What would kirk have done?

[at Quark's]

Scenario: TNG Homeward.

So a planetary atmosphere is breaking up, there's no way to stop it, and there's the choice to (1) save either one village by placing an atmospheric shield, (2) shipping the population of said village to another planet (like it happened in the TNG ep) or (3) letting the species die out, nominally because the prime directive requires so (by following the interpretation Picard uses).

So let's assume, there's really no way out of this one, of saving the planetary population at large. No wooing of a female Q (or Trelane), no confounding an omnipotent supercomputer in its own logic until it shortcircuits, no reprogramming the 'scenario', etc., etc., etc.; we simply have to accept that saving all cannot be done, no matter how much we'd like to.

What would Kirk have done ?

Additionally, say that he'd choose the resolution Picard chose, how would he have dealt with any dissidents like Nicolai aboard ?

 

[Captain Rob]

Kirk doesn't have the technology that Picard had. or a big enough ship.
And please tell me how a humanoid species can evolve on a planet to that level of development. And only consist of around 100 people or just one village?
Not to mention in real life an atmosphere of an Earth type planet won't dissipate or become untenable that fast.
So I'd go for shields and calling in reinforcements. after consulting with Starfleet.

 

[TheSubCommander]

That episode was pretty ridiculous. Picard should have, and Kirk likely would have, just rendered the Boraalans all unconscious, and kept them in stasis, until they reached Vacca VI ad maximum warp. Once there, beamed them down to the planet to allow them to awake on their own.

 

[Timo]

And please tell me how a humanoid species can evolve on a planet to that level of development. And only consist of around 100 people or just one village?

Umm, what? Nowhere was it suggested that the handful of folks saved by Sergey Rodzhenko would have been the total population of the planet. The dialogue specifically referred to the existence and native knowledge of "other villages" near and far. So the humanoid species in general died, along with every other species on the planet - but one village survived.

As for Kirk's approach, we know he would have tried. He did the utterly futile thing in "Paradise Syndrome", trying to deflect one asteroid in an effort that stretched the limits of Federation technology, when asteroids were "hitting" the planet thrice a year ("The skies have darkened three times since the last harvest") and still causing no visible damage! And he would not have worried about exposing himself to the locals, or to a select few of them anyway, as he did in so many other episodes.

But what could he have done? He could have taken the hundred aboard his starship and taken them to a better place, so I bet he would have. But he wouldn't have tried to keep them in the dark about what happened, as their culture would in any case be irrevocably changed, not just by the transplanting, but by the fact that their entire species had just died out and could never be contacted for trade, exchange of ideas, a frisky war or two, or genetic diversity.

Shielding the locals on the surface would have served nobody, as the shields could never be dropped - the planet supposedly was dead, dead, dead after the natural disaster.

Additionally, say that he'd choose the resolution Picard chose, how would he have dealt with any dissidents like Nicolai aboard ?

Kirk was always confiding in select individuals of primitive species; he'd just talk them around. Or beat them to submission with his fists, another tactic that sometimes managed to turn adversaries to followers. But dissidents should have been no problem as such: if they were to be kept from blowing the whistle, they could simply be thrown to the brig and eventually dropped to a different location (as any inhabited UFP planet would be equally fine for individuals of the species, biologically speaking, allowing them to cool down or then live out their lives there among strangers).

Not to mention in real life an atmosphere of an Earth type planet won't dissipate or become untenable that fast.

What does real life have to do with this?

Besides, we have seen several Trek superweapons with effects like that. What's to say that this was a natural phenomenon at all? Perhaps the Klingons who did this had left the scene already, as in "The Chase"?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[T'Girl]

Kirk would reject the given three options, and create a inspirational fourth option.

 

[The Lensman]

What would Kirk have done in that situation? This: "What's the mission of this vessel, Doctor? To seek out and contact alien life, and an opportunity to demonstrate what our high-sounding words mean. Any questions?"

Kirk would've beamed as many aboard as he could, housed them where he could, (quarters, hangar deck, etc) and been straight up with them while taking them to a new world.


