didn't like it. His opinion is no more or less valid than any other person here.