What was your impression of Season 2 overall?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Lord Garth, May 20, 2019.

  1. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 7, 2011
    Location:
    Aug 10, 1999
    I thought it was a creeper heat. I loved Season 1 and didn't feel there was a need for a revamp but the further Season 2 went along, the more I liked it. This was probably more of a season for Saru than it was for Burnham.

    Saru grew into Command and shedding fear was both something that I thought was great for him but also kept me on my toes wondering if he'd do something too foolhardy without any type of fear holding him back.

    Burnham spent a lot of the season reacting to what was going on around her. She becomes more pro-active when she looks for Spock in "Light and Shadows" and really starts making things happen once she draws out her birth mother to rescue her in "The Red Angel".

    I was hoping for a better-matched rivalry between Leland and Georgiou on the Section 31 front. Control taking over Leland was the best thing that happened to him, from a dramatic standpoint.

    And Pike made for a great Anti-Lorca. He feels like his own Captain instead of just another Kirk. Nice touch bringing out his religious upbringing, from that line from "The Cage" about Pike being taught about Hell and then showing the illusion of him burning there. They didn't go as far with the religious angle as I thought they would but they did pursue faith. Now -- unless Pike is in a situation where he's saving cadets -- he has faith that no matter what situation he's in, he'll come out of it intact. That gives him a type of courage that others wouldn't have.

    At first I thought they cranked Tilly to an 11, and they did, but it became more understandable in retrospect once it was revealed that it was all because of the green spore and "May" reaching out to her.

    With Stamets and Culber, to be succinct, I'm glad they explored Culber feeling so disoriented both in the Mycellial Network and out of it, not understanding his sense of being any longer at all. He needed space and Stamets wasn't going to let him have that space since he was so glad he was back and wanted to be around him all the time. I thought both points of view made sense.

    Not too much on the Klingons. I figured that L'Rell would be challenged, so I'm glad someone tried to. And I'm glad that the Federation -- through Section 31 -- would want to do anything it can to make sure L'Rell stays in power. Had Discovery stayed in the 23rd Century, I would've expected the other shoe to drop eventually. I can't imagine L'Rell would still be Chancellor by the time of "Errand of Mercy" (TOS), when it looks like war might break out again.

    Spock seemed really frosty at first but I'm glad it didn't take long for he and Burnham to work through there differences because seeing them constantly be stand-offish to one another would've gotten old after a while since I didn't end up taking either of their sides, because I like them both.

    Tyler really grew into the role of being a Section 31 operative. He took to them hook, line, and sinker. Except he seems a little too sure of his convictions to be the Head of Section 31. That organization seems to almost demand you have a lot of moral flexibility. That isn't Tyler. And he's not a pragmatist. He seems like an odd duck for his position. Maybe Starfleet only wants him in charge of Section 31 so they have someone who'd think closer to them than someone like Leland or Sloan.

    Even though I wish we saw more of Number One, I think we saw the Enterprise just enough. If it were in every episode, it wouldn't have felt like special, like when it actually finally did make its reappearance. Kudos to the creative team for only revealing the Enterprise bit by bit instead of all at once.

    And nice to see Amanda take charge, standing up to Sarek, calling him out on his bullshit, and knowing how to put Burnham in her place when she wanted to search for Spock (pun intended).

    Cornwell, as far as I'm concerned, is Star Trek's best Admiral since Ross. She's right in the thick of things, knows when something is up, and can make the tough calls. What more could you want from an Admiral?
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
    A Dax, Uhura's Song, Gonzo and 5 others like this.
  2. NewHeavensNewEarth

    NewHeavensNewEarth Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2019
    I liked it for pretty much all the same reasons. I just wish, though, that they would've felt freer to not have to tie so many things directly to the RA. I felt like the Sphere episode was good because we saw Saru get through his vaharai while also deepening his connection to Burnham, and that was enough for me for the Sphere and everything connected to it. Obviously that didn't work because the Sphere turned out to be an essential component to the larger story, but there were some things I felt could've been left as they were, without the need for added tie-ins to the RA arc.

    But I felt like there was pretty good character development for a variety of folks, the action was fun, the actors were terrific, and I was so impatient for every new episode each week. I hope it doesn't get lost in all the Trekness that's to come, but I think the distant-future perspective will help it to stand out among the rest, along with being great on its own merits. Much love for Disco!
     
    A Dax and SJGardner like this.
  3. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2001
    Location:
    Land of Enchantment
    It started out fantastic, but the last third or so was a disaster. Felt like there was a clear lack of focus and leadership in the writers' room.


    Worse than season one, overall.
     
  4. donners22

    donners22 Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2001
    Location:
    Australia
    I like season 1 a little more; at least partly because it felt more focused. The latter half of S2 felt patched together.

    It had some outstanding stuff - Pike was a brilliant character, Spock worked much better than I thought he would, Sonja Sohn is up there with Trek's very best guests and there were some outstanding episodes (the trio of Light and Shadows, If Memory Serves and Project Daedalus in particular).

    I could have done with less Burnham; it's a great cast playing interesting characters, and I want to see them interact more. My main gripe was the ending - it felt like a clumsy and unnecessary pandering to haters.

    Still, I'd rate it above the second season of any other Trek series other than TOS, and will happily rewatch it all before S3 Here's hoping they can hold a showrunner for a full season.
     
    Markonian likes this.
  5. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    A type 13 planet in its final stage
    Loved it so much. They turned up the heat on the Sarek Family Drama™ I loved from S1, introduced a brilliant new version of Spock, and equally brilliant new Pike (and this from someone who loves Quinto and Greenwood's versions), came up with a plotline that kept us all guessing right up until the end. DSC's version of Section 31 was introduced as the SS of Starfleet, making "utopia" a lot more believable and Trek's world a lot more complex and interesting.

    Yes there was a little too much Michael-worship particularly at the end, but it felt much more earned than at the end of S1. The emotional moments for all the other characters were earned this time too. Best of all, it built to a thrilling conclusion when I was expecting another damp squib S1-style finale.

    It wasn't perfect, there were plot holes, but I now trust these people to deliver consistent high-quality entertainment. It's pretty much become what I wanted all along - Kelvin Trek: The Series. Looking forward to Picard, Disco S3's distant future Trekverse and whatever else they come up with.
     
    A Dax, Gonzo, Cyrus and 1 other person like this.
  6. SJGardner

    SJGardner Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    Location:
    In the center of Europe
    I overall loved it more than Season 1, and it seemed like the show's finally getting its own voice.

    Burnham's character development was built up really well, she emoted more than last year, and SMG's acting came off believably as someone who is opening up but still doesn't have a good grip on her feelings, something I've found very easy to relate to. It was a very good decision to have Spock facilitate her character development, as their scenes together were emotional high points of the season, even though the focus on their relationship ended up to the detriment of others in the main cast, mainly Saru, Stamets and Tilly.

    Looking at the whole season as a whole, it almost seems like as though Saru's and Tilly's arcs were squeezed entirely into the first half of the season so that we could have more time for Michael's experiences with Spock and her mother in the second half. So on the one hand we had some very strong Tilly- and Saru-centric episodes that were truly a highlight of both story and performance, but on the other hand, as soon as their arcs ended, they were rapidly compressed into their most defining characteristics to make room for Burnham. It was the most jarring with Tilly, whose role before the finale was mostly confined to one or two gaffes per episode and one complete non-appearance. Such Sweet Sorrow mostly made up for it though.

    This is also true for the finale in general, as it made up for a second half that was considerably rushed and chaotic, sometimes reminiscent of the latter half of Season 1. My only gripe with it is what many others found problematic, the whole decision to classify everything which was so drastic and excessive in-universe that it was very hard to interpret it as anything else than an attempt to placate the show's detractors.