Unlike Picard who hid behind the Prime Directive and seemed annoyed that the rule had been broken. And this episode isn't an anomaly. Picard was also annoyed that Data had the gall to reply to the little alien girl who's world was in danger.

Picard was worried about all the changes said societies would go through by the Federation interfering with the natural course of things.

Kirk would be worried that lives were going to be lost and figured that any changes would be an acceptable price to pay for those peoples still being alive. I'm sure the natives would agree with him as well.

The Prime Directive was not meant to allow civilizations to die.

 

[Marsden]

Kirk would reject the given three options, and create a inspirational fourth option.

Well said! I agree completely.

 

[Jonas Grumby]

Kirk would reject the given three options, and create a inspirational fourth option.

T'Girl for the win! That is pretty much the essence of the James T. Kirk character.

 

[at Quark's]

Kirk would reject the given three options, and create a inspirational fourth option.

T'Girl for the win! That is pretty much the essence of the James T. Kirk character.

It might be, but then again, even Kirk encountered situations in which he found no such 'inspirational option' and had to make heartrending choices. He had to let Edith Keeler die, for instance.

So my question is, assuming this is such a situation, what would he have done?

(My personal thoughts on this are that he would have tried to save as many as possible, with or without adhering to the Prime Directive (as previous posters have pointed out, something can be said for both options).

 

[Shawnster]

Kirk would reject the given three options, and create a inspirational fourth option.

T'Girl for the win! That is pretty much the essence of the James T. Kirk character.

Find some way to halt the process and restore the atmosphere.

 

[Duncan MacLeod]

What would Kirk have done in that situation? This: "What's the mission of this vessel, Doctor? To seek out and contact alien life, and an opportunity to demonstrate what our high-sounding words mean. Any questions?"

Kirk would've beamed as many aboard as he could, housed them where he could, (quarters, hangar deck, etc) and been straight up with them while taking them to a new world.


Unlike Picard who hid behind the Prime Directive and seemed annoyed that the rule had been broken. And this episode isn't an anomaly. Picard was also annoyed that Data had the gall to reply to the little alien girl who's world was in danger.

Picard was worried about all the changes said societies would go through by the Federation interfering with the natural course of things.

Kirk would be worried that lives were going to be lost and figured that any changes would be an acceptable price to pay for those peoples still being alive. I'm sure the natives would agree with him as well.

The Prime Directive was not meant to allow civilizations to die.

This! Well said, sir, well said.

 

[at Quark's]

What would Kirk have done in that situation? This: "What's the mission of this vessel, Doctor? To seek out and contact alien life, and an opportunity to demonstrate what our high-sounding words mean. Any questions?"

Kirk would've beamed as many aboard as he could, housed them where he could, (quarters, hangar deck, etc) and been straight up with them while taking them to a new world.


Unlike Picard who hid behind the Prime Directive and seemed annoyed that the rule had been broken. And this episode isn't an anomaly. Picard was also annoyed that Data had the gall to reply to the little alien girl who's world was in danger.

Picard was worried about all the changes said societies would go through by the Federation interfering with the natural course of things.

Kirk would be worried that lives were going to be lost and figured that any changes would be an acceptable price to pay for those peoples still being alive. I'm sure the natives would agree with him as well.

The Prime Directive was not meant to allow civilizations to die.

This! Well said, sir, well said.

I agree. In fact, something along these lines is said explicitly by Troi in the episode:

NIKOLAI: Isn't that what the Prime Directive was truly intended to do... allow cultures to survive and grow naturally?

TROI: Not entirely. The Prime Directive was designed to ensure non-interference.

So extermination (albeit by natural causes) beats interference. Truthfully, I find that interpretation of the prime directive quite shocking.

As for the other posters that reacted that Kirk would find a solution anyway: Kirk is not god. Kirk can state that he doesn't believe in no-win scenarios, but that doesn't mean he couldn't run into one, regardless of his beliefs.

 

[Melakon]

As for Kirk's approach, we know he would have tried. He did the utterly futile thing in "Paradise Syndrome", trying to deflect one asteroid in an effort that stretched the limits of Federation technology, when asteroids were "hitting" the planet thrice a year ("The skies have darkened three times since the last harvest") and still causing no visible damage!

Kirk had amnesia in "The Paradise Syndrome". All the futility was by ever-logical Spock.

 

[JesterFace]

What would kirk have done?

He would've beamed down, kissed the most beautiful woman on the planet (and maybe more?) and left just before the planet became inhabitable.

 

[JesterFace]

That episode was pretty ridiculous. Picard should have, and Kirk likely would have, just rendered the Boraalans all unconscious, and kept them in stasis, until they reached Vacca VI ad maximum warp.

There might be 2 reasons why Boraalans weren't placed in stasis.

1) Maybe there wasn't information about the Boraalan body, placing them in a standard stasis "field" might have killed them, so without more studying, there was no way to take the risk.

2) It would've made a boring episode.

 

[Captain Rob]

Beam them all up and stuff them in the Hangar Deck. How many cots do we think can fit in there.

 

[Tracy Trek]

What would Kirk have done in that situation? This: "What's the mission of this vessel, Doctor? To seek out and contact alien life, and an opportunity to demonstrate what our high-sounding words mean. Any questions?"

Kirk would've beamed as many aboard as he could, housed them where he could, (quarters, hangar deck, etc) and been straight up with them while taking them to a new world.


Unlike Picard who hid behind the Prime Directive and seemed annoyed that the rule had been broken. And this episode isn't an anomaly. Picard was also annoyed that Data had the gall to reply to the little alien girl who's world was in danger.

Picard was worried about all the changes said societies would go through by the Federation interfering with the natural course of things.

Kirk would be worried that lives were going to be lost and figured that any changes would be an acceptable price to pay for those peoples still being alive. I'm sure the natives would agree with him as well.

The Prime Directive was not meant to allow civilizations to die.

THANK YOU. This is exactly how I felt about this episode.

Another one I wanted to roll my eyes about Picard was "The Masterpiece Society". They helped the colony that practiced genetic engineering to create a perfect society, tried to help them keep their biodome from being destroyed by a stellar fragment. Some of them wanted to leave with the Enterprise. Picard says at the end something along the lines of "Did we cause as much damage as the stellar fragment"?

It's not my intention to insult people who like Picard, but these 2 episodes made me really not like him sometimes.

 

[T'Girl]

Beam them all up and stuff them in the Hangar Deck. How many cots do we think can fit in there.

Cots?

It might be a matter of how long it would take to get to the nearest class m planet with the refuges. If the journey wasn't going to take a extended period of time, and there was only going to be an opportunity for one trip, the best thing for the refuges might be to pack them in like cattle, sleep where they were standing, defecating in their clothes, no food, while the ship hauls ass for the destination.

A profoundly uncomfortable and horrifying experience that would save the maximum number of the species.

 

[Tracy Trek]

Now I'm not saying the crews should ignore the Prime Directive whenever they feel like it. In the film Into Darkness, Kirk is like "They saw us, big deal". But it was kind of a big deal because the natives were bowing down to an image of the Enterprise. And did you notice they tossed their sacred scroll on the ground. Kirk's actions supplanted a whole belief system. Yikes!

And then Janeway seemed to break the rule when it suited her, but brought the boom down on anyone else that did.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

In the film Into Darkness, Kirk is like "They saw us, big deal". But it was kind of a big deal because the natives were bowing down to an image of the Enterprise. And did you notice they tossed their sacred scroll on the ground. Kirk's actions supplanted a whole belief system. Yikes!

And in several thousand years the whole thing will be dismissed as a myth and be fodder for alien conspiracy guys.

 

[T'Girl]

Now I'm not saying the crews should ignore the Prime Directive whenever they feel like it.

Ship's captains should be trained to know when the prime directive applies and when it doesn't, and have the personal wisdom to know the difference. And should be invested by their superiors with the authority to make this level important decision.

In the film Into Darkness, Kirk is like "They saw us, big deal".

And then he manufactured a false report on the matter, which mean he knew he did something wrong.