    Another thing the season sadly repeated from last year was the continued instances of the foreshadowing and the build-up being more exciting and interesting than their conclusions which were more often than not quite underwhelming. It can be said of the Red Angel as a whole, but also Control being a keystone army linked to Robo!Leland and everything dying with him, or the blight on the Mycelial Network being Culber himself. There were many neat and interesting concepts and beautiful emotional scenes there that ultimately didn't fully pay off for me because I expected something more grandiose based on the build-up they got.

    But all things said, this was the best second season we've ever got on Star Trek, even though I admit it's not that high a bar to clear. Pike and Spock were great additions to the cast as well as the updated Enterprise which felt like coming home. I liked the Klingon stories and designs as well (even though I'm still mad at them changing the aesthetics of Boreth from the TNG matte painting's Tibet-esque to generic fairy-tale Gothic Renewal just so that they could shoot it at the University of Toronto).

    Funnily enough, I'll ultimately have to repeat what I've said at the end of the first season: the next one will make it or break it, even if the reasons are a bit different, given that we're getting a tabula rasa for next year. But based on this season, I'm enthusiastic, because weaknesses in the story arcs aside, we have a great cast with great characters, top notch design and production, and the episodes themselves were consistently exciting and enjoyable.
     
    Yanks and seigezunt like this.
  7. Cake

    Cake Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2010
    I didn't like season 1 but 2x01 and 2x02 were relative good and gave me hope that the series might improve. But then it went completely downhill again.
     
    Rasmussen and Jadeb like this.
  8. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    Fairly solid early on, fell off a cliff with "The Red Angel".

    Though it leans so heavily on TOS, it is tough to give it a fair grade in its own rite.

    EDIT: They really overplayed Burnham being the wind beneath Spock's wings. :lol:
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
  9. Rahul

    Rahul Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    First 2/3s: Fuckin' amazing! That's what "Star Trek" should be!

    Last 1/3: welp, they f-ed up their seasons' main storyline.

    Overall, through the entirety of the season, despite the one or other blunder, I felt they finally got a good grasp at what they wanted their show to be. And then the final five minutes with their big "we'll never talk about it ever again" kinda' soured me again, despite being overwhelmingly happy about how it went doing it's run.
     
    Gonzo, Rasmussen and Jadeb like this.
  10. seigezunt

    seigezunt Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Location:
    Raxacoricofallapatorius
    Season Two, while quite different than season one, elicited a similar reaction. Overall, I found it interesting to watch, and continued to surprise, though the surprises weren't quite nearly out of left field as much as the first season. Overall the season ended with me feeling pretty much the same kind of judgement: it's an exciting ride, with characters I love, but the plot ends up not nearly as deep as you think it's going to be. Much in the way that the MU reveal was a little disappointing, but then it got interesting and fun, in the second season the resolution leaving us in the far future is a disappointment, but I'm still curious to see what happens next.

    I also agree that a little too much of the plot ended up revolving around Burnham, or rather it required her intervention, but then she is the protagonist, so it's fair to expect that.

    I'm a TOS fan, so I'm going to eat up any TOS references. Anson Mount's Pike and Ethan Peck's Spock, and Rebecca Romijn's Number One, were all treasures in their own way. I will miss them, but this isn't their show.
     
    Rahul and Jadeb like this.
  11. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    I used to be that way. But Discovery overdid it to such a degree that I hope to never hear about TOS again on TV. And it is my favorite TV series ever.
     
    feek61 likes this.
  12. seigezunt

    seigezunt Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Location:
    Raxacoricofallapatorius
    Get ready for the Picard Show to do the same for TNG.
     
    Gonzo, King Daniel Beyond and BillJ like this.
  13. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    Yep. Of that I have no doubt.
     
  14. Jadeb

    Jadeb Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2017
    Much improved over the first season, though they again stumbled hard with the ending. I kinda wish they'd drop the season-long arcs if they can't make them work. The show could still be serialized, only without a huge, universe-shattering threat that is doomed to disappoint.

    That said, Pike was pretty terrific, and the first half of the season was good fun. I can envision myself watching some of these stories again, while I'll probably never rewatch anything from season one. So a big step up, I'd say.
     
    Cyrus likes this.
  15. Rahul

    Rahul Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    I think the main problem with the seasons' main arcs (both season 1 and 2) was that they tried to be epic.

    Star Trek isn't "epic". Star Trek is kinda' dorky. That's a strength.
    Superhero stories and other blockbusters have trained Hollywood writers and producers to think that ever major arc has to involve the end of the world, or at least the future of humankind or all living being. But that is not needed.

    I generally really like the format of having a larger season arc, and smaller "side-plots" as episodes-of-the-week. But - as the first half of this season showed - a mere simply mystery is really only as grand as they needed to go. We were hooked on the red angel arc before it was revealed to be a fight for all living being. It could have stayed a single, simple time-paradoxon, that needed to be solved, otherwise the timeline would get funky. That's really all there is.

    But then - even Doctor Who started out doing the same - every season involving the end of the universe - and they found out: they don't need to do this anymore. A smaller, simpler, more streamlined plot (that in the past might have been a two-parter) is entirely sufficient for a season long arc.
     
    Rainard Fox, urbandk and seigezunt like this.
  16. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Location:
    Christopher Pike, future Orion Pirate
    It was very entertaining. The scripts needed polishing, though.

    Kor
     
    Delta Vega and seigezunt like this.
  17. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2017
    Location:
    jippers on a beach somewhere
    Sometimes an end-of-everything plot works very well, but those are very rare times. Interstellar works as well as it does because there's a mix of everything on the line while at the same time bringing it down to the very personal.

    In the "no time for caution" docking sequence, yes the fate of humanity hinges on the shuttle docking to whats left of Endurance, but you're in the mind of Coop and he's thinking about getting back to his family or at least saving them.

    It doesnt work for Doctor Who because that character has so many ties to so many people (and lets go of them drop of a hat, eh Susan?) that you really can't get in his head. Not being able to get into his or her head is the shtick. They've threatened the universe so many times, no one gives a shit. Between that and giant monster underneath something in Victorian england, the idea bag is empty. I don't know why Star Trek wants to rummage in that bag. Doctor Who ate all the good Doritos long ago, and there are no intact triangular doritos left in it, just some fractured remains and orange dust. I should not reply when i am hungry.

    Having said all that, I completely enjoyed season 2 and its one of the stronger Star Trek seasons. But going forward they need to put a capstone on that well they'be been drinking from. No more Michael-specific arcs for awhile. We know everything about her but her toenail fungus count now, no doubt the most interesting thing in the universe. And while she's interesting, she's in an entire crew of interesting people and therefore she's not THAT compelling.

    They could also avoid convoluted plots. A series of long arcs is fine but keep it character based. Rome managed to do that so well but concentrating on the day to day bits of living as much as the broader picture. Discovery seldom takes enough time to slow down to build up that level of involvement, and it needs to, badly. They tried a bit in this season, bits around the mess hall, and showing that Ariam had a social life. But the latter was tacked on as a "yeah, she's about to go" foreboding. Don't sell life insurance to a character that suddenly gets a retrospective for the first time.

    Would have been great to have that previously. but they would have had to slow down a bit to do that. Seriously, slow down.
     
    Gonzo and Jadeb like this.
  18. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    I'm hoping Discovery season three thinks smaller where the stakes are concerned.
     
  19. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    A type 13 planet in its final stage
    Rebuilding the Federation is a pretty big deal.

    Just sayin'.:shrug:
     
  20. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    Will probably toss in a time traveling Spock as well to give Burnham more pep talks, knowing these writers. :eek